Monster: Things that should be disabled by default. Your opinions

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Reika

RotaryCraft Dev
FTB Mod Dev
Sep 3, 2013
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Can you have it where this is by default in monster and also so you cant convert it to vanilla dye. Even if it drops dyed tree dyes, a unifier can convert it back & then be used as power in a MFR bio reactor/ bio generator
So you are asking me to
  1. Change the default configs in a modpack I do not make or control
  2. Break other mod's unifiers without their consent.
Got it.
Fat chance.
 

trajano080

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
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Say, I think I know a mod like that ;)


What's annoying about Gascraft? It adds no worldgen (edit: oops it does. I forgot about that half of the mod), just a few innocuous socket modules that you wouldn't even know were there unless you were looking specifically for them (all the Engineer's toolbox modules look the same inside NEI). Its about as inoffensive a mod gets.
It has happened a couple times that I start digging underground, near bedrock, and some gas appears that gives naseua, blindness and poison. I think it was natural gas, although I could be wrong.
 

NJM1564

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
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Ya know I read these posts and it's not things that should be disabled by default. It's things you don't like.
Disabled by default suggest things that are bad for all players. Not you. Not some. Not even most. But all. And there is nothing in any mod that someone doesn't use at some time. Be it for atheistic reasons. Of just because they fell like being clever.
Some players like taking the easy way. Or they don't have time to set up a complicated uber system. Others like the challenge and will set up those complicated systems. Despite having simpler alternatives. Some want to try everything and will make a dozen systems that do exactly the same thing. And some simply like to try different ways each time.
And if they want to that's there choice. That's your choice. You do not get to chose for them.
So the player next door can great a god machine that churns diamonds not out of dirt but out of thin air. So what. You do not have to do the same thing. This world is only a competition if everybody agrees to it. And I for one do not.
So you take the high way and I'll take the low way. And I'll get to the promised land before you. But we will both reach it eventually. As long as you don't nerf anything I was counting on.
You do that I will hurt you. Pandering to a few loud voices is not something any pack dev or mod dev should do. But threads like this keep shouting so loudly that that's all that they can hear.
Sham on you. Shame on you all. Have some consideration for other players.
As it has bin stated endlessly and seemingly ignored. "If you don't like a system, or mod, or machine you do not have to use it."
 

Reika

RotaryCraft Dev
FTB Mod Dev
Sep 3, 2013
5,079
5,331
550
Toronto, Canada
sites.google.com
Ya know I read these posts and it's not things that should be disabled by default. It's things you don't like.
Disabled by default suggest things that are bad for all players. Not you. Not some. Not even most. But all. And there is nothing in any mod that someone doesn't use at some time. Be it for atheistic reasons. Of just because they fell like being clever.
Some players like taking the easy way. Or they don't have time to set up a complicated uber system. Others like the challenge and will set up those complicated systems. Despite having simpler alternatives. Some want to try everything and will make a dozen systems that do exactly the same thing. And some simply like to try different ways each time.
And if they want to that's there choice. That's your choice. You do not get to chose for them.
So the player next door can great a god machine that churns diamonds not out of dirt but out of thin air. So what. You do not have to do the same thing. This world is only a competition if everybody agrees to it. And I for one do not.
So you take the high way and I'll take the low way. And I'll get to the promised land before you. But we will both reach it eventually. As long as you don't nerf anything I was counting on.
You do that I will hurt you. Pandering to a few loud voices is not something any pack dev or mod dev should do. But threads like this keep shouting so loudly that that's all that they can hear.
Sham on you. Shame on you all. Have some consideration for other players.
As it has bin stated endlessly and seemingly ignored. "If you don't like a system, or mod, or machine you do not have to use it."
A thousand times this, and the reason I do not provide the ability to do server-wide disables of content from my mods.
 

NJM1564

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
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A thousand times this, and the reason I do not provide the ability to do server-wide disables of content from my mods.
That might be a bit much. There are some mod packs that are designed for very specific purposes. Sky block or hard core packs. Having highly editable configs for packs like that is always good.
Though there are other mods that are specifically designed to disable elements of other mods.
But those are theme packs. Monster is supposed to be a general pack meant for everybody.
 

ESchrodingersCat

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
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The only mods that i think should be disabled by default in non-difficulty-centered packs are either mods that cause lag or mods where if a player doesn't know about them, it could hurt their gameplay (e.g. deadlier worlds, hunger override, mo creatures, meteorcraft, farsiders, GregTech, etc. As far as I'm aware, all these mentioned mods are either not in Monster or disabled by default). I've not run into any mods like that in Monster so far. All other mods with only a couple exceptions are easily ignored if the player doesn't want to use them. Think it's OP to ore dictionary cobblestone into granite from geostrata? Don't ore dictionary cobblestone into granite. For example, I personally think EnderIO is a bit OP so I don't craft anything from it. And mods that add mildly annoying world gen (ReactorCraft, geostrata) are easily dealt with using itemducts and a trash can (both are cheap).

I would have never known about geotrata if it had been disabled by default so I'm glad that it's not because I enjoy the decorative blocks. And I think dye trees are actually kind of cool looking but that's just me.
 

Hambeau

Over-Achiever
Jul 24, 2013
2,598
1,531
213
OT, always amazes me in this day and age how many people don't actually know how to use a computer, as in getting into the files to adjust things, see where things are stored, etc.
I still have fond memories of getting a new game, and having to do some tweaks to autoexec.bat, knowing my IRQ settings to configure sound/gfx and maybe doing some memcheck stuff just to get a game to work. All that stuff was expected for the player to sort out (with some instructions in a manual), back in the distant past where "technology/computers" was not as common/widely used as they are now.

Amount of times I've given someone instructions to go to Windows Explorer (aka File Manager), not Internet Explorer, and yes, they've gone to IE...

I blame tablets, "smart"phones, and other closed systems that cater to the lowest common denominator for the lack of user sophistication.
 
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lumien

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
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Random Things, makes a ton of lag with reactorcraft and Mariculture, too much stress on GPU with the corals and water thingies and it doesnt have that much of gameplay..Also, I disabled IC2.. I know that a lot of people use it.. But.. Its so dead :/ without gregtech it doesnt have endgame stuff, and EVERYTHING you can do with IC2 you can do better with other mod as far as im aware.. Except maybe the crops thingy.. but thats all :/ I dont find IC2 worth the ID's and things loaded in memory..

I'm not sure whether you also referred to Random Things with the "ton of lag" but if you did, with what block / item did you encounter "ton of lag"?

I definitely agree with Random Things- I really dislike that mod. Everything in it can be done better with others, and some of the textures are ripped straight out of other mods.

IC2 is a classic, and I love Quantum Armor so so much

I assume with the ripped off textures you mean the Block Breaker, it was one of the first things i added to Random Things and it really just was a simple thing to see whether i could get the block breaking animation to work. I didn't really think about the texture and i should have probably made my own.
Besides that i don't know of any other "ripped off" textures.

So let's go through the "Everything in it can be done better with others":

  1. Auto Placer: I don't know another block that can be used to build this long line of blocks. The Drawbridge from Tinkers Construct has a much lower range and is rather to be used to make doors or drawbridges. It also requires you to get into Tinkers Construct to build it. You could use a turtle but not everybody is able to code that.
  2. Block Breaker: The Block Breaker isn't anything special although i don't know of one from another mod that allows you to filter which block you wanna break based on metadata.
  3. Block Detector: Same as the Block Breaker.
  4. Block Teleporter: I don't know of any other block that can teleport a single block across long distances. The only thing that does something like this is from MFFS and it's rather used to teleport structures.
  5. Ender Porter: Well there's the elevator block from Open Blocks that is obviously better when used as an elevator. The Ender Porter however doesn't have an range limit and doesn't need a counter part on the other floor. You can also apply camouflage to it to for example make a hidden "door" to your base.
  6. Entity Detector: You could recreate this with Computer Craft or something but i think this is easier to setup. You can for example use it to make a simple door.
  7. Fertilized Dirt: Many mods add stuff that speeds up plant growing but since xycraft i missed one that is farmland.
  8. Fluid Display: I don't know another block that can display a liquid like that.
  9. Imbuing Station: This mechanic is "copied" from terraria and it allows you to make imbues that grant you on hit effects for a certain amount of time. Its a rather new addition so right now there aren't many imbues but i plan to expand on it.
  10. Inventory Interface: Another one of the first blocks i added to learn some inventory and gui stuff. Its just a sneaky pipe that can be used by anything that connects to an inventory and its really nothing special i agree.
  11. Item Collector: The Vacuum Hopper from Open Blocks (I think) has a similiar functionality but it actually "pulls" the items towards it instead of teleporting them into the inventory. With the Advanced Item Collector you can also specify the range and apply a filter to the items you want to be picked up. I used this and Auto Placer to make a Rainbow Tree farm since the tree eats up a planter and the Harvester didn't seem to be able to collect the drops.
  12. Online Detector: Again you could create something like this using Computer Craft but this is much simpler and easier to understand.
  13. Player Interface: So i actually don't know another block that allows you to connect to the Inventory of your player like this.. Something from Open Peripherals allows you to interface with the player inventory but only if you stand on it. It also doesn't have specific sides for Armor Hotbar and Storage Slots (I think). Theres also something from Ganys End that does something like this but i think it also doesn't have separate sides for the different slots.
  14. Shock Absorber: Well i just didn't found something that simply removed fall damage without slowing you down or making you stuck for a while in the mod pack i was playing.
  15. Block Replacer: Its just a way to quickly replace the cobblestone walls in your first cave with smooth stone without having to go into Thaumcraft first.
  16. Entity Mover: Many mods add something like this, don't know of anyone that does it "better".
  17. Magic Stones: The magic stones are really just small gimick things i did to try out some particle effects. I don't see how you could dislike them. The White Stone especially i find really useful at times.
  18. Magnetic Force: This might get disabled on some servers but i just liked the idea of a consumable teleport to another player.
  19. Portable Ender Porter: It allows you to get in caves, out of caves, up to a flying island really easily.
  20. Colored Glass/Lamps/Redstone Blocks: Just wanted colored version of these blocks doesn't hurt and i prefer the vanilla lamp look over the more "industrial" lights of other mods.
  21. Hardcore Darkness: Saw something on the Better then Wolves thread and tried to recreate it. Didn't really work so in the 1.6 version it just reduces your gamma. (Is used in the Blood n' Bones back though)
  22. More Workbenches: I always thought Workbenches looked a little bit weird when you placed them in a house made out of a different looking kind of wood. Thats why i made it so that you can make Workbenches out of every wood in the game. In the 1.7 version the overlay will be semi transparent so they will look a bit less like the wood block with an overlay.
Biomes%20o%20Plenty%20Workbenches.png


So now i hope that you respond to this post and tell me what YOU think is done better in other mods or is just totally useless.
I'm rewriting the mod for 1.7 anyway and i'll clean it up a bit so it would be nice to hear some suggestions as to what i should remove.
 
Last edited:

Eyamaz

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
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Personally, Random Things is still one of my favorite mods.

As for the dye issue, exactly how are people unifying them? dyeWhite and dyeBlue should be blacklisted on both oreDict converters I know of.
 

IMarvinTPA

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
274
0
0
Personally, Random Things is still one of my favorite mods.

As for the dye issue, exactly how are people unifying them? dyeWhite and dyeBlue should be blacklisted on both oreDict converters I know of.
Orange Tree Dye into normal Orange Dye using MFR unifier. Then shove that dye and as many others as you can into the MFR Bio Reactor for biofuel.

IMarv
 

Hoff

Tech Support
Oct 30, 2012
2,901
1,502
218
Personally, Random Things is still one of my favorite mods.

As for the dye issue, exactly how are people unifying them? dyeWhite and dyeBlue should be blacklisted on both oreDict converters I know of.
Pretty sure any vanilla dye can be used in bioreactor which is what I believe he means they're unifying them for. In which case there are still 14 more dyes that can be used.
 

Colensocon1

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
331
0
0
Ya know I read these posts and it's not things that should be disabled by default. It's things you don't like.
Disabled by default suggest things that are bad for all players. Not you. Not some. Not even most. But all. And there is nothing in any mod that someone doesn't use at some time. Be it for atheistic reasons. Of just because they fell like being clever.
Some players like taking the easy way. Or they don't have time to set up a complicated uber system. Others like the challenge and will set up those complicated systems. Despite having simpler alternatives. Some want to try everything and will make a dozen systems that do exactly the same thing. And some simply like to try different ways each time.
And if they want to that's there choice. That's your choice. You do not get to chose for them.
So the player next door can great a god machine that churns diamonds not out of dirt but out of thin air. So what. You do not have to do the same thing. This world is only a competition if everybody agrees to it. And I for one do not.
So you take the high way and I'll take the low way. And I'll get to the promised land before you. But we will both reach it eventually. As long as you don't nerf anything I was counting on.
You do that I will hurt you. Pandering to a few loud voices is not something any pack dev or mod dev should do. But threads like this keep shouting so loudly that that's all that they can hear.
Sham on you. Shame on you all. Have some consideration for other players.
As it has bin stated endlessly and seemingly ignored. "If you don't like a system, or mod, or machine you do not have to use it."
nice very nice :)
 

wolfsilver00

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
752
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The thing is, these people are willing to go through the work of disabling a mod - and the world damage such an action creates - so they should be willing and able to look in a config.

I wonder how modding would have gotten started if the first big mods - BC, RP2, PowerCraft, EE and some others - got treated in the same "remove first, ask questions never" manner.

It gets worse, too - this feeds a positive feedback cycle of "what is this mod for? I have never heard of it. Let's remove it", with people removing mods they have never heard of and then that mod getting even less attention. ReactorCraft has had this problem for a while.

But disabling a mod is easier and intuitive.. But messing with configs.. Im used to it, but for new people its bound to break more than it fixes.. I remember my first time configuring greg tech, i spent literally 2 or 3 hours on his CFG's.. Obviously your cfg's are perfectly simple, but yet again, some people dont even know where cfg's are and mostly are not willing to even try to find them.. I know its bad, but I feel we cant really blame them as they dont have the necessity to modify (and understand) them.. One single thing that would make things better is if the launcher had an instant access to the pack folder.. As for me, i see how reactorcraft had this problem, tbh since i started using ftb i rarely go onto the mods forums.. But the fact that reactorcraft is there gave me the impulse i needed to finally get rid of IC2, which at least for me, is beneficial. There are, i believe, a ton of people out there that would enjoy reactor and rotary craft, but for that they first need to see it.. And the modpacks continue to have other mods that are more known by the people out there.. Usually people does Thermal and buildcraft, thats all they need..But also, its what they see, for example, in direwolf20 videos.. For this i have 2 solutions, u can ask direwolf20 to make a mod review on rotary craft, and second, you could make the handbook an instant item when logging into the server for the first time.. If people dont know your mod, try to make them know it! And then, the "What is this mod? Ill disable it" Will turn into "Hey, this is the mod with the awesome looking machines! No way im disabling it"

I tend to go to creative and check every new mod i get in a mod pack.. Then i disable properly.. When i saw your machines i decided it wasnt going to be disabled, but i needed to see it first. So yeah.. Sorry for the wall of text, im trying to help, but i also think that you need to comprehend that the community here is not 100% computer fanatics, there are even kids here..
 

rhn

Too Much Free Time
Nov 11, 2013
5,706
4,420
333
Orange Tree Dye into normal Orange Dye using MFR unifier. Then shove that dye and as many others as you can into the MFR Bio Reactor for biofuel.

IMarv
I didn't like Dyetrees in my pack, but for completely different reasons. I would have to agree with Reika(read him saying this somewhere I think) on this one. The flaw here is in MFR that allows you to make biofuel out of dyes. Sure the few dyes that are actual plants(cocoa beans, although I would argue they should make seed oil instead) maybe, but it doesn't make sense to first grind flowers into a paste, dry them and extract the pigment(yes this is what a dye really is) AND then suddenly be able to make biofuel out of the pigment...

The actual pigment dyes (dandelion yellow, rose red, pink dye and so on) should only be used as dyes. The fact that MFR allows the use of them in the Bio Reactor is a major flaw in my book, that just invites future balance issues.
 

wolfsilver00

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
752
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I'm not sure whether you also referred to Random Things with the "ton of lag" but if you did, with what block / item did you encounter "ton of lag"?

Its a crossmod interaction with rotary craft, i dont know why but with random things i get lag when using some mods, particularly rotary craft.. I think its a problem with Random Things modifying textures.. Or something like that i read when trying to solve it :p
 

Reika

RotaryCraft Dev
FTB Mod Dev
Sep 3, 2013
5,079
5,331
550
Toronto, Canada
sites.google.com
That might be a bit much. There are some mod packs that are designed for very specific purposes. Sky block or hard core packs. Having highly editable configs for packs like that is always good.
Though there are other mods that are specifically designed to disable elements of other mods.
But those are theme packs. Monster is supposed to be a general pack meant for everybody.
90% of my experiences have been more "I think [X] is OP so I am going to take it out".
But disabling a mod is easier and intuitive.. But messing with configs.. Im used to it, but for new people its bound to break more than it fixes.. I remember my first time configuring greg tech, i spent literally 2 or 3 hours on his CFG's.. Obviously your cfg's are perfectly simple, but yet again, some people dont even know where cfg's are and mostly are not willing to even try to find them.. I know its bad, but I feel we cant really blame them as they dont have the necessity to modify (and understand) them.. One single thing that would make things better is if the launcher had an instant access to the pack folder.. As for me, i see how reactorcraft had this problem, tbh since i started using ftb i rarely go onto the mods forums.. But the fact that reactorcraft is there gave me the impulse i needed to finally get rid of IC2, which at least for me, is beneficial. There are, i believe, a ton of people out there that would enjoy reactor and rotary craft, but for that they first need to see it.. And the modpacks continue to have other mods that are more known by the people out there.. Usually people does Thermal and buildcraft, thats all they need..But also, its what they see, for example, in direwolf20 videos.. For this i have 2 solutions, u can ask direwolf20 to make a mod review on rotary craft, and second, you could make the handbook an instant item when logging into the server for the first time.. If people dont know your mod, try to make them know it! And then, the "What is this mod? Ill disable it" Will turn into "Hey, this is the mod with the awesome looking machines! No way im disabling it"

I tend to go to creative and check every new mod i get in a mod pack.. Then i disable properly.. When i saw your machines i decided it wasnt going to be disabled, but i needed to see it first. So yeah.. Sorry for the wall of text, im trying to help, but i also think that you need to comprehend that the community here is not 100% computer fanatics, there are even kids here..
Generally speaking, if you cannot figure out a config or how to find it, you are so inept with computers that you have no business managing a server. What are you going to do when you need to reboot your server, or update? Run around with your arms in the air?
 

wolfsilver00

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
752
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I didn't like Dyetrees in my pack, but for completely different reasons. I would have to agree with Reika(read him saying this somewhere I think) on this one. The flaw here is in MFR that allows you to make biofuel out of dyes. Sure the few dyes that are actual plants(cocoa beans, although I would argue they should make seed oil instead) maybe, but it doesn't make sense to first grind flowers into a paste, dry them and extract the pigment(yes this is what a dye really is) AND then suddenly be able to make biofuel out of the pigment...

The actual pigment dyes (dandelion yellow, rose red, pink dye and so on) should only be used as dyes. The fact that MFR allows the use of them in the Bio Reactor is a major flaw in my book, that just invites future balance issues.

Even if its dry, it continues being a biological compound which can be fermented... Taking away the water just makes the process slower because organic chains need water to be reactive most of the cases. Now.. the problem here is the quantity it allows to make, you would need a around 2k flowers just to make 1 liter of biofuel.. Which obviously is not the case.. Having said that, in the mfr cfg you can modify the unifier blacklist which is:

S:Unifier.Blacklist=dyeBlue,dyeWhite,dyeBrown,dyeBlack,logWood,plankWood,treeSapling,projredPart

Its not reikas fault that Dye Trees is being used for other purpose... Dyes are commonly used to dye things, not to power them.
 

wolfsilver00

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
752
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0
90% of my experiences have been more "I think [X] is OP so I am going to take it out".

Generally speaking, if you cannot figure out a config or how to find it, you are so inept with computers that you have no business managing a server. What are you going to do when you need to reboot your server, or update? Run around with your arms in the air?

Hey! Running with arms in the air is fun! And, on topic, you have a point there. Which makes me think, does the people that complain about it manage servers? Or they are just people that bandwagon?
 

Colensocon1

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
331
0
0
Hey! Running with arms in the air is fun! And, on topic, you have a point there. Which makes me think, does the people that complain about it manage servers? Or they are just people that bandwagon?
If they are upswing a company to host like creeper host they sort a lot of thugs out for them just make a ticket and wait Lol life made simple :)
 

rhn

Too Much Free Time
Nov 11, 2013
5,706
4,420
333
Even if its dry, it continues being a biological compound which can be fermented... Taking away the water just makes the process slower because organic chains need water to be reactive most of the cases. Now.. the problem here is the quantity it allows to make, you would need a around 2k flowers just to make 1 liter of biofuel.. Which obviously is not the case.. Having said that, in the mfr cfg you can modify the unifier blacklist which is:

S:Unifier.Blacklist=dyeBlue,dyeWhite,dyeBrown,dyeBlack,logWood,plankWood,treeSapling,projredPart

Its not reikas fault that Dye Trees is being used for other purpose... Dyes are commonly used to dye things, not to power them.
Well moving way way OT now, but when making biogas and biofuel you cant really use just any plant matter. It has to be some energy rich plant matter. And I would think that when you are done extracting and refining the pigment from plants to use as dye, there would be so little energy left in the biomaterial that.. well :p

And yeah it would make a lot more sense in my book if we could blacklist the dyes in the MFR bio generator. That way you could have Dyetrees and the Bio generator working together without any exploits(if you don't like that).

But yeah, like I said: I don't object to it because I think its OP. I object to it because I think it is physically flawed(yes I know, MC and physics. But making a mod that tries to mimic reality by making machines that does RL stuff, then they should also follow RL rules).
 
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