Draconic Armor is broken OP

[rouge_bare]

Warp is honestly one of those things that's actually very helpful at low levels for free research points, it's only later on it's actually dangerous (but there's nothing that kills you outright (except maybe a gaurdain spawn when you have no armor and nowhere to hide), that you cannot prepare for) as mentioned, it also goes away on its own. It's a very unique balancing mechanic. You can indeed disable it as well (or use op commands to cheatily remove it).

 

[RedBoss]

I don't find the effects more than a slight inconvenience, especially since their frequency decreases over time as long as you don't add more warp. The worst is Unnatural Hunger, but I've made myself a Healing Axe from XU for those times.

I find it very annoying personally. I don't know if the sun shift thing still happens, but I am prone to migraines and that gave me a doozy when I first saw it. Any change in my POV is flat out annoying. I find it to be a punishment for using the mod and its turned me against using it.

 

[malicious_bloke]

The only thing warp ever did that irked me was "temporary" blindness that lasted until I relogged.

But that i'm pretty sure was a bug...

 

[Lethosos]

Am I the only one amused by the chance to poop flux on occasion?

Sent from my SGH-T769 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Ieldra]

I find it very annoying personally. I don't know if the sun shift thing still happens, but I am prone to migraines and that gave me a doozy when I first saw it. Any change in my POV is flat out annoying. I find it to be a punishment for using the mod and its turned me against using it.

I understand your personal dislike, but it's not a punishment. It's a story element, based on the idea that some knowledge and practices resulting from having it are detrimental to your mental health. I have my own problem with this Lovecraftian way of thinking but it works rather well in the context. Taint, on the other hand....I hate taint with a passion. It has destroyed several extremely beautiful places I wanted to build on, and if you keep the taint spread at its default value its impossible to contain.

 

[RedBoss]

I understand your personal dislike, but it's not a punishment. It's a story element, based on the idea that some knowledge and practices resulting from having it are detrimental to your mental health. I have my own problem with this Lovecraftian way of thinking but it works rather well in the context. Taint, on the other hand....I hate taint with a passion. It has destroyed several extremely beautiful places I wanted to build on, and if you keep the taint spread at its default value its impossible to contain.

We'll agree to disagree. Permanent debuffs that affect visibility are a punishment absolutely. Taint is fine with me.

 

[mathchamp]

Back on the topic of balance and Draconic Armor (this thread is a bit old but still relevant), there are a few basic things that can be noted for modded Minecraft:

• Usually, a single mod or small group of related mods, on their own, can be rather easily balanced. As more mods are added, it becomes more difficult to ensure that these mods are balanced against each other. In a kitchen sink pack it is essentially impossible - every mod would require extensive configurability.
• Different mods have different power curves. Some allow players to grow in power quickly but have have weaker endgames. Others require heavy investment but have a higher power cap. Still others, arguably including Draconic Evolution, permit both quick growth and a high cap, and thus in a large modpack players will tend to see these mods as being overpowered as they overshadow other mods.
• PvE-oriented mods will result in imbalance when they exist in a PvP-oriented environment.

While invincible armor can be nice for some (you can laugh in the faces of all the mobs as they try to kill you), I think that it would be more interesting if it were at least remotely possible to die. This is particularly necessary for PvP to work, which is likely the reason the rapier was invented for armor piercing. And then DE comes along and adds armor that block armor piercing. Are we next going to have a weapon that bypasses the DE anti-piercing? And then some new armor comes along that blocks that? You basically end up with an arms' race between mods.

A couple of examples of "invincible" armor:

• GraviChestPlate + QuantumSuit: Invincible to most damage types, including melee, projectile, blast, fire, and fall damage, and also blocks poison and wither (not sure about instant damage), but is still countered by things like Nano Saber, Rapier, and Gelid. Quantum also runs out of EU quickly in a sustained heavy beating.
• Draconic: Similar to the above but without weaknesses and the energy goes much further from what I have heard.

If I were in charge of balancing DE, I'd probably do the following:

• Remove or reduce the blocking of armor-piercing damage or other damage types that aren't supposed to be mitigated by armor.
• Bump up RF cost of using the armor. Perhaps instead of 10 million RF per piece, it should be closer to 10 billion RF, with usage scaled proportionately, so there's actually a point to making the highest-tier DE RF storage other than for bragging rights, and you'd then also need real endgame RF infrastructure (although then you run into the problem that players would require mods like Big Reactors to be able to use the armor - perhaps RF cost should be configurable so packs that allow large RF generation can have higher RF costs).

I think the overall root problem, besides the fact that multiple mods are unlikely to balance against one another, is that the combat mechanics are inherently simplistic, and while a few mods try to add to it (such as how TiC adds rapiers that bypass armor, or how Thaumcraft has runic shielding as an alternative/supplement to armor), most mods do little more than add weapons that do various amounts of damage or armor that blocks various percentages of damage from all common attack types, basically using the same mechanics from Vanilla. Personally I think some type of rock-paper-scissors gameplay where no single weapon or armor is objectively superior in most or all situations, whether in PvP or in PvE, would be an improvement over the current one-thing-is-the-best-and-everyone-shall-use-it balance that appears a lot. Including tradeoffs would make things more interesting and dynamic.


One idea would be to expand the damage-typing system that Minecraft already has, and perhaps additionally add some sort of "penetration" attribute to all damage as a measure of the ability of damage to punch through armor. Armor would then take the amount, type, and penetration value of a damaging blow and decide what should happen (percentage of damage blocked, durability/energy used, and other effects - it would be up to modders to make sure their armor doesn't simply block everything). The vanilla damage classes (e.g. melee, projectile, explosion, fire, falling, magic, void) would be used as a base and other mods could add their own damage types. Mods would then have to be able to alias their damage types to other types for cross-mod compatibility - so if another mod doesn't know about the added damage type it can treat it as a vanilla type or some other mod's type. For example, if Thaumcraft were to add a "Thaumic" damage type, it could specify the damage to be treated as vanilla's "Magic" damage by any armor that does not recognize "Thaumic" damage specifically.

Additionally, there should be an ability to deal "combined" damage where a weapon can specify that it does multiple types of damage together (e.g. 2 hearts of melee and 2 hearts of magic). The armor would then calculate how much of each type is blocked, add the unblocked damage up, and subtract it from the entity's health. This would allow multiple damages to be summed without the 0.5 second invulnerability interfering.

A more complex version could split damage classes into both a type (melee, projectile, blast, etc.) and element (normal, fire, lightning, magic, etc.).

By having the many different mods specify weapons with various types of damage, along with specifying how armor should block all types of damage individually, it would be possible to create a more dynamic combat environment (both for PvP and PvE) where no single option is best and adaptability becomes a powerful advantage - if you can select your equipment based on what the opponent is using, you can gain an advantage, but you must watch that your opponent does not see what equipment you have and adapt similarly. It would encourage players to try a variety of mods and build up various progression trees to expand their options for the various situations that they might run into. Perhaps the Quantum Suit would block all physical damage but magic would go straight through, and enchanting would not be allowed, leaving an opening to exploit. Or alternatively, magic would be blocked but take a very large chunk out of the EU, thus a few potions of harm and their armor is rendered inoperative. Vanilla armor would block a percentage of physical damage but the amount blocked would be reduced proportionately based on penetration. A mod could add an alternative armor that would be poorer at blocking general damage but be less affected by penetration. One would wear that armor against rapier users, and said opponents could respond by switching to a different sword. Another mod could add an armor that blocks nearly all damage but has a limited "shield capacity" of a couple hundred points or less that it can cumulatively block, after which it blocks nothing, and the shield would start regenerating if no damage were taken for a few seconds. Yet another mod could add an armor that blocks nearly all damage but becomes less effective when multiple consecutive blows are taken, allowing players to deal heavy damage by landing a string of hits and requiring the player using the armor to adjust their tactics to avoid taking multiple hits in a short window.

Note that a bunch of the above examples could probably be done without adding any fundamental mechanics, although I'm not completely sure since I don't know exactly how damage/armor works at the code level.

Note that it would still be very difficult to balance, since if any weapon or piece of armor stands out in any way, players will probably gravitate towards it. If one piece of armor is still much better despite specific weaknesses, most likely you will see both that piece of armor and the weapon that beats it as popular items - perhaps with an alternative armor that resists said weapon being used a bit as well and with everything else being niche items. Or if one weapon is much better than everything else, you're going to see everyone wear the armor that resists it even if the other types of armor are just as good or even somewhat better overall. Expanding the combat system to allow for more variety opens a path to improving the balance of the modded experience to an extent, but does not guarantee such balance, especially as the fundamental balance issue that all the mods are being made almost completely independently from one another (asides from specific interactions) will still exist regardless of what is done at a base level.

 

[Psychicash]

If you are arguing that rapiers are balanced, you only need to look at how many people use them for pvp. With enough sharpness you can 1 hit anyone wearing all but the highest tiers of armor, assuming no extra health,or potions on either side. At that point, pvp becomes, who can one hit who first?

I don't partically go much on pvp in modded minecraft, as it's generally a near-unbalancable mess. Either you have armor that makes you nigh-untouchable, or weapons that make most armor completely pointless (at least in a pure pvp-persepective). Pick your poision.

A few posts claim 1 heart of damage... I was wearing full draconic gear and ever hit I recieved took about 8 hearts of damage. They were using a maxed out rapier. Thank god for rod of travelling. Now the awakened armor prob only does a heart. They had awakened armor and I used Excalibur on them. It kept them at bay but did no damage at all. Yeah a little over powered. I don't think that tinker's should be able to completely bypass the armor when things like that can't. However that's from a players perspective. It's hard to code these things and make them interact well with each other when everything is piece meal.

Back on the topic of balance and Draconic Armor (this thread is a bit old but still relevant), there are a few basic things that can be noted for modded Minecraft:

• Usually, a single mod or small group of related mods, on their own, can be rather easily balanced. As more mods are added, it becomes more difficult to ensure that these mods are balanced against each other. In a kitchen sink pack it is essentially impossible - every mod would require extensive configurability.
• Different mods have different power curves. Some allow players to grow in power quickly but have have weaker endgames. Others require heavy investment but have a higher power cap. Still others, arguably including Draconic Evolution, permit both quick growth and a high cap, and thus in a large modpack players will tend to see these mods as being overpowered as they overshadow other mods.
• PvE-oriented mods will result in imbalance when they exist in a PvP-oriented environment.

While invincible armor can be nice for some (you can laugh in the faces of all the mobs as they try to kill you), I think that it would be more interesting if it were at least remotely possible to die. This is particularly necessary for PvP to work, which is likely the reason the rapier was invented for armor piercing. And then DE comes along and adds armor that block armor piercing. Are we next going to have a weapon that bypasses the DE anti-piercing? And then some new armor comes along that blocks that? You basically end up with an arms' race between mods.

A couple of examples of "invincible" armor:

• GraviChestPlate + QuantumSuit: Invincible to most damage types, including melee, projectile, blast, fire, and fall damage, and also blocks poison and wither (not sure about instant damage), but is still countered by things like Nano Saber, Rapier, and Gelid. Quantum also runs out of EU quickly in a sustained heavy beating.
• Draconic: Similar to the above but without weaknesses and the energy goes much further from what I have heard.

If I were in charge of balancing DE, I'd probably do the following:

• Remove or reduce the blocking of armor-piercing damage or other damage types that aren't supposed to be mitigated by armor.
• Bump up RF cost of using the armor. Perhaps instead of 10 million RF per piece, it should be closer to 10 billion RF, with usage scaled proportionately, so there's actually a point to making the highest-tier DE RF storage other than for bragging rights, and you'd then also need real endgame RF infrastructure (although then you run into the problem that players would require mods like Big Reactors to be able to use the armor - perhaps RF cost should be configurable so packs that allow large RF generation can have higher RF costs).

I think the overall root problem, besides the fact that multiple mods are unlikely to balance against one another, is that the combat mechanics are inherently simplistic, and while a few mods try to add to it (such as how TiC adds rapiers that bypass armor, or how Thaumcraft has runic shielding as an alternative/supplement to armor), most mods do little more than add weapons that do various amounts of damage or armor that blocks various percentages of damage from all common attack types, basically using the same mechanics from Vanilla. Personally I think some type of rock-paper-scissors gameplay where no single weapon or armor is objectively superior in most or all situations, whether in PvP or in PvE, would be an improvement over the current one-thing-is-the-best-and-everyone-shall-use-it balance that appears a lot. Including tradeoffs would make things more interesting and dynamic.


One idea would be to expand the damage-typing system that Minecraft already has, and perhaps additionally add some sort of "penetration" attribute to all damage as a measure of the ability of damage to punch through armor. Armor would then take the amount, type, and penetration value of a damaging blow and decide what should happen (percentage of damage blocked, durability/energy used, and other effects - it would be up to modders to make sure their armor doesn't simply block everything). The vanilla damage classes (e.g. melee, projectile, explosion, fire, falling, magic, void) would be used as a base and other mods could add their own damage types. Mods would then have to be able to alias their damage types to other types for cross-mod compatibility - so if another mod doesn't know about the added damage type it can treat it as a vanilla type or some other mod's type. For example, if Thaumcraft were to add a "Thaumic" damage type, it could specify the damage to be treated as vanilla's "Magic" damage by any armor that does not recognize "Thaumic" damage specifically.

Additionally, there should be an ability to deal "combined" damage where a weapon can specify that it does multiple types of damage together (e.g. 2 hearts of melee and 2 hearts of magic). The armor would then calculate how much of each type is blocked, add the unblocked damage up, and subtract it from the entity's health. This would allow multiple damages to be summed without the 0.5 second invulnerability interfering.

A more complex version could split damage classes into both a type (melee, projectile, blast, etc.) and element (normal, fire, lightning, magic, etc.).

By having the many different mods specify weapons with various types of damage, along with specifying how armor should block all types of damage individually, it would be possible to create a more dynamic combat environment (both for PvP and PvE) where no single option is best and adaptability becomes a powerful advantage - if you can select your equipment based on what the opponent is using, you can gain an advantage, but you must watch that your opponent does not see what equipment you have and adapt similarly. It would encourage players to try a variety of mods and build up various progression trees to expand their options for the various situations that they might run into. Perhaps the Quantum Suit would block all physical damage but magic would go straight through, and enchanting would not be allowed, leaving an opening to exploit. Or alternatively, magic would be blocked but take a very large chunk out of the EU, thus a few potions of harm and their armor is rendered inoperative. Vanilla armor would block a percentage of physical damage but the amount blocked would be reduced proportionately based on penetration. A mod could add an alternative armor that would be poorer at blocking general damage but be less affected by penetration. One would wear that armor against rapier users, and said opponents could respond by switching to a different sword. Another mod could add an armor that blocks nearly all damage but has a limited "shield capacity" of a couple hundred points or less that it can cumulatively block, after which it blocks nothing, and the shield would start regenerating if no damage were taken for a few seconds. Yet another mod could add an armor that blocks nearly all damage but becomes less effective when multiple consecutive blows are taken, allowing players to deal heavy damage by landing a string of hits and requiring the player using the armor to adjust their tactics to avoid taking multiple hits in a short window.

Note that a bunch of the above examples could probably be done without adding any fundamental mechanics, although I'm not completely sure since I don't know exactly how damage/armor works at the code level.

Note that it would still be very difficult to balance, since if any weapon or piece of armor stands out in any way, players will probably gravitate towards it. If one piece of armor is still much better despite specific weaknesses, most likely you will see both that piece of armor and the weapon that beats it as popular items - perhaps with an alternative armor that resists said weapon being used a bit as well and with everything else being niche items. Or if one weapon is much better than everything else, you're going to see everyone wear the armor that resists it even if the other types of armor are just as good or even somewhat better overall. Expanding the combat system to allow for more variety opens a path to improving the balance of the modded experience to an extent, but does not guarantee such balance, especially as the fundamental balance issue that all the mods are being made almost completely independently from one another (asides from specific interactions) will still exist regardless of what is done at a base level.

Please please don't suggest this. Every single game I see that's multiplayer seems to gravitate towards wars. Players going "wouldn't it be cool if we could do a pvp thing here? or a pvp thing there?" ultimatly it consumes the game and that becomes the focus. Don't believe me? Look at WOW (best example), or Dota, or any of the other games mentioned before. Look at how the changes are made and the justification for it is. Oh this change was made because it's OP in pvp. But we need it for single player for x y and z... well then we'll make x y and z easier so you don't need it. Seriously why does every game have to degrade into a di** waiving contest. Get over it. Some of us are trying to build over here.

 

[Ieldra]

Seriously why does every game have to degrade into a di** waiving contest. Get over it. Some of us are trying to build over here.

QFT. I can't express how annoying that tendency is.

 

[RavynousHunter]

Please please don't suggest this. Every single game I see that's multiplayer seems to gravitate towards wars. Players going "wouldn't it be cool if we could do a pvp thing here? or a pvp thing there?" ultimatly it consumes the game and that becomes the focus. Don't believe me? Look at WOW (best example), or Dota, or any of the other games mentioned before. Look at how the changes are made and the justification for it is. Oh this change was made because it's OP in pvp. But we need it for single player for x y and z... well then we'll make x y and z easier so you don't need it. Seriously why does every game have to degrade into a di** waiving contest. Get over it. Some of us are trying to build over here.

Bingo. Some games, like Guild Wars, lend themselves well for PvP because they were designed for it. Minecraft was designed to...well...screw around and build shit. That's why I only join servers with explicit "no PvP" rules. No trolling, no "raiding," no bullshit, just homies building things. And occasionally competing to see who can build the coolest stuff the soonest.

 

[RJS]

The main justification I've seen for the power of the Draconic armour is that it's necessary for fighting the Chaos Guardian, and anything less will see you completely obliterated. While I could see this fitting in with a focused, tiered, progression-based pack, with some sort of objective or tier requiring fighting the Chaos Guardian, in a kitchen sink environment it sticks out like a sore thumb. In the context of Infinity, there is no need to have a boss so powerful that you need ridiculously absurdly powered armour to beat it.

The one thing I tend to use Draconic Evolution for is the Energy Storage. Honestly, I don't think I've seen a more awesome looking energy storage structure than that.

 

[mathchamp]

A few posts claim 1 heart of damage... I was wearing full draconic gear and ever hit I recieved took about 8 hearts of damage. They were using a maxed out rapier. Thank god for rod of travelling. Now the awakened armor prob only does a heart. They had awakened armor and I used Excalibur on them. It kept them at bay but did no damage at all. Yeah a little over powered. I don't think that tinker's should be able to completely bypass the armor when things like that can't. However that's from a players perspective. It's hard to code these things and make them interact well with each other when everything is piece meal.




Please please don't suggest this. Every single game I see that's multiplayer seems to gravitate towards wars. Players going "wouldn't it be cool if we could do a pvp thing here? or a pvp thing there?" ultimatly it consumes the game and that becomes the focus. Don't believe me? Look at WOW (best example), or Dota, or any of the other games mentioned before. Look at how the changes are made and the justification for it is. Oh this change was made because it's OP in pvp. But we need it for single player for x y and z... well then we'll make x y and z easier so you don't need it. Seriously why does every game have to degrade into a di** waiving contest. Get over it. Some of us are trying to build over here.

Dota was always meant to be PvP. WoW is probably a fair example (I've never played WoW though).

I'm not even suggesting it for PvP specifically (I mainly play single player survival). PvE could stand to be a bit more dynamic as well. Most mods add more powerful weapons and armor without adding anything to at least challenge the player beyond what you'd find in Vanilla. Fortunately there are mods for that, but then you have mods like IC2 and DE that add armor that completely negates anything that any mob can really do.

For example, in Vanilla, the endgame armor is full enchanted Diamond, which is actually quite good (it is overshadowed in the modded game due to the fact that mods frequently add more uses for diamonds, whereas in Vanilla, diamonds aren't needed for much more than tools/weapons/armor). You're not going to die in that in Vanilla unless you get really careless or do something really stupid. Then say a mod adds powered armor that's even better at blocking damage, but doesn't add mobs or anything to increase the difficulty. You can be careless and still not die. At this point, there are three options:

1. Nerf the armor so it's not better anymore. The downside is that players may decide to skip over your armor and go for another mod's armor or for the Vanilla solution.
2. Make mobs tougher so that the challenge level with the mod-added armor/equipment is similar to (or greater than) Vanilla's challenge level. However, the downside here is that it begins to force players to use your solution, as Vanilla equipment or other mod equipment may become inadequate.
3. Add tradeoffs, strengths, and weaknesses, along with elements that exploit any weaknesses, forcing the player to be adaptable and have various alternative equipment available and/or to adjust their tactics based on what equipment they have. For example, you can run around in powered armor and be nearly invincible, but if there's a robot mob that can fire an EMP rocket at you that drains all your armor's energy and leaves you defenseless, suddenly the player has tactical and strategic decisions to make beyond "make this set of armor and these weapons and destroy everything." Now the player has to decide whether to use the powered armor and risk running into a robot and being EMPed, whether to bring a backup set of diamond armor and use up four inventory slots in case of being EMPed, or to just use diamond armor to not have that weakness but sacrifice the other advantages (such as unlimited durability and more protection vs. other mobs). Vanilla by itself allows players to make decisions like this to an extent. Does one bring milk in case they run into cave spiders, a witch, or a player with splash potions? Or would they rather use that inventory/hotbar slot for something else?

I'm guessing though that there are probably at least some mod packs that can offer a decent PvE experience (if I want decent PvE I should probably not play a kitchen sink pack). It would still be nice at the very least if you couldn't be completely invincible to just about every mod off of a single mod's equipment. For example, if you want to add an armor specifically for fighting very strong mobs (usually bosses) that do 100+ damage per hit, instead of blocking 100% of damage so nothing can touch you, perhaps block 95% of damage but never allow the player to lose more than 1/2 or 1 heart per hit. That way, players can use the armor to fight a boss without worrying about being instagibbed, but still have to be cautious with large amounts of smaller enemies.

I just think it would be cool if instead of having one set of endgame equipment that can do everything, if you could choose what to take with you based on what you're going up against. You could have a little armory in your house, with a bunch of armor stands with different sets and tool racks full of various weapons, decide what you want to go challenge next, go to your armory, ponder what set of equipment will serve you best, grab it, and take it with you. You get surprised by something, find out you didn't make the best choice, and have to retreat. You go back to your armory, change your equipment, and go beat the challenge. You can do that now but it's pretty limited (e.g. which type of TiC weapon to use, or to switch your normal battle armor for Thaumcraft armor when you want to spend Vis, or switch a discharged set of powered armor for a fully charged set and let the other set charge).

 

[YX33A]

Y'know, I think I saw this mentioned before(or touched on, at least), but I feel that the best way to balance this armor would be a unique charging system.
I mean, think of Blood Magic for example; no matter how tough you get with it, your stuff needs blood, and that can mean a massive infrastructure. For some things, it outright IS a massive infrastructure to use; for example, complex spell orbs, or project: Omega.
By making it in some way bound to a location that must be defended to make the armor work, say, a location that must be in the end, or even bound in all three dimensions...
Attacking a person who is invincible is easy when you don't have to actually attack THEM. If simply removing their power source will disable their defenses, or even outright harm them...
Surely it'd be way cooler.

For example, Witchery. Poppet shelves allow for you to have way more poppets active, and even have poppets active that aren't on you.
One could have a automated system to make certain types of poppets, say, death protection.

...Actually, scratch that.

I should just say this: Witchery is a wickedly well made mod that is great for PvP but actually not really designed for it. Just balanced so that PvP and PvE in it don't really conflict, and any boon in PvP is somewhat easy to counter.
For example, Vampires. Powerful as all hell, deathly allergic to fire and sunlight. Vampire hunters tend to pack two special tools; one is called a witch hunter crossbow, and they use flaming bolts. The other is a sunlight grenade; literally a orb filled with sunlight. Pops any undead near it with sunlight. Most just burn a bit...
Vamps get the extra spicy recipe.

 

[Zammer990]

The main justification I've seen for the power of the Draconic armour is that it's necessary for fighting the Chaos Guardian, and anything less will see you completely obliterated. While I could see this fitting in with a focused, tiered, progression-based pack, with some sort of objective or tier requiring fighting the Chaos Guardian, in a kitchen sink environment it sticks out like a sore thumb. In the context of Infinity, there is no need to have a boss so powerful that you need ridiculously absurdly powered armour to beat it.

The one thing I tend to use Draconic Evolution for is the Energy Storage. Honestly, I don't think I've seen a more awesome looking energy storage structure than that.

I'd argue that the Chaos guardian isn't even that much of a hassle with the mods in Infinity. I've done it twice now with Bound Armour, Soul Harden,Resistance IV and a regen IV potion from BM, Tcon Crossbow and angel wings from EU. I never went below 7 hearts, and dispatched it fairly quickly. It did a few hearts (1/1.5) a hit, but the flight let my dodge around well. Speed boosts help as well, but they're plentiful in Infinity (globetrotter's sash, takes a little while to endgame botania, speed potions from BM etc),.

 

[asb3pe]

I find it rather unfortunate that the TWO most overpowered mods in the modded Minecraft world (Draconic and ProjectE) don't play together. With ProjE I can literally dial up any item and any quantity I need on demand. But there's two requirements - first, I must make one of the items and enter it into the ProjE Transmutation Tablet. And second, ProjE must recognize the item (i.e. it must have assigned the item an EMC value). However, none of the Draconic items have EMC values, and thus (horrors!) I have to mine materials in normal fashion and make all the stuff via other methods (such as AE autocrafting). Oh well, can't have it all I guess.

 

[LivingAngryCheese]

I find it rather unfortunate that the TWO most overpowered mods in the modded Minecraft world (Draconic and ProjectE) don't play together. With ProjE I can literally dial up any item and any quantity I need on demand. But there's two requirements - first, I must make one of the items and enter it into the ProjE Transmutation Tablet. And second, ProjE must recognize the item (i.e. it must have assigned the item an EMC value). However, none of the Draconic items have EMC values, and thus (horrors!) I have to mine materials in normal fashion and make all the stuff via other methods (such as AE autocrafting). Oh well, can't have it all I guess.

HAHAHAHA.

'Most op'


Orespawn anyone?

 

[Zammer990]

HAHAHAHA.

'Most op'


Orespawn anyone?

I think we're talking about mods that are within reason, and could make it into a pack that's not crazycraft . I think the miley cyrus sword mod should be added into Infinity, because it would balance draconic armour.

I find it rather unfortunate that the TWO most overpowered mods in the modded Minecraft world (Draconic and ProjectE) don't play together. With ProjE I can literally dial up any item and any quantity I need on demand. But there's two requirements - first, I must make one of the items and enter it into the ProjE Transmutation Tablet. And second, ProjE must recognize the item (i.e. it must have assigned the item an EMC value). However, none of the Draconic items have EMC values, and thus (horrors!) I have to mine materials in normal fashion and make all the stuff via other methods (such as AE autocrafting). Oh well, can't have it all I guess.

I take it ProjectE is EE2 revamped? Never heard of it prior.

EDIT:
playing around, I found that the portal gun mod's high energy pellet launcher sets your health to 1/2 heart, through draconic armour. Still invincible though.

 

[asb3pe]

I take it ProjectE is EE2 revamped? Never heard of it prior.

Precisely. It's in Resonant Rise 3 (RR Mainline) over on the AT Launcher. The idea is sound enough - assign each material in the game a numerical value (called "EMC"), and then you can just trade one bunch of items for some other item with the quantity determined by equivalent EMC values. For instance, cobblestone is EMC of 1, and just for an example (number may be incorrect), a Glowstone block has an EMC of 1024. So if you dump 1024 cobble into the Transmutator device, then you can pull out one Glowstone.

Sounds logical and fair, right? Well it would be, except... they've given us a way to generate EMC based on nothing at all!! Actually, it is generated by light. Which is free, of course (think glowstone blocks, permanent light source). So over time, you build up a massive amount of EMC which you can then use to create any quantity of just about any item. I play on a server, I set up my "energy flowers" and they just generate EMC nonstop 24/7/365.

Like all mods, this one has its time and place. I'm having fun with it, but I also find myself a bit sad at how I don't have to do any of the "normal" minecrafting stuff (like mining, quarrying, growing food, processing ores in machines). But if you're looking for a "creative" type of experience in a survival world? ProjectE is def your mod!

Edit: Reading other threads, and I suddenly realized that ProjE is in the new Horizons Daybreaker modpack. So have fun with it!

Re-edit: Horizons Daybreaker pack actually has "Equivalent Exchange 3", but Resonant Rise has "ProjectE". I was told ProjectE was a replacement for EE3 (or maybe EE2), but since I'm clearly confused and don't know what I'm talking about, I'll just leave this note to explain. You can figure it out from here. Maybe. LOL

 

[YX33A]

Precisely. It's in Resonant Rise 3 (RR Mainline) over on the AT Launcher. The idea is sound enough - assign each material in the game a numerical value (called "EMC"), and then you can just trade one bunch of items for some other item with the quantity determined by equivalent EMC values. For instance, cobblestone is EMC of 1, and just for an example (number may be incorrect), a Glowstone block has an EMC of 1024. So if you dump 1024 cobble into the Transmutator device, then you can pull out one Glowstone.

Sounds logical and fair, right? Well it would be, except... they've given us a way to generate EMC based on nothing at all!! Actually, it is generated by light. Which is free, of course (think glowstone blocks, permanent light source). So over time, you build up a massive amount of EMC which you can then use to create any quantity of just about any item. I play on a server, I set up my "energy flowers" and they just generate EMC nonstop 24/7/365.

Like all mods, this one has its time and place. I'm having fun with it, but I also find myself a bit sad at how I don't have to do any of the "normal" minecrafting stuff (like mining, quarrying, growing food, processing ores in machines). But if you're looking for a "creative" type of experience in a survival world? ProjectE is def your mod!

Edit: Reading other threads, and I suddenly realized that ProjE is in the new Horizons Daybreaker modpack. So have fun with it!

Re-edit: Horizons Daybreaker pack actually has "Equivalent Exchange 3", but Resonant Rise has "ProjectE". I was told ProjectE was a replacement for EE3 (or maybe EE2), but since I'm clearly confused and don't know what I'm talking about, I'll just leave this note to explain. You can figure it out from here. Maybe. LOL

Short explination for the re-edit: Project E is a remade EE2, EE3 is a new EE, in a attempt to rebalance many of the "issues" with "Over Powered" aspects to EE2.
Basically, gate it late and hope for the best, no Red Matter stuff, and if we're lucky, tons of new cool toys, or at least some cool ways.

Oh, and for EE2 supporting other mods, well, assign EMC values to things, and as long as the things are crafted via crafting tables or furnaces it'll calculate it correctly; no other methods will calculate the new EMC value.
For example, even though it has support for Thaumcraft shards, and thaumcraft wood, it can't do anything with a wand that is better then iron capped wood, nor can it uses those goggles because they aren't craftable any other way.

If Rotary Craft didn't use the its crafting table, it still would only be able to make 1 block from it because HLSA steel is a special smelting recipe(and everything but 1 block uses it in some way).

And for the record, glowstone as in glowstone blocks is a good-ish guess for cost on 1024. I think it actually is 1024 for glowstone dust.

 

[Zammer990]

snip

I don't even think the energy collector was the most OP EMC generator out there; sugar cane farms, and blaze rod dupers could make red matter in seconds.
Haven't played with EE3 yet.

Also didn't know a new horizons pack was out, I'll have to look at that at some point.