Update on the Future of FTB Modpacks in 1.7

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Jadedcat

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Arron Syaoran said:
@Jadedcat - I will probably try Agrarian Skies. If I die often, then it's too easy and I'll probably try Magic Farm 2 instead. Whichever has EE3 and TC4 would suit my best interests.
@Mod Balancing - I think all power systems should have some form of energy loss whenever converted or transfered long distance.
Good Power Conversion: 32 EU yields 5 RF. 5 RF yields 8 EU. 8 EU yields 1.25 RF.
Bad Power Conversion: 32 EU yields 5 RF. 5 RF yields 32 EU.
I also think that Equivalent Exchange should include a Transmutation Penalty Cost(like 9 Iron gives 1 Gold but 1 Gold gives 7 Iron), to pay for the energy needed to cause the Transmutation to occur. An EMC based system with equivalent values and percentage-based EMC loss per transaction would be perfect.
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That would require re-writes to every mod with an energy system.

SandGrainOne said:
This post is mostly a copy of something I posted on reddit 5 days ago:

Different games and mods tries to put game play into different places. BuildCraft tries to make power into an element of concern not only in the choice of fuel, but also with production and distribution. By having loss in machines and control in the pipes, BC tries to add a need for creativity and knowledge about the mechanics. (We could probably do better though.)

The RF vs MJ "conflict" is a little bit like Applied Energistics 1 vs Applied Energistics 2. When AE 1 was released, a lot of the feedback was that it simplified automation a little bit too much, that it took away many interesting design problems when it came to resource distribution. AlgorithmX2 agreed and we now see the answer to that. The simple cables are being replaced with the channel system. A change that adds depth and more problem solving into the game play.

When that is said, AlgorithmX2 can't prevent players from using Thermal Expansion for automation for then to simply import the end products to the ME system. And in the same manner I don't think we behind BuildCraft can prevent players from producing and distributing power as they see fit. There will always be at least one mod that can bridge the gap between the two systems and a substantial part of the player base seems to prefer the easy work around.

The problems arise then large and very popular mod packs go so far to suggest a certain game play or work around for mechanics introduced by a mod. I wonder how many more "RF-mods" with IC2 features we'll get the next couple of months. We now have "Simple Jetpacks" and someone recently released "Quantum Armor". Although that has been taken down again, someone will create an acceptable "port" soon enough. The way this has been announced is creating a shift and we are slowly loosing out on diversity.
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I would agree with you except, all the mods you mention were created before the announcement. I spend a lot of my time in different irc rooms throughout the community. I also talk to a lot of mod devs and not just the ones on the servers I play on or in FTB packs. I and Eyamaz have watched the community shift to RF. Mods are frequently RF/MJ compatible or RF/EU or just RF compatible. We are shifting with the community.

The shift started in 1.6. Mod devs started using RF more and more, when we sat down and started looking at the mods we are sure will be updated to 1.7 and all the ones we hope will be updated more mods are RF compatible than any other energy system. So the obvious choice is that more modpacks will have RF simply because there are more RF mods. Yes that will mean more people make RF mods. But the cause of the shift wasn't FTB. The dev community shifted. Modpacks shift with the availability of mods. Then mods shift and so it goes until the mods shift again.

As a purely philosphical theory it might not just be because RF is easier to implement. It may also be because the developers of RF are easier to find and more open to helping new developers get started. The BC devs including you and the IC2 devs do not hang out in most public IRC channels or sit on teamspeak and chat with people about code. I am not saying you should either, just that it does make the RF devs more approachable for help and advice.

And again. In 1.6, 1 Official pack has IC2 and BC with TE3. In 1.7, 1 official pack will have IC2 and BC without RF options. The number of packs with IC2/BC isn't changing what is changing is we won't be shipping the intricate systems with the less intricate systems in the same packs. Which should solve the concern that RF is easier and therefore more people will use it.


Also added the mod dev tag.. not sure how I missed that <.<
 
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Hambeau

Hambeau

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First DW20 Server play 1.7 based Youtube posted today:

Includes a list of currently installed 1.7 mods as well as mentioning others that are close and will be added when ready for testing.
 
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SwiftLilEagle

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Does anybody have any news on when Soaryn is getting Xycraft up, and if it's gonna be there for 1.7? I feel like if not, then Dire is gonna surprise the crap out of all of us sometime soon with a FC2 video showing him doing Xycraft stuff, then saying something like "Oh right, I didn't mention it, did I? Xycraft is back!"
 
Dungeonmaster372

Dungeonmaster372

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He is working on it. I believe he is trying to get it ready for 1.7 but he hasn't set a release date! I will be adding it to my modpack as well as soon as it is available. You can keep up to date here, here or here.
 
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King Lemming

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So, I'm going to chime in:

RF and TE are not the same thing. RF can indeed have loss over distance. The point of RF is that it's a freeform API and allows people to work on a common system quite easily. It's a lot like the fluid API. That's why RF is a great thing. People are conflating the two because TE is an example of how to use it, unlike other systems where the power API was inextricably tied to the main mod which added it.

Now while I'm not back, and I have limited control over the direction of the future of TE, I'm pretty sure there will likely be a shift to more modularity for a number of reasons.

So, if somebody wants to implement lossy power transmission, or more interesting generation/consumers with RF, go for it! TE is a very basic example of how it can be used - it is CERTAINLY not the only way. Also, all parts of TE are optional - you can definitely keep machines and dynamos and disable ducts and tesseracts, opting to use other things.

I also encourage people to use RF in new and unique ways and not simply copy old mechanics. Yes, I realize that some things are just obvious - RF powered armor - fine, but mix it up from the Q-suit. Redstone Arsenal is a very different take on powered tools and I feel that it works pretty well. The only real similarity to any other powered tool is that there is stored energy in the tool. Ooh ahh /firework.
 
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Not_Steve

Not_Steve

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Jadedcat said:
I'm not. It will be.. the everything pack is the Direwolf Pack in 1.7. Which is always the most popular pack.
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I was under the impression that the horizons pack was the most popular pack. Is this untrue or am I misunderstanding something?
 
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