Should some mods just stop being updated in packs?

[jordsta95]

I'm quite baffled how PneumaticCraft is just thrown out there as replacing IC2 functionality, with the silent implication that PC is "better" than IC2 for some reason.
Isn't PneumaticCraft more involved to set up than IC2? (Breaking chambers, collecting enough annoying flowers to get plastic, automating the interfaces, setting up multiple chambers since the output filtering is strange
I'm not saying I wasn't enjoying setting up PC, it was a challenge and it has its rewards, but it's definitely up there, and not comparable with TE.

BTW, I also want to express how incredibly arrogant I find a statement like "Fz needs not be public anymore". Thank you for all your original ideas, neptune, now copied in other mods, but you may go and die now.

I'm not saying that neptune shouldn't be thanked for their work. But when there are mods that add said features, but in a "better" way (whether it be less lag, more customizable - in terms of barrels for example, etc.) I just feel it is something that isn't really needed.
Don't get me wrong, if someone wants to just have 1 mod that adds barrels and an ore doubling mechanic, but not much more. Fine, Fz is great. But I just feel it is being tossed into packs, when it doesn't really get used over the "better" variant.
I probably should edit some of the OP to state what I really mean (I am terrible with explaining stuff to start with) but if I do that, then people would state that I am "censoring" what I said, or that I am just trying to stop people shouting at me

 

[Reika]

But I just feel it is being tossed into packs, when it doesn't really get used over the "better" variant.

People can add whatever mods they want to have in a pack, whether they plan to use them or not. Is it silly? I suppose, especially for mods that add worldgen or computational load even when unused, but that is their decision and not open to criticism from a third party unaffected by the decision.

 

[Bagman817]

I'm quite baffled how PneumaticCraft is just thrown out there as replacing IC2 functionality, with the silent implication that PC is "better" than IC2 for some reason.
Isn't PneumaticCraft more involved to set up than IC2? (Breaking chambers, collecting enough annoying flowers to get plastic, automating the interfaces, setting up multiple chambers since the output filtering is strange
I'm not saying I wasn't enjoying setting up PC, it was a challenge and it has its rewards, but it's definitely up there, and not comparable with TE.

BTW, I also want to express how incredibly arrogant I find a statement like "Fz needs not be public anymore". Thank you for all your original ideas, neptune, now copied in other mods, but you may go and die now.

This. It's one thing to say "I think this mod is out dated and I'm not going to play it or include it in a pack." It's quite another to say "You should stop working on your hobby, because someone else did what your mod does, only better." I routinely remove some mods from the FTB packs for a variety of reasons, but I completely support the mod author's continuing development. More DNA in the gene pool is a good thing.

 

[Golrith]

I'm not saying that neptune shouldn't be thanked for their work. But when there are mods that add said features, but in a "better" way (whether it be less lag, more customizable - in terms of barrels for example, etc.) I just feel it is something that isn't really needed.
Don't get me wrong, if someone wants to just have 1 mod that adds barrels and an ore doubling mechanic, but not much more. Fine, Fz is great. But I just feel it is being tossed into packs, when it doesn't really get used over the "better" variant.
I probably should edit some of the OP to state what I really mean (I am terrible with explaining stuff to start with) but if I do that, then people would state that I am "censoring" what I said, or that I am just trying to stop people shouting at me

I know where you are coming from regarding Fz. I love it's solar tower system (great example of an excellently designed "multiblock") and I have used it's ore processing system (which was a fun project to automate without using routers), but it falls into the "odd man out" category. One part of the mod has really cheap recipes and quite easy to use, another part has expensive recipes and quite complex to get to grips with, and finally another part has a different world gen requirement that conflicts with all other mods requirements. So when put in a big mod pack, various design concepts of the mod clash with pretty much every mod.
Thinking about it, a lot of it could nowadays be adjusted with Minetweaker to suit the "balance/progression" of the pack it's in, but I remember using it pre MT days and couldn't quite see why it was included (I really only used it for Barrels before Jabba) and unfortunately that attitude has stuck with me.

In this day and age, modpacks are beyond just throwing mods together and hoping for the best. Tools now exist to make the gameplay more unified/seamless. I'd rather modders spend time working out new systems and "balancing" recipes against vanilla and the mod itself, and leave mod pack "balancing" to the mod pack developers.
Just like textures in a mod, some modders are great at texturing/recipe balancing, others are not.

 

[jordsta95]

Just like textures in a mod, some modders are great at texturing/recipe balancing, others are not.

*waves*

 

[ljfa]

I guess the problems here are greater than just recipe balancing.
But maybe someone can pull off a decent pack which focuses around Fz early game...maybe...

 

[Wagon153]

He could just update xycraft and make everything purple
And this isn't a shower thought, it's actually something I talk about a fair bit, as it does seem to get at me more than it should...
If you wanted updates on my shower thoughts you'd be getting "why does cake, and bacon taste good, but cake and bacon taste terrible?"

Psssssst. http://www.reddit.com/r/feedthebeast/comments/2sa0z3/is_it_really_dead/

Tl;dr: Xycraft being ported and maintained by Chisel dev.

 

[jordsta95]

Psssssst. http://www.reddit.com/r/feedthebeast/comments/2sa0z3/is_it_really_dead/

Tl;dr: Xycraft being ported and maintained by Chisel dev.

It was linked earlier. And TBH I never really liked and/or cared for Xycraft, I just wanted to get on the "Soaryn is the world's laziest mod dev" band wagon

 

[ljfa]

It was linked earlier. And TBH I never really liked and/or cared for Xycraft, I just wanted to get on the "Soaryn is the world's laziest mod dev" band wagon

So who is developing it now? Soaryn? TheCricket? Chickenbones?
I haven't really used Xycraft either but looks like most of its features already exist in some form in other mods. Apart from the decoration that is.

 

[jordsta95]

So who is developing it now? Soaryn? TheCricket? Chickenbones?
I haven't really used Xycraft either but looks like most of its features already exist in some form in other mods. Apart from the decoration that is.

Oh, no. I think you'll find Xycraft's main feature in almost every poorly built mod pack (they don't disabled different same type ore gen)... you get half an inventory filled with different "shards" (I think they were called)

 

[ljfa]

Oh, no. I think you'll find Xycraft's main feature in almost every poorly built mod pack (they don't disabled different same type ore gen)... you get half an inventory filled with different "shards" (I think they were called)

That's basically all I remember about Xycraft from 1.4 as well. I only played like two mods back then and most of the ores and stuff from the others were just hanging out in chests. Yea chests. I didn't do anything with Applied Energistics either.

 

[King Lemming]

Hey guys, so if you have seen me around on the forums you know I am very vocal about some mods and their insistence to keep updating, even though they are "useless" nowadays.
Some of the mods I am on about include Factorization, and IC2-exp. I am not going to make this a rant thread about why we don't need these mods anymore, I am sure that, if you wanted to, you could find my many rants on mods such as these.
But I will say the following just to carry forward this discussion...
I don't think these mods have a place in modded minecraft any more, Fz moreso than IC2-exp. because they are made obsolete by much "better" mods that do a lot more. For example, Fz's main selling point was it's barrels, JABBA has much better barrels, that look so much nicer, and then everything else in Fz was made obsolete either last minecraft version, or the version before. As for IC2-exp. it should be called IC3 because of how much it has changed since it became IC2-exp., but also because it drags out the ore processing process whereas other mods try to make it quick and easy... also EU, which I just have a personal biased against.
I was just wondering what you think of mods like these, of course feel free to name your own, start a discussion about why these mods should stay, etc.

Just as a side note, I am not saying these mods are bad in any way, I just feel they are no longer relevant due to the other mods that are out there, and as most of us play with these other mods then they are becoming less and less used, or at least from what I have seen.

No. It doesn't matter who uses the mods, it matters if the modders enjoy making them. Popularity should have no sway in whether or not a mod lives or dies; that's entirely up to the author. In the case of TE, you'll notice that we haven't caved to most of the extremely common (and trivial) requests, such as a quarry replacement. Modders make the mods they want to make. People play the mods they want to play. The two should not be linked unless a modder has such low self esteem that they need the validation of the masses.

I hate seeing threads like this. It implies some mods are better then others and have no place in the current state of Minecraft. All of which is untrue. Fine, you don't like IC2 and Factorization. But others enjoy IC2 and Factorization and would hate to see those mods dropped from packs. So my answer is no. As long as the mod is around, there will be somebody to enjoy it. Not everybody is tied to the whole Thermal Expansion/RF circlejerk.

This. In fact, a large part of why ducts have been split off from TE (and why I haven't been in a hurry to bring them back) is because I didn't want TE to take over all of modded MC. It's bad for the community, and it's bad for CoFH. Although do you really have to call it a circlejerk? You can state that a mod isn't your cup of tea without insulting the people who play it, or the mod itself.

TL, DR: This is a toxic discussion. And in general, don't be jerks.

 

[ljfa]

This. In fact, a large part of why ducts have been split off from TE (and why I haven't been in a hurry to bring them back) is because I didn't want TE to take over all of modded MC.

Looks like that's exactly what Ender IO did.

You can state that a mod isn't your cup of tea without insulting the people who play it, or the mod itself.

This. A discussion about this is fine but looks like you were flamebaiting a bit too much in the OP, Jordan. No offense

 

[jordsta95]

This. A discussion about this is fine but looks like you were flamebaiting a bit too much in the OP, Jordan. No offense

I probably should edit some of the OP to state what I really mean (I am terrible with explaining stuff to start with) but if I do that, then people would state that I am "censoring" what I said, or that I am just trying to stop people shouting at me

 

[Wagon153]

No. It doesn't matter who uses the mods, it matters if the modders enjoy making them. Popularity should have no sway in whether or not a mod lives or dies; that's entirely up to the author. In the case of TE, you'll notice that we haven't caved to most of the extremely common (and trivial) requests, such as a quarry replacement. Modders make the mods they want to make. People play the mods they want to play. The two should not be linked unless a modder has such low self esteem that they need the validation of the masses.



This. In fact, a large part of why ducts have been split off from TE (and why I haven't been in a hurry to bring them back) is because I didn't want TE to take over all of modded MC. It's bad for the community, and it's bad for CoFH. Although do you really have to call it a circlejerk? You can state that a mod isn't your cup of tea without insulting the people who play it, or the mod itself.

TL, DR: This is a toxic discussion. And in general, don't be jerks.

Yeah I could have worded that better.

 

[King Lemming]

Looks like that's exactly what Ender IO did.

Not really. The game is perfectly playable without EnderIO. Or without TE. I just feel that a choice in item transport mods is a good thing. Linking item transport to TE makes it a false choice and isn't good.

When TD does release, it'll be a reasonable method of moving things about and it'll fit with existing stuff. Ducts in 1.6.4 were a bit too cheap and a bit too good. EIO basically copied the formula and raised the cost a bit. I want them to be a bit more interesting than that. EIO isn't my cup of tea, but it's a good mod.

 

[jordsta95]

Not really. The game is perfectly playable without EnderIO. Or without TE. I just feel that a choice in item transport mods is a good thing. Linking item transport to TE makes it a false choice and isn't good.

When TD does release, it'll be a reasonable method of moving things about and it'll fit with existing stuff. Ducts in 1.6.4 were a bit too cheap and a bit too good. EIO basically copied the formula and raised the cost a bit. I want them to be a bit more interesting than that. EIO isn't my cup of tea, but it's a good mod.

I agree with this, when I first saw EnderIO I was very objected to it, mainly because the conduits all being 1 block occupied is waaaaaay too OP if you ask me. And that seems to be the reason a lot of people use EIO as their "main" tech mod.
But I will admit that a lot of people did use TE ducts, which is fine, but there were also a lot of people who started to use ExUtils as item/liquid transport near to the end of 1.6. I think it's just one of those "it's the same mod/dev team, so the stuff WILL work" ideology. A lot of people still don't use BC kinesis pipes for RF transport, even though they are cheaper than what they are aiming for (ExUtils energy transport), and I think that is because they just don't know it works. And I think it is good that TE ducts didn't get released with the machines, as it makes people try out other mods... shame the EIO seems to have stolen that spotlight (just because it does it so well - in the sense that everything works 100% of the time, and can transfer up to 2x as much as the next best thing in other big mods e.g. energy conduits buildcraft diamond pipes do 10,048, and EIO does 20,096... or something to that effect)

 

[Reika]

when I first saw EnderIO I was very objected to it, mainly because the conduits all being 1 block occupied is waaaaaay too OP if you ask me.

Maybe this is just the wording, but you seem to have a bit of a problem with the existence of mods you do not like. Though I do not share the opinion, I could understand disagreeing on whether EiO is balanced because of the multiconduit capacity, but saying you "were very objected to it" to me implies you were displeased it existed.

 

[ljfa]

Maybe this is just the wording, but you seem to have a bit of a problem with the existence of mods you do not like. Though I do not share the opinion, I could understand disagreeing on whether EiO is balanced because of the multiconduit capacity, but saying you "were very objected to it" to me implies you were displeased it existed.

Which is a bit reasonable for someone making modpacks. "You didn't include Ender IO? How am I supposed to move items and liquids around?"

 

[Padfoote]

Which is a bit reasonable for someone making modpacks. "You didn't include Ender IO? How am I supposed to move items and liquids around?"

That boils down to a lack of understanding of multiple mods. People seem to focus on a handful of generally accepted mods and don't experiment outside of that.