Gold and silver is cheaper when it saves you iron, copper, and rubber. And when you talk about the energy cost, could you please remind me of the time that you needed more that a geothermal or two and a handful of solar panels to power your workshop? (not your mass fab) vanilla IC2 is in sore need of more energy consuming machines. as far as time goes, that encourages building larger assembly lines with parallelism. If you are really impatient you can always add overclockers, heatvents, or heating coils to improve speed and/or efficiency. any effective gregtech setup will use several machines, heck, the multiblocks are built around it. It does happen to make keeping up with a quarry a non-trivial matter, which it should be. I will also note that when I said free, I was referring to processes that you would be doing anyway in order to gain other important resources. That makes them free. Finally, the cheaper costs for things does actually matter because, as I said before, Gregtech extends the tech tree a substantial amount. In vanilla IC2 you get creative mode after you start up your mass fab. at that point, you are correct that resources do not really matter. however, in gregtech, resoure efficiency is a very important consideration throughout the game. Anyway, if you don't care about how much stuff costs, then why are you complaining about the expensive recipes?
FTB Mod Discussion: Greg-Tech
- Thread starter Sky Noble
- Start date
-
The FTB Forum is now read-only, and is here as an archive. To participate in our community discussions, please join our Discord! https://ftb.team/discord
Seems like we have a new GTB lover...ILGT you are not alone anymore...
That was a very effective response you just made. You couldn't come up with any logical argument, so you resorted to name-calling.
As I have said before, I recommend that you actually give gregtech a try. you will find that it breathes new life into IC2. At the very least, play with the recipes and machines in NEI before you continue posting here, as you clearly have no experience with gregtech whatsoever.
As I have said before, I recommend that you actually give gregtech a try. you will find that it breathes new life into IC2. At the very least, play with the recipes and machines in NEI before you continue posting here, as you clearly have no experience with gregtech whatsoever.
gave gregtech a try
played 10 secs
closed FTB
sent it to obvlibion
live happily forever after
???
profit!
edit: in what way is the macerator cheaper? or the drill? or the nano saber? or the laser? or bronze? or tin buckets? or scaffolds? or cells?
played 10 secs
closed FTB
sent it to obvlibion
live happily forever after
???
profit!
edit: in what way is the macerator cheaper? or the drill? or the nano saber? or the laser? or bronze? or tin buckets? or scaffolds? or cells?
I applaud your closed-mindedness. This is exactly what I am talking about. Difficulty is a GOOD thing in games, a longer tech tree is a GOOD thing. They keep the game fun for much longer, and give you goals and things to work towards. The whole reason I started with modded minecraft was because I became bored after running out of things to do in vanilla. Can you just get over the fact that you have to play the game for more than a couple of hours before you get the quantum suit, and accept that you are in for a longer tech progression? isn't that what FTB is supposed to offer compared to Vanilla? If you want to be able to do everything right at the start, just play in creative mode. I like feeling like I accomplished something when I finally build a matter fab, or get my first pieces of iridium. It gives me a reason to keep playing.
Actually, given that resource in Minecraft are generally found in clusters or 'veins', it can be argued that recipes that use less varied resources are cheaper in some manner than recipes using a higher variety. In a system with tiered resource groupings, with similar spawn rates within tiers, where resource come in veins using two materials from a lower tier may require more effect that using one material from a higher tier, as find two veins will require more effort than finding one. Now, while Minecraft resources are not tiered in such away, there are materials with similar rarities, so a comparison can be made. Given that cost can measured using a number of factors, cheapness in one area may result in more expense in another.
Also, I recommend you play games other than Minecraft, in order to develop a finer understanding of the medium and it's and enjoyment.
EDIT:
Increased time consumption generally does not lead to increased difficulty. As suggested above, playing a wider variety of games will allow you to experience a range of difficulty levels, and types.
You neglected to take into account that the GT recipe requires no tin, or redstone. thus it takes the same number of resources. plus, as I said before you can get all of those resources from other sources, so you don't have to mine at all. all that aside, You really are missing the point. Gregtech does not make things "more expensive". It extends the tech tree. Since the IC2 tech tree ends by giving you infinite resources, in order for this to be possible, many things had to be moved back in the tech tree. you simply cannot have a tech tree past the point when you have infinite resources. As I have said repeatedly just give gregtech a try. It is not a difficult mod. It simply requires a larger investment of time. the same thing that FTB does for Vanilla minecraft. I don't see people complaining that railcraft changes the rail recipes. Most people find it enjoyable, because it adds more complexity to the process, and makes it more interesting that simply iron and a stick. that is exactly what gregtech does. It adds a whole ton of complex options and ways to get things. It's the same reason that people like terrafirmacraft or better than wolves. It gives the game more depth.
And since you brought up the subject of other games, I do play a great deal of games besides minecraft. some of my personal favorites are Dwarf fortress, eve online, and kerbal space program. Those are all very complex, but rewarding games. If I wanted the easy gaming eperience you seem to be advocating, I would play angry birds or farmville
And since you brought up the subject of other games, I do play a great deal of games besides minecraft. some of my personal favorites are Dwarf fortress, eve online, and kerbal space program. Those are all very complex, but rewarding games. If I wanted the easy gaming eperience you seem to be advocating, I would play angry birds or farmville
IMHO the mass fab is the worst addition to IC2 by a long shot. It's obviously intended as some kind of "IC2 end game" but such a creative mode proxy just makes the game boring.[DOUBLEPOST=1369690464][/DOUBLEPOST]
No one is arguing against that adding complexity through additional machines and stuff is good. What people are arguing against is that just adding the time it takes to craft something doesn't add difficulty, it just adds tedium instead.
Like I said before: I like that GregTech adds cool complex machines (the fusion reactor for example is very cool IMHO, too bad there's pretty much no documentation). Unfortunately he doesn't seem to have a focus or a plan in developing his mod and is now adding / nerfing stuff nilly willy.
Funny that you mention TFC by the way. TFC could be brilliant if it weren't as tedious as it is currently.
Let's talk about the time requirements. I can honestly say that at no time while playing gregtech have I found myself sitting around waiting for a machine to process. Gregtech machines are built around automation. they are designed to be automated, so to encourage that, they take a long time to process. no-one would bother making a automatic ore processing machine if macerating and smelting was instantaneous. the same thing applies here. Automating greg's machines is one of the requirements for progression in the mod. It does not add tedium, it makes you come up with interesting ways to automate the various machines, and makes you have to invest resources in order to allow your processing line to keep up with your resource intake. you do not end up sitting around waiting for things. the few cases where you are going to be doing the process manually, have a very short processing time. I will also note that in the most recent versions of gregtech, the time requirements of things has been reduced, but you process less at a time. that also serves to remove tedium.
Also, If you think that greg does not have a plan for his mod development, that you obviously have not been keeping up with his thread at all.
Also, If you think that greg does not have a plan for his mod development, that you obviously have not been keeping up with his thread at all.
one more thing should be taken into account. aluminium. at a certain point, either when you ran into a large bauxite veine or a redrock biome, or some other clay source (centrifuge dirt, sludge boiler) you get a decent replacement for refined iron (in a lot of gt-recipes).
and energy wise: it's really hard not to find energy with GT. the oil wells from buildcraft, the large amounts of biofuel, very powerful reactors from IC2 with even more powerful plutonium cells or with thorium that has some virtually never depleting sources.
by the way, my favorite adv. alloy recipe: invar + brass + aluminium. gives 5 pieces for 2 pieces or iron + 1 nickel, 3 copper + 1 zinc (gives 4 brass) and 3 aluminium, which is really hard not to find in the world.
and energy wise: it's really hard not to find energy with GT. the oil wells from buildcraft, the large amounts of biofuel, very powerful reactors from IC2 with even more powerful plutonium cells or with thorium that has some virtually never depleting sources.
by the way, my favorite adv. alloy recipe: invar + brass + aluminium. gives 5 pieces for 2 pieces or iron + 1 nickel, 3 copper + 1 zinc (gives 4 brass) and 3 aluminium, which is really hard not to find in the world.
As an extra note, you can overclock GT machines in most 1.5 versions as well. Halves the time taken, quadruples the EU usage. But you can easily compensate for the EU usage thing!
As someone returning to the game after a long time, and changing over from Tekkit to FTB now, I just really have to say I do not like how GregTech is reaching out and changing OTHER MODS and how they work. It's hard enough to learn and get used to IC2 and especially nuclear reactors as it is without some guy fiddling with the recipes and how reactors work and decay and build heat and so on when it's not even his mod.
That alone wouldn't be -too- bad to overcome, and in fact I was co-existing with gregtech in FTB Ultimate v1.0.1 so far after learning to disable the expensive recipes for most of the items (I left the expensive laser and nanosword recipes on because those just felt like they should be pricier). But then I saw this little snippet in the v1.1.0 changelog for ultimate, and I quote, "* I changed tons of Crafting Recipes, including Mixed Metal Ingots, Dense Copper Plates and almost every Machine. I won't add any Config to revert that massive change!"
.... No. Done. Deleted from my modpack. And I vote for it to be removed from Ultimate in the future. -_-
That alone wouldn't be -too- bad to overcome, and in fact I was co-existing with gregtech in FTB Ultimate v1.0.1 so far after learning to disable the expensive recipes for most of the items (I left the expensive laser and nanosword recipes on because those just felt like they should be pricier). But then I saw this little snippet in the v1.1.0 changelog for ultimate, and I quote, "* I changed tons of Crafting Recipes, including Mixed Metal Ingots, Dense Copper Plates and almost every Machine. I won't add any Config to revert that massive change!"
.... No. Done. Deleted from my modpack. And I vote for it to be removed from Ultimate in the future. -_-
Dude. It's just using plates (made in a plate bender machine) instead of normal ingots. It's really not that bad. Yes, it is a douchey thing to do to not include configs about it, but at the same time, it makes Mixed Metal Ingots 3x cheaper! You only have to use 1 ingot of each type instead of 3, and you get the same yield back out.
At least try it? If you don't like it after trying it, then that's fine and I accept that. But pleeeaaaase try it?
for some reason i expected to see "random korean f2p mmorpg" on the list...
after reading about automation, it seems that gregtech heavily relies on other mods in order to be viable, and thus barely playable on its own, yet tends to screw another mod`s recipes. assuming this, it doesnt look like extension to ic2(if it was, it wouldnt fuck with things it didnt add), its more like a necromancer, adding various partы to a dead corpse, hoping for resurrection. would make more sense to resurrect and give some nice tools.
I understand, I even expected it might be that he's made some recipes cheaper, and I might give it another shot. But you have to understand, it's that very principle of how he's screwing with how the other mods work that's the problem with the mod being in this pack. I was reading some of the first pages and saw a post mentioning how GT at one point (maybe it still does) made it so you were forced to set up GregTech all the way up to an 'Industrial Blast Furnace' just to be able to access the nether, because it changed the flint and steel recipe to actually require a steel nugget now. Not only did that effectively boot the player out of the nether unless they decided to give in and build the GT series of machines, but it also effectively disabled any other mod that required materials from the nether. That is not cool, okay? Hopefully that change has been reverted by now, but it's that attitude on the mod author's part that makes his mod leave me with a bad taste in my mouth. If you don't intend to play well with others, your mod shouldn't be part of a large pack like this.
Greg said he was planning on adding one time use matches so you don't need steel to go to the Nether, villagers should still be able to trade flint and steel, steel ingots can be gotten from chests, Ars Magica has spells to ignite nether portals, if you get those desert flowers (I believe they're TC3) you can make a fire charge to ignite the portal, and lastly, you can ignite a portal with lava and wood. Him changing flint and steel just makes it less convenient and more annoying without his added matches - it doesn't force you to go deep into gregtech to build a nether portal. Also, that large line of machines needed to make steel via gregtech also require glowstone.
WTF?! This is the first time I dont really like a GT update.. At least we have more options.. but.. :/ He should have waited until matches were done before changing Flint and Steel..
And if we are going for the realistic shit here, it isn't neither iron or steel, but manganese which is used in survival for fires.. (I do sportive survival as a hobby, and i have one of them rocks
)if we go for realism, it can be just flint and flintAnd if we are going for the realistic shit here, it isn't neither iron or steel, but manganese which is used in survival for fires.. (I do sportive survival as a hobby, and i have one of them rocks
Nope, flint and flint wouldn't be instantaneous.. Manganese rocks do it in just a sec..
(And lasts a lot.. not like flint + flint which you would need to find more after a few tries)Nope, flint and flint wouldn't be instantaneous.. Manganese rocks do it in just a sec..
while not instant, its still a source of sparks, and thus fire. i dont think that many people when play minecraft care much about flint n steel`s durability