Thermal Expansion 3.0!!! No More Beta! Thanks KL!

[Golrith]

Anyone else having issues with Itemducts? Still have not been able to resolve the problem.

Server only, any duct placed in world by any player crashes the server.
Single player, ducts can be placed just fine.
A new world on the server results in the same crash.
Liquiducts and Conduits are fine.

Crash report: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/46396473/OmegaDawn/crash-2013-12-14_20.51.50-server.txt

 

[Greevir]

Anyone else having issues with Itemducts? Still have not been able to resolve the problem.

Server only, any duct placed in world by any player crashes the server.
Single player, ducts can be placed just fine.
A new world on the server results in the same crash.
Liquiducts and Conduits are fine.

Crash report: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/46396473/OmegaDawn/crash-2013-12-14_20.51.50-server.txt

If you're using b9, you need to downgrade it back to b8. B9 is no good on servers atm.

 

[arthahar]

b9 big step back in stability. If someone have not updated yet world from TE3 b8 to TE3 b9 then better wait next beta update. Single player worlds also less stable specially if use new covers support.

 

[PsionicArchon]

Alright, I'm straining to make certain that this doesn't come across as disrespectful. I posted a similar comment on a Direwolf20 video and, was subsequently ripped apart by it. I mean ABSOLUTELY no disrespect to KingLemming as I thoroughly love Thermal Expansion. Now that that's out of the way.

Aren't the new versions of Thermal Expansion tested on Forgecraft before being pushed to the rest of us? This process is designed to insure that the end user doesn't receive a buggy build. I feel like this isn't the case for many forge mods whom simply use the server as a popularity playground. Either way, I'll probably risk some additional cpu usage on my server in favor of not having to remove hundreds of conduits only to find out that I shouldn't have done that in the first place because, welp, the build I downloaded wasn't even tested in multiplayer.

Hopefully a lesson has been learned here and, all future builds will be properly tested before being released for download. By proper I mean, beyond three seconds of testing. I'll wait a month for a release in favor of spending several hours error checking.

 

[NJM1564]

Alright, I'm straining to make certain that this doesn't come across as disrespectful. I posted a similar comment on a Direwolf20 video and, was subsequently ripped apart by it. I mean ABSOLUTELY no disrespect to KingLemming as I thoroughly love Thermal Expansion. Now that that's out of the way.

Aren't the new versions of Thermal Expansion tested on Forgecraft before being pushed to the rest of us? This process is designed to insure that the end user doesn't receive a buggy build. I feel like this isn't the case for many forge mods whom simply use the server as a popularity playground. Either way, I'll probably risk some additional cpu usage on my server in favor of not having to remove hundreds of conduits only to find out that I shouldn't have done that in the first place because, welp, the build I downloaded wasn't even tested in multiplayer.

Hopefully a lesson has been learned here and, all future builds will be properly tested before being released for download. By proper I mean, beyond three seconds of testing. I'll wait a month for a release in favor of spending several hours error checking.

Beta testing is NEVER perfect. The FC servers are there to get rid of bugs alright. But only the ones they can find. And if b9 was only a minor update it might not have even gotten to the FC server.
FC seems mostly to be there for testing new systems not minor code changes. And it only updates so often. Sometimes we get even a major new version of a mod before they even get there hands on it.

Edit: I'll reaffirm all the fallowing posts. The b in the version name means beta. Or more realistically it could stand for bugish. You don't want the bugs don't use it.

 

[Greevir]

Alright, I'm straining to make certain that this doesn't come across as disrespectful. I posted a similar comment on a Direwolf20 video and, was subsequently ripped apart by it. I mean ABSOLUTELY no disrespect to KingLemming as I thoroughly love Thermal Expansion. Now that that's out of the way.

Aren't the new versions of Thermal Expansion tested on Forgecraft before being pushed to the rest of us? This process is designed to insure that the end user doesn't receive a buggy build. I feel like this isn't the case for many forge mods whom simply use the server as a popularity playground. Either way, I'll probably risk some additional cpu usage on my server in favor of not having to remove hundreds of conduits only to find out that I shouldn't have done that in the first place because, welp, the build I downloaded wasn't even tested in multiplayer.

Hopefully a lesson has been learned here and, all future builds will be properly tested before being released for download. By proper I mean, beyond three seconds of testing. I'll wait a month for a release in favor of spending several hours error checking.

TE has NOT been pushed on you. And it is posted clearly on the download page that this is a BETA and to USE AT YOUR OWN RISK! Now, if you downloaded it from elsewhere, thats a whole different story and something you probably shouldn't do. And not every build is thrown up on the FC server.

 

[Hoff]

Alright, I'm straining to make certain that this doesn't come across as disrespectful. I posted a similar comment on a Direwolf20 video and, was subsequently ripped apart by it. I mean ABSOLUTELY no disrespect to KingLemming as I thoroughly love Thermal Expansion. Now that that's out of the way.

Aren't the new versions of Thermal Expansion tested on Forgecraft before being pushed to the rest of us? This process is designed to insure that the end user doesn't receive a buggy build. I feel like this isn't the case for many forge mods whom simply use the server as a popularity playground. Either way, I'll probably risk some additional cpu usage on my server in favor of not having to remove hundreds of conduits only to find out that I shouldn't have done that in the first place because, welp, the build I downloaded wasn't even tested in multiplayer.

Hopefully a lesson has been learned here and, all future builds will be properly tested before being released for download. By proper I mean, beyond three seconds of testing. I'll wait a month for a release in favor of spending several hours error checking.

It's called the bleeding edge for a reason. When using a beta you always run the risk of issues as such. The reason it's open beta is to find errors they cannot. I understand what you're trying to convey but at the same time it is far faster to get testing results from an open beta than it is from a handful of people on a private server which requires other people who are not always on to update accordingly.

 

[tedyhere]

so I managed to get it fixed in a singleplayer world but after editing the server config too and restarting it, it still shows oil... welp, I guess I need to do a world reset?

Came in late sorry, but are you using Binnies Extra Trees and Bees by chance? Because his mod is currently bugged with fluid registry and has a tendency to shift fluid ID's around :/

 

[PsionicArchon]

It's called the bleeding edge for a reason. When using a beta you always run the risk of issues as such. The reason it's open beta is to find errors they cannot. I understand what you're trying to convey but at the same time it is far faster to get testing results from an open beta than it is from a handful of people on a private server which requires other people who are not always on to update accordingly.

I tried to use an item conduit, crashed. I placed a liquiduct, crashed. You'll have to excuse me if I expect that kind of stuff to be worked on before a release. Total time of identification, three seconds minus the install time of dragging the mod into my game folder. I understand the beta process and, it makes sense for more difficult to identify bugs. Speaking of those bugs, as I'm no longer basing any of my builds entirely upon conduits until the full release thanks to this, I probably won't have many contributing bug reports.

EDIT: Nope. Not on my watch.

 

[NJM1564]

The only thing they have to do before a release is make sure it can actually load without crashing everyones computer. That's alpha testing. After that it's closed beta testing. Seeing if it works on most peoples computers. IE there in house testers. And that most systems work in isolation. Then there is the public beta. It's for testing configurations. Tests with other packs and all the unique ways a player might build. You're complaining that one pipe is causing the crash. Out of thousands. Do you really think they could find that one pipe by random testing with only a dozen or so people.

 

[Flipz]

Really, guys? You're going to make me have to drop a Be Nice on another TE-related thread? Son, I am disappoint.

I'll repeat a bit of advice I recently gave another topic: when you start aiming arguments at people instead of ideas, you're in dicey territory [read: on the verge of getting the topic locked].​

 

[Hoff]

I tried to use an item conduit, crashed. I placed a liquiduct, crashed. You'll have to excuse me if I expect that kind of stuff to be worked on before a release. Total time of identification, three seconds minus the install time of dragging the mod into my game folder. I understand the beta process and, it makes sense for more difficult to identify bugs. Speaking of those bugs, as I'm no longer basing any of my builds entirely upon conduits until the full release thanks to this, I probably won't have many contributing bug reports.

It is thanks to what you're doing right now.

 

[Vaygrim]

Passing curiosity about potential sources of information regarding what neato things are in "Redstone Arsenal"? I realize that TeamCoFH is busy actually coding and debugging, so I wouldn't want to bug them for Wiki updates just yet. I was just wondering if there were any other folks out there that had screenshots or details on it they would be willing to show off?

 

[VapourDrive]

I have a feeling that redstone arsenal may be one of those things that is most fun to install and discover the awesomeness yourself (that's what i am planning on doing anyhow...)
As for releases without testers, the team have done a lot of work on testing (just to clear doubt), politely sharing crashes and reporting bugs is the way to go, but otherwise... yes betas are technically for beta-testers .
Hopefully everyone else loves the new FMP compat and streamlined NEI compat!

 

[Zenthon_127]

Ok, I just tested Redstone Arsenal. Every tool is made with obsidian sticks that cost 2 Fluxed Diamonds EACH. So quite expensive (2-4 diamonds per tool), albeit insanely powerful. All of them but the wrench have power-up modes (defaults to V and has a lightning sound effect, which as you will see is quite appropriate) that are just beyond insane. They're all enchantable btw, so pull out your OpenBlocks/Liquid XP/Thaumic Tinker setup. Here's the full list:

• The cheapest tool is the Omniwrench. Yes, you heard me. The OMNIWRENCH. It costs energy now, but who cares?
• The Fluxed Sword does a lot of damage and I think it partially ignores armor. I think it might be legitimately more powerful then a maxed TiC sword.
• The Fluxed BattleWrench is the same as the sword, but slightly less powerful.
• The Fluxed Pick is where we start to get into the crazy stuff. This freakish monstrosity (with enchants) mines faster than anything except an Efficiency V Blood Magic Bound Pick (the latter is on par with the EE2 Red Morning Star). In powerup mode it also mines the block above and below the one you target.
• The Fluxed Axe has equal speed to the pick, and it also mines 3 blocks at once in power-up mode. Forests evaporate.
• The Fluxed Shovel is one of the fastest mining tools Minecraft has ever seen (on dirt, at least). In power-up mode it mines 5 blocks outwards from you I believe, and matches the pick in speed. Youch.
• Finally, the Fluxed Sickle has a mediocre radius in normal mode, but a above-average range in powered mode.

Keep in mind that the RF usage for these things is extremely high and I was testing with Efficiency 5, but still these things are second to only the Blood Magic tools, which can destroy entire bases with single clicks.

 

[King Lemming]

Alright, I'm straining to make certain that this doesn't come across as disrespectful. I posted a similar comment on a Direwolf20 video and, was subsequently ripped apart by it. I mean ABSOLUTELY no disrespect to KingLemming as I thoroughly love Thermal Expansion. Now that that's out of the way.

Aren't the new versions of Thermal Expansion tested on Forgecraft before being pushed to the rest of us? This process is designed to insure that the end user doesn't receive a buggy build. I feel like this isn't the case for many forge mods whom simply use the server as a popularity playground. Either way, I'll probably risk some additional cpu usage on my server in favor of not having to remove hundreds of conduits only to find out that I shouldn't have done that in the first place because, welp, the build I downloaded wasn't even tested in multiplayer.

Hopefully a lesson has been learned here and, all future builds will be properly tested before being released for download. By proper I mean, beyond three seconds of testing. I'll wait a month for a release in favor of spending several hours error checking.

Pre-EDIT: Missed your first quote there. The builds were actually tested over the course of quite a few hours, it was a pretty ridiculous thing that happened to bite us with something post-recompile. Anyways, this one was not tested on FC because getting a new build onto FC can be a chore. I typically don't use FC2 as a testing ground. In fact, throughout all of open beta, FC has been late to the party.

I tried to use an item conduit, crashed. I placed a liquiduct, crashed. You'll have to excuse me if I expect that kind of stuff to be worked on before a release. Total time of identification, three seconds minus the install time of dragging the mod into my game folder. I understand the beta process and, it makes sense for more difficult to identify bugs. Speaking of those bugs, as I'm no longer basing any of my builds entirely upon conduits until the full release thanks to this, I probably won't have many contributing bug reports.

EDIT: Nope. Not on my watch.

Believe it or not, it was working SMP. There's an issue with it in that some @SidedAccess things which work in dev did not work when carried over post-compile.

So, very sorry for the issues. It actually went through quite a bit of testing, although oddly enough the specific issues there just didn't show up due to what was happening on the dev platform vs the post-compile. The post-compiles were launched on a a single player, yes. Why? Because that has never happened before, ever. These are some ridiculous corner case errors, as "obvious" as they might seem.

But no, I'm not crazy about how it went down. Sorry.

Ok, I just tested Redstone Arsenal. Every tool is made with obsidian sticks that cost 2 Fluxed Diamonds EACH. So quite expensive (2-4 diamonds per tool), albeit insanely powerful. All of them but the wrench have power-up modes (defaults to V and has a lightning sound effect, which as you will see is quite appropriate) that are just beyond insane. They're all enchantable btw, so pull out your OpenBlocks/Liquid XP/Thaumic Tinker setup. Here's the full list:

• The cheapest tool is the Omniwrench. Yes, you heard me. The OMNIWRENCH. It costs energy now, but who cares?
• The Fluxed Sword does a lot of damage and I think it partially ignores armor. I think it might be legitimately more powerful then a maxed TiC sword.
• The Fluxed BattleWrench is the same as the sword, but slightly less powerful.
• The Fluxed Pick is where we start to get into the crazy stuff. This freakish monstrosity (with enchants) mines faster than anything except an Efficiency V Blood Magic Bound Pick (the latter is on par with the EE2 Red Morning Star). In powerup mode it also mines the block above and below the one you target.
• The Fluxed Axe has equal speed to the pick, and it also mines 3 blocks at once in power-up mode. Forests evaporate.
• The Fluxed Shovel is one of the fastest mining tools Minecraft has ever seen (on dirt, at least). In power-up mode it mines 5 blocks outwards from you I believe, and matches the pick in speed. Youch.
• Finally, the Fluxed Sickle has a mediocre radius in normal mode, but a above-average range in powered mode.

Keep in mind that the RF usage for these things is extremely high and I was testing with Efficiency 5, but still these things are second to only the Blood Magic tools, which can destroy entire bases with single clicks.

Efficiency V? Yes, they are going to be monstrous. They're also not *necessarily* finished. They may definitely catch some small tweaks, but they are indeed meant to be fun.

I do hope you enjoy them though!

 

[PsionicArchon]

Well that's a darn shame. You guys need to edjumicate Direwolf, he's stated at least a handful of times that Forgecraft is used as a testing environment. I had no idea it was so difficult to push anything to the Forgecraft server, that's really quite a shame.

Either or, it's no big deal. I never intended for it to become 'such a big deal' and, I'm glad at least you understood that. There was no maliciousness intended, I wasn't suggesting that you go out of your way generating additional work for yourself or what ever other crazy things went running through everyone's minds the instant they saw my post.

Now, onto the useful bits. I've done some tinkering in single player, multiplayer and, on mcpc+ (my main server). So far, you've done a splendid job of picking up the pieces both in releasing so timely a fix and, in interpreting my posts as I intended for them to be. I'm gradually restoring a rather large piping network of over several hundred conduits/liquiducts/itemducts. If anything should crop up I'll let you know.

The only thing I've noticed thus far is that there's a bit of a delay in pipes connecting to one another after they've been placed. This is on the mcpc+ server.

 

[Sam Cooper]

Just a little post to say thank you for all the hard work done by KL and team CoFH on TE! I really hope that you see how excited people are and how much pleasure we are getting out of your mod. It really is a massive step up from TE2 in terms of completeness.

I think posts like above are only because you guys have set the bar so high. That's also a compliment....

 

[King Lemming]

Well that's a darn shame. You guys need to edjumicate Direwolf, he's stated at least a handful of times that Forgecraft is used as a testing environment. I had no idea it was so difficult to push anything to the Forgecraft server, that's really quite a shame.

Either or, it's no big deal. I never intended for it to become 'such a big deal' and, I'm glad at least you understood that. There was no maliciousness intended, I wasn't suggesting that you go out of your way generating additional work for yourself or what ever other crazy things went running through everyone's minds the instant they saw my post.

Now, onto the useful bits. I've done some tinkering in single player, multiplayer and, on mcpc+ (my main server). So far, you've done a splendid job of picking up the pieces both in releasing so timely a fix and, in interpreting my posts as I intended for them to be. I'm gradually restoring a rather large piping network of over several hundred conduits/liquiducts/itemducts. If anything should crop up I'll let you know.

The only thing I've noticed thus far is that there's a bit of a delay in pipes connecting to one another after they've been placed. This is on the mcpc+ server.

Well, I better clarify that - getting ahold of a server admin to restart the server and apply the configs, etc. can be difficult. And the timing just didn't quite line up. FC *is* a testing ground, but people play on it too. In particular, Redstone Arsenal being an entirely new mod would need configs to be set and vetted, which takes a bit of time as well. I don't want to sound like it's really that bad. I keep DW in the loop with builds, but I imagine he just kind of plays some SSP to get an idea of how the stuff will work.

As far as your post - you were in the right. I was pretty upset with how the whole thing went down myself; yelled at people more than I should have, including myself. Bit of an odd conversation there, but ehh. I know you weren't trying to be mean there at all, but it's completely fair to call us out on that particular piece of work.

There are a few issues that we're sorting out for b9b, but they're basically all related to some conduit integration issues at this point; so I'm really hoping we get through this phase quickly.

 

[Golrith]

Keep up the good work KL and team. I was surprised myself at the problems with this build knowing how much you value testing and optimised code.


I've put my tech plans on hold due to this hiccup, and started diving into some magic mods. There's always something to be gained, even if things go wrong!