Clearly the right way to go is to unregister IC2 bronze from the ore dictionary and use Brawnz Ingots! 
Gregtech deliberately crashing client if TC installed..
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Clearly the right way to go is to unregister IC2 bronze from the ore dictionary and use Brawnz Ingots!
And then add Brainz Ingots, which yield twice the recipe output!
No, you mix two zombie brains and an iron/gold ingot and get them, then you can make refined Brainz Ingot and you have to use that to make a Brainz Block, then you need a three triple-condensed Brainz Blocks for a compressor.
I admit I haven't read majority of this thread as I was sleeping but I'll respond to some stuff that was written in last one.
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Take any random FPS. Increased difficulty rarely does anything but throwing more and stronger mobs at you. For anything having economy it generally raises the prices.
Wait, what? You don't like to have a decently balanced gameplay? Why do you consider vanilla the secret cow that no one should ever dare to change?
Kiteh want brainz!
I lost my capacity to think rationally about a bottle ago... I better go to beg before I distarts .dfdadzxvzx
Basically, the argument is that Gregtech doesn't make the game "harder," in that it requires more skill. It merely makes things more tedious/grindy (which is somewhat true.)
An analogy to FPS games would be this: when people complain that, say, drones are too easy, they don't end up making boss fights consisting of a battle against a drone, followed by another battle against a drone, and so on until they have enough drone fights to be considered hard.
(This post does not reflect the views of the FTB forum user Whovian or the BBC.)
Dude why do you keep coming back here? You've been disrespectful and generally annoying on RichardG's twitter, IC2 forums, and here. Not everyone wants to bend over backwards to play the game how you like. No, they aren't wrong. Not everyone shares your idea of balance. Seriously. Give it up. Thanks.
What is so "decently balanced" about less planks per log? Were planks just too overpowered? Were people beating the snot out of enderdragons with planks? Was it the amount of LPs of people planking withers to death? Is it cuz you can use 1024 planks with a Minium Stone to make 256 logs to make 128 obsidian to make 32 iron to make 4 gold to make 1 diamond?
It absolutely can. Tinker's Construct smelt+fortune works on any world placed block that drops an item when smelted. It makes no checks that the block is an ore, or part of worldgen, or anything else.
Not relevant. It works on any world placed block. So now the next version of bibliotech has iron desks. Except, there's no reason you can't melt down an iron desk and get the iron back, so such a reverse-crafting recipe is put in.
Now tinker's construct is duping iron.
Note that Dartcraft, which has an exactly similar smelt+fortune mechanism doesn't have this dupe.[DOUBLEPOST=1374122935][/DOUBLEPOST]
If there was a dupe at all, it was because the Industrial Centrifuge creates more out of bronze than was used to create it. This is not Forestry's problem, and not a reason to overwrite the configurable recipe.
As a stand-alone mod, TiC's fortune-smelt isn't overpowered. It is a logical part of the mod's progression. The smeltery is the beginning of ore doubling. You can start it up with only three iron for the lava bucket, but you will be forced to hand-cast each ingot, which is balanced for early game. After using some of the iron to mine diamonds and redstone, you can begin automated casting for ingots and start working into obsidian for Alumite which leads to Cobalt and Ardite for your highest level tools.
At this point, you start applying your lapis to a pickaxe and work it up to Fortune III. At some point, you should be set up in the Nether and farming blazes. You make your lava crystal and now you have fortune-autosmelt. At this point, you will jump from guaranteed doubling to (*gasp*) an average 2.5x ingots return for ores that have a smelting recipe. In other words, not on any of the highest tier ores(uranium, cobalt, ardite, etc.). Even then, this doesn't happen for free. You pay with ingots for repair or EU for charging. You can't dupe storage blocks since none of them are smelted. In fact, the only "exploit" is that the 2.5x return costs less per ore than most other methods, but that's all relative since you don't get bonus dusts like you get with a pulverizer among other methods.
GregTech introduces smelting storage blocks to return their components ingots. I don't have a problem with that. In fact, attaching a resource cost to the convenience of storage blocks isn't a bad idea. Suddenly, there is a cross-mod exploit. On one hand, you have a mod that is balanced on its own. On the other, you have a mod that changes vanilla recipes in such a way that turns a balanced mechanic into a dupe. Further, in a modding community with literally hundreds of mods, only a single mod turns the fortune-autosmelt mechanic into a dupe.
Who should change? The mod(TiC) that only becomes a dupe with one out of hundreds or the mod(GT) that changes the recipes that turn it into a dupe? The answer should be self-evident.
I've never said otherwise, other than the fact that it works on non ores. Which is a dupe, plain and simple.
Again, the tinker's construct dupe has nothing to do with GT. The cause of the dupe is that it applies fortune to non-ores.
I don't think I ever disagreed with this. I never agreed with it, but I certainly never disagreed with it.
Can I re-state something, while possibly clarifying? At this point, AFAIK, without GT, there would be no way to duplicate Ingots with the smelting thing from TC. Due to this, GT and TC both play roles in the dupe bug, and some would even mostly blame GT for ****ing up Vanilla in the first place.
Now, this doesn't mean that TC can't fix the dupe bug, or that GT can't. But, without GT, the dupe bug wouldn't be a problem in the first place, at least not yet.
Ah, you see, that's totally different logic.
[DOUBLEPOST=1374123942][/DOUBLEPOST]
The cause of the dupe is also that GT modified the standard that modders use. Most people work with the recipe of a grid of ingots -> 1 block and 1 block -> 9 ingots. When you start changing this, of course mods which rely on this are going to be thoroughly ****ed.
If I'm disrespectful then call me out on it with examples and explanation. Just that you feel offended by what I've said doesn't automatically mean you were correct.
I can say exactly the same thing about you and the sentence would still be just as correct. Also, as you should know GT does have config options for most the changes so the whole point is moot.
RP2 was one of the first mods to add smelting to get back stuff (e.g doors). There are some others by now too, though none as popular as GT.
Also applying fortune smelting on anything non-ore is rather weird thing to do. Ok, so he doesn't like to farm wood to make charcoal. He should just add wood to the whitelist together with ores then, not apply smelting on every single thing out there.
I'm about to do some experiments and be back. I'm going to use Resonant Rise without GT and see if I can find an exploit with fortune-autosmelt. See you in about 30 minutes.
I'll add 1.5.2ngt, New World mod pack, and HappyDiggers AMP. I should find at least one in all of that, right?
If any of these changes he were making actually added balance to vanilla Minecraft you might have a point, but he doesn't, all he's done is force you to spend more time grinding away to obtain the materials you need to perform the most basic of functions, getting four planks per log was never imbalanced, and if anything were ever imbalanced about iron tools vs stone it was certainly never that they were too easy to acquire. All these recent changes do is pigeonhole you into using Greg's machines and tools, don't want to throw away ingots making plates so you can have your basic tools? Better get cracking on that plate bending machine. Don't want to waste time punching twice as many trees to build your log cabin? Get that sawmill up and running ASAP.
So while I was working out how much work would be involved in creating an ocean of liquid meat (5 buckets is an okay start...) and in finding a place under the netherlava to build, 3 pages were added to this. *sigh*
imo mods are supposed to add to the game, not take away. I feel like he's trying to make his own game. Though I don't have a full comprehension regarding the changes he's made, from what I'm reading it just sounds like he's just changing everything for the sake of "hardmode".
But it's not even hardmode, it's stupidmode. It makes you waste more time/resources getting there and like Dee_Twenty said, pigeonholes you. No other, older, just-as or better established mods attempt to change the game in the way he does from what I'm reading, yet have much less controversy/issues regarding the mod itself.
But it's not even hardmode, it's stupidmode. It makes you waste more time/resources getting there and like Dee_Twenty said, pigeonholes you. No other, older, just-as or better established mods attempt to change the game in the way he does from what I'm reading, yet have much less controversy/issues regarding the mod itself.
If there's a standard it's that smelting doesn't apply fortune. It's a standard set by vanilla. GregTech smelting blocks is an example of expecting smelting to not apply fortune.
There's also a standard that "ores can be processed for increased output" set by a wide variety of mods. The two can be combined to still give us a smelt+fortune mining pick, Dartcraft does it. But when there's no check that it's an ore being smelted, then it's violating that standard that smelting doesn't apply fortune and is a dupe.
Remember: Iron desks in bibliotech that can be smelted to reclaim their iron. Tinker's will dupe such a block.
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