Is Rotarycraft stupidly difficult or am I the stupid one?
- Thread starter Dragonchampion
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Do you accept that the PC is universally better for gaming then any console ever made in the years of yesterday, today, and tomorrow?
Then you are not a Console Gaming Peasant. For it is really that simple. Those who accept the truth of the matter are PC Master Race members. Those who do not are at best misguided but well meaning fools.
While the world is in no way short on fools, the supply does not outpace the demand, so the fools will remain until such a time that people start not wanting fools.
And when that does happen, take shelter. Because it'll get ugly. Like, Thermonuclear War level ugly.
Ah, those were the good ol' days. I remember my training for Speed Running in Quake years later, and the handful of mods we used, and the insane bullshit we did with them. Good times.
Good times...
Look guys, maybe he wasn't right, but all this trashtalk looks really ugly. Is it a "Praise Reika" party or something like that?
It looks like every guy who says that RC is too complex is getting flamed to death with all that "LOL YOU TOO STOOPID" crap. Yes, suggesting to switch to RF is kinda stupid idea, but if the mod often called "overcomplicated", maybe there are reasons for that.
I guess, one of the issues I have with it is "false realism" when some stuff is claimed realistic, while it's not. Reika likes to justify something with realism, while there are lots of stuff that's clearly not realistic. Example: ethanol crystals. I guess you can crystallize ethanol somehow (not even sure), but I doubt that it's an easy thing and it's definitely not the way you get ethanol naturally.
There are also stuff that's not designed good well enough. Example: steel purifier. AFAIR, RotaryCraft steel is the easiest to make and it's used the most, so why would you ever use the purifier adding another step in steel production?
Other example: magnetostatic nerf. Let's put it straight - some people want to use complicated RC power system, some find it tedious and not really interested in. Forcing the latter to use more of RC won't make them happy. Basically I see it as "U PLAY THE MOD NOT THE WAY I WANT U TO!?!!"
The power network itself was discussed quite a lot, so I won't address it. Though, it's funny how often you see magnetostatic engines in Reikas video tour (if I'm not mistaking it with some other vid).
It looks like every guy who says that RC is too complex is getting flamed to death with all that "LOL YOU TOO STOOPID" crap. Yes, suggesting to switch to RF is kinda stupid idea, but if the mod often called "overcomplicated", maybe there are reasons for that.
I guess, one of the issues I have with it is "false realism" when some stuff is claimed realistic, while it's not. Reika likes to justify something with realism, while there are lots of stuff that's clearly not realistic. Example: ethanol crystals. I guess you can crystallize ethanol somehow (not even sure), but I doubt that it's an easy thing and it's definitely not the way you get ethanol naturally.
There are also stuff that's not designed good well enough. Example: steel purifier. AFAIR, RotaryCraft steel is the easiest to make and it's used the most, so why would you ever use the purifier adding another step in steel production?
Other example: magnetostatic nerf. Let's put it straight - some people want to use complicated RC power system, some find it tedious and not really interested in. Forcing the latter to use more of RC won't make them happy. Basically I see it as "U PLAY THE MOD NOT THE WAY I WANT U TO!?!!"
The power network itself was discussed quite a lot, so I won't address it. Though, it's funny how often you see magnetostatic engines in Reikas video tour (if I'm not mistaking it with some other vid).
Okay, let's see...
Oh dear. Seems I may have a few bones to pick on this one.
First off, can one solidify pretty much any fluid. For example, one can do it if you get it below the freezing point or if you make it impure enough to be solid at room temperature. I'm not sure in why Reika has his fermenter release solid ethanol crystals because I'm fairly sure that's crazy. Though it may be crystalline because of impurities and hence running it through a machine to melt/purify it would make the fluid, but they would AFAIK be usable as is. Sorta like how Force Gems in DartCraft can be used outright instead of liquid force, but it's inefficient.
Next, the steel purifier: What's your problem with it again? It lets you take other mod's steel and make it into HLSA Steel. So what? Oh, why does it exist if other mods can't use HLSA Steel? Because maybe other mods make it cheaper and faster? Or you have a stockpile of other mods steel and want HLSA Steel for something? It's a way to make ore dictionary steel into HSLA Steel.
The Magentostatic Nerf: And here comes the waterworks. "I don't want to use RotaryCraft power for this task, I want to use RF! Why don't you understand Reika!?" In all fairness, the nerf merely works on the same level of logic as getting a loan: In order to make the upgrade, you must be able to produce more power then what the upgrade will give you. Ends up being very good, as before, but now some work is involved. So, as to why Reika is using RF stuff on the same network as his RoC stuff? Because RF is easier to store and send across dimensions. Convenient. Not better, just easier.
Yeah, I know that and actually pointed it out in a post a while ago. My definition was incomplete, so let's start anew. The point is rather that renewable resources replenish themselves within a given separate but open system (using Wikipedia's definition). That the energy to do so ultimately comes from somewhere and uses non-renewable resources in a larger context is beside the point. So nuclear power would count as renewable if only resources that replenish themselves (on Earth, ultimately using energy from the sun) are used as fuel. Being replenished by a technological process that in turn uses only other renewable resources also counts of course. Does nuclear power utilizing breeder technology fit that requirement? Could you run a breeder facility basically forever without mining more than an initial amount of fissionable material to jumpstart the process? If so, I concede the point.
Do you remember when I said the only place where I don't care about the giant holes I'm digging in the landscape with my auto-mining machines is the Deep Dark? Because the MC world is infinite, It's an aesthetic preference (but no less powerful for being "merely" aesthetic), which it would be in the real world, too, if we could build our own ecosystems. We can't do that yet, so the resources we consume is actually a somewhat important consideration for the survival of our species. When I transfer that consideration into the world of MC as a preference for minimizing the impact of my tech setups on the landscape, I don't expect anyone else to care about it, but I won't be told there is no point to it.
I did. I'm now confused. What did I miss? I was attempting to refute your arguments.
It's a complex mod, true. Maybe even overcomplicated. But what's wrong with that? It works great. It's fairly easy to understand. You raise a solid point on the Ethanol. I try to understand and explain why it may be being output as a solid(not the normal state for a fluid, nor do I think that Fermenting it would release much of it usable as solids.
The steel purifier is for getting stockpiles of other mod's steel into steel for RoC.
And if you don't like the Magentostatic nerf, well, ask Reika to buff it.
But there's an old saying:
Meddle not in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
Bit of a wall of text, but I highlighted the most important part that I feel is most important. I like to keep my resources as renewable as I can. The flip side is that it's not easy to renew fissile materials in real life, but in Minecraft, there's a bee for that.
Funny thing is that you make them in furnace so they should be quite hot when they are ready
Also fluid ethanol would make it kinda more interesting to use (we don't have any low-level engines in other mods that use liquid fuel)
But anyways, lots of "realism" is not really needed. Realistic heating and cooling? I don't think it would be noticeable if the model was more simple. And funny thing is that if you put a steam engine heated by lava and a cooling fin on it, engine will have the temperature of ~120C while fin will be at ~20C. So, how does it cool the engine then? Realistic cooling model, but such bad mistakes.
My problem is that from my experience, RoC steel is the easiest to make (maybe except for mekanism one) and you usually make a lot more RoC steel than other kinds of steel.
It's more like "I don't want to go through all the RoC stages to use a bit of its stuff". I don't think that mod should fight players by forcing them to make certain stuff or go through every parts of mod. It's a Gregtech stuff when you are basically forced to play gregtech if you want to do anything.
Once again, sorry, it turns out it's not you, but I didn't read your post deep enough and took it as offesive.
The difference is all in the tone. I do understand that some people like things easier. Hell, there are areas where I like things easier so I tend to not use RotaryCraft for those, and there have been times when I was tired of having to overcome yet another "how the hell do I do this?" moment. I have even occasionally complained about having to redesign systems after an update, and I still think such complaints are legitimate.
However, I don't go around claiming that RotaryCraft is "stupidly difficult" and that it should switch to native RF.
Many mods have a similar philosophy. "You want to use advanced machine X from my mod? You need to build some other infrastructure from my mod at least once." I don't see a problem with that. You can, for instance, go through the tech tree and build a tier 5 magnetostatic that provides as much power to your RoC extractor as a gas turbine, and the only other thing you need is a grinder to make lubricant with materials supplied by Forestry bees or a canola farm run by Thaumcraft golems. So really, you don't need to keep an RoC infrastructure with all the pesky ethanol and jet fuel production, but you need it once to make what you want.
Where I agree with you are those cases where tech gating gets in the way of cross-mod consistency. Tungsten and ethanol being the primary examples. It plainly offends my world-builder's sense of consistency, to say nothing of the realism that is often used to argue in RotaryCraft's favor, that the RoC variants are not interchangable with those of other mods, and I do question Reika's priorities here. Steel is another example, though it's not often brought up since it's so much easier to make in RotaryCraft, and there is a config setting to make it available as steel to other mods.
I think evidence suggests that Reika doesn't dislike the RF system, with how much support for it was added lately. RF cable and turbine generators come to mind, and making magnetostatics tiered actually made them more useful than before, even if they became harder to make, and harder to run with v25. He just doesn't like it if people use it to bypass part of RotaryCraft's tech tree.
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All in all, no harm. But as for the RoC "tiers", they only exist in rough ways; you need an extractor to get wolfram for later machines, and the engines produce different amounts of power and it's kinda hard to make better ones without using less awesome ones first.Funny thing is that you make them in furnace so they should be quite hot when they are ready
Also fluid ethanol would make it kinda more interesting to use (we don't have any low-level engines in other mods that use liquid fuel)
But anyways, lots of "realism" is not really needed. Realistic heating and cooling? I don't think it would be noticeable if the model was more simple. And funny thing is that if you put a steam engine heated by lava and a cooling fin on it, engine will have the temperature of ~120C while fin will be at ~20C. So, how does it cool the engine then? Realistic cooling model, but such bad mistakes.
My problem is that from my experience, RoC steel is the easiest to make (maybe except for mekanism one) and you usually make a lot more RoC steel than other kinds of steel.
It's more like "I don't want to go through all the RoC stages to use a bit of its stuff". I don't think that mod should fight players by forcing them to make certain stuff or go through every parts of mod. It's a Gregtech stuff when you are basically forced to play gregtech if you want to do anything.
Once again, sorry, it turns out it's not you, but I didn't read your post deep enough and took it as offesive.
But, it's not impossible. One could go from a bunch of DC Engines to a AC engine setup being used to power a industrial coil seeking to gather enough bedrock dust to make the best gears and shafts possible. Easy? Oh hell no. Possible? Oh hell yes.
TL;DR? No harm no fowl.