A Rotarycraft Thread (Meanders a little)

[Physicist]

Wow, have you tried running that through the power information screen? I can't imagine you're getting more than 50% of the power you ought to be getting (or at least you shouldn't be)

The ideal timer circuit is really simple, consisting of one comparator, a lever, and some dust. You could even make it wireless, then have receivers at the engines to make it single-block signal at the point of use.

 

[YX33A]

Is there a way to control what Rotary Craft's ore output on some ores is? I'm using Mimichite and the RotaryCraft version of the Mimichite stuff doesn't work outside of RotaryCraft recipes(so it's totally useless as a result). Which wouldn't be a problem if I could just tell RotaryCraft not to control that ore, but I don't know how and I'm super confused again. Uh, Help @Reika?

 

[Physicist]

Is there a way to control what Rotary Craft's ore output on some ores is? I'm using Mimichite and the RotaryCraft version of the Mimichite stuff doesn't work outside of RotaryCraft recipes(so it's totally useless as a result). Which wouldn't be a problem if I could just tell RotaryCraft not to control that ore, but I don't know how and I'm super confused again. Uh, Help @Reika?

You can shapelessly craft RC's Mimichite Gem into Mimicry's Mimichite.

Edit: Unless that was Minetweakered into the Monster Pack; If so, I recommend getting Minetweaker and pasting in the 3ish requisite lines from the Monster Minetweaker config.

 

[Physicist]

I'm having a cross-mod problem and I'm having trouble pinpointing how to solve it. I'm trying to use a Precision ME Import Bus to suck items out of a RotaryCraft Extractor at a pre-completion stage. In this case, Diamond Ore Solution.

Unfortunately, the bus isn't sucking it out. Thoughts?

Edit: Here's my setup.

Spoiler

The Import Buses that should be taking the programmed pre-completion products are on the N/E/S/W faces of the Extractors. Export Buses that are placing the pre-completion products are placing them in the Hoppers above the Extractors.

Power comes from an AC engine to power stages 1 and 4, and another AC engine geared to 131072 rad/s to power stages 2 and 3. All stages complete properly when pre-completion products are inserted by hand or by hopper. It's only extraction of anything that is the problem. I currently have it fully configured at all stages for Iron, Diamond, and Redstone Ores.

 

[Lathanael]

I'm having a cross-mod problem and I'm having trouble pinpointing how to solve it. I'm trying to use a Precision ME Import Bus to suck items out of a RotaryCraft Extractor at a pre-completion stage. In this case, Diamond Ore Solution.

Unfortunately, the bus isn't sucking it out. Thoughts?

Edit: Here's my setup.

Spoiler

The Import Buses that should be taking the programmed pre-completion products are on the N/E/S/W faces of the Extractors. Export Buses that are placing the pre-completion products are placing them in the Hoppers above the Extractors.

Power comes from an AC engine to power stages 1 and 4, and another AC engine geared to 131072 rad/s to power stages 2 and 3. All stages complete properly when pre-completion products are inserted by hand or by hopper. It's only extraction of anything that is the problem. I currently have it fully configured at all stages for Iron, Diamond, and Redstone Ores.

I don't think AE is capable of pulling out of SPECIFIC slots in a machines. Reika only assigned the Input Slot and the last Output Slots to the extractor block faces. You'll need something like the FZ Router to pull intermediate products from the extractor.

 

[Physicist]

I don't think AE is capable of pulling out of SPECIFIC slots in a machines. Reika only assigned the Input Slot and the last Output Slots to the extractor block faces. You'll need something like the FZ Router to pull intermediate products from the extractor.

But it is capable of pulling out specific items anywhere in a container.

Unfortunately even the Diamond Ore Flakes at the end of the production line aren't coming out. Edit: It does seem to pull Flakes or byproducts only from the East facing side. I can't seem to reorient the Extractor though, it always faces so you can only extract from East.

I expect it would be a problem for an unintelligent machine like a hopper to be able to pull everything in the whole machine out from the bottom, but this is very specifically configured: I place the exact item(s) I want extracted into the filter for the Precision Import Bus.

 

[Wagon153]

But it is capable of pulling out specific items anywhere in a container.

Unfortunately even the Diamond Ore Flakes at the end of the production line aren't coming out. Edit: It does seem to pull Flakes or byproducts only from the East facing side. I can't seem to reorient the Extractor though, it always faces so you can only extract from East.

I expect it would be a problem for an unintelligent machine like a hopper to be able to pull everything in the whole machine out from the bottom, but this is very specifically configured: I place the exact item(s) I want extracted into the filter for the Precision Import Bus.

I believe factorization routers can pull out of specific inventory slots without needing to worry about block sides.

 

[Reika]

But it is capable of pulling out specific items anywhere in a container.

Unfortunately even the Diamond Ore Flakes at the end of the production line aren't coming out. Edit: It does seem to pull Flakes or byproducts only from the East facing side. I can't seem to reorient the Extractor though, it always faces so you can only extract from East.

I expect it would be a problem for an unintelligent machine like a hopper to be able to pull everything in the whole machine out from the bottom, but this is very specifically configured: I place the exact item(s) I want extracted into the filter for the Precision Import Bus.

I deliberately told the extractor not to allow removal of items from any intermediate slot. However, any side should be valid for the output slot.

 

[GreenZombie]

I deliberately told the extractor not to allow removal of items from any intermediate slot. However, any side should be valid for the output slot.

And why would you do that?

 

[Reika]

And why would you do that?

Because otherwise sided output rules (like the vanilla furnace) would apply. And I hate that system, as it forces setups to always look a certain way.

 

[Physicist]

I was only able to remove flakes from the east side via Precision ME import buses.

If preventing "always look[ing] a certain way" is the intent behind it, could you please allow removal of anything from the North or South sides, to allow for *more* variation in setups? Splitting processing between two machines seems a logical 3rd solution, besides the 4MW at-one-time-power-solution, and the use-clutch-solution.

 

[Physicist]

To clarify my request: Allow machine rotation. Pull only end-products from front side. Pull anything from other sides. Insert anything into any side. Power from bottom.

This would allow the basic buildcraft wooden extraction pipes (or similar simple machine) automation, *and* it would allow smart extraction for alternate setups like:

• running 4 extractors each on their minimum power settings
• running 4 extractors tuned for max speed min torque for each stage
  
• running 2-3 extractors staging 2/4 or 3/4 per extractor to combine convenient power levels depending on engines used to run.

 

[Reika]

I was only able to remove flakes from the east side via Precision ME import buses.

If preventing "always look[ing] a certain way" is the intent behind it, could you please allow removal of anything from the North or South sides, to allow for *more* variation in setups? Splitting processing between two machines seems a logical 3rd solution, besides the 4MW at-one-time-power-solution, and the use-clutch-solution.

No, because then anyone who wants to use it normally for those sides is going to have it pulling any random item out. Remember- not every item transport system cares about what item it is transporting.

Also, there is a balance issue. Part of the Extractor's design is that it is difficult to power, given its enormous ore multiplication. That reason (plus the coding involved) is the main reason I have rejected requests to make it 4 separate machines.

 

[Physicist]

Ok, I can dig balance.

For reference, my setup would have allowed me to power the whole thing (that's two half-extractors) on less than one AC engine. I only used two to simplify gearing and increase speed. I could have powered Extractor-A on 4xSteam Engines and Extractor-B on 2.

I may still do something like that, but use a hopper-timer to shift AC Engines and Industrial Coils around a CVT or something. It will be more difficult in the redstone department, but simpler in the item-routing automation department.

Also, it won't look as cool as:

Spoiler

Granted, it needed sprucing up and symmetry, but I was still just trying to make it work.

 

[EyeDeck]

I may still do something like that, but use a hopper-timer to shift AC Engines and Industrial Coils around a CVT or something. It will be more difficult in the redstone department, but simpler in the item-routing automation department.

If you've got it installed, you should still be able to accomplish what you want using Factorization routers. Assuming they haven't been changed much from 1.4.7, they can be configured to pull items out of specific machine slots. With a bit of trial-and-error, it shouldn't be difficult to set up a system with two routers that would:

1. Dump ores into extractor-A (torque extractor)
2. Config router-1 to pull dust from extractor-A slot 2 (best guess?)
3. Pipe dust into extractor-B (speed extractor)
4. Config router-2 to pull solution from extractor-B output slot 6 (again, never tested, just best guess)
5. Pipe solution back into extractor-A
6. Pipe flakes directly out of extractor-A as normal, and process in furnace setup of choice

An alternative would be to use ComputerCraft turtles, which I think should be able to accomplish the same thing with a bit of scripting.

Remember, these aren't forestry apiaries, the internal slots of the machines aren't protected from manipulation by other machines, they're just not exposed to simple extraction systems such as pipes and AE import busses.

 

[YX33A]

You can shapelessly craft RC's Mimichite Gem into Mimicry's Mimichite.

Edit: Unless that was Minetweakered into the Monster Pack; If so, I recommend getting Minetweaker and pasting in the 3ish requisite lines from the Monster Minetweaker config.

So I can. Nice.

Now I'm having the same issue with AM2 Vintium Dust(dear lord WHY?!). But it's asserting control over the stuff even though AM2 doesn't use the Ore Dictionary for its own resources, thus breaking my ability to produce anything that uses Vintium dust aside from power with GT. I may end up having to use GT's Inventory Unification just to fix this one issue.
*Shudder*

 

[GreenZombie]

No, because then anyone who wants to use it normally for those sides is going to have it pulling any random item out. Remember- not every item transport system cares about what item it is transporting.

Also, there is a balance issue. Part of the Extractor's design is that it is difficult to power, given its enormous ore multiplication. That reason (plus the coding involved) is the main reason I have rejected requests to make it 4 separate machines.

Don't you feel its just a little bit ironic that a mod, otherwise dedicated to the application of real physics, has a block that "For balance reasons" is not the sum of its parts?

This was the last mod I expected things to be fudged "for the sake of balance".

 

[Reika]

Don't you feel its just a little bit ironic that a mod, otherwise dedicated to the application of real physics, has a block that "For balance reasons" is not the sum of its parts?

This was the last mod I expected things to be fudged "for the sake of balance".

...? How does this have anything to do with real-world physics?

 

[GreenZombie]

The extractor, internally, has to be built using gears and shafts to split the rotational power it is receiving between its components. So, even though we don't have them, I can imagine 4 hypothetical machines, each with the power requirements of a single stage.

However, the hypothetical multistage machine would have to use 'magic' gearing to duplicate the way that the all-in-one extractor can share the torque between the stages.

Now, RotaryCraft has a lot of blocks. I can't believe that it would actually be in any way difficult to implement the extractor as 4 machines - each with a single input and output - and while the resulting configuration might be boring - would nonetheless be less boring that all 4 stages in one box.

Which implies to me that balance IS the only reason the extractor bundled up. And, in terms of rotarycraft machines, the extractor seems to be the only one that requires the top tier power producers. Fully powered as a single box it requires 8 (or so) max height hydrokinetic generators. Is there any reason in rotary craft to produce and use jetfuel other than to run an extractor?

That said, the individual stages in an extractor can be run for a mere 176kW. And so no, if not the physics, then the engineering of the device does not make sense.

But, given that an extractor IS 4 stages, what engineer faced with 4 machines that consume 176kW, would box them up as a packaged unit with gearing that instead requires 4MW?

Other than yourself.

As Steve, the good engineer, it it my responsibility to to and be efficient. And the only thing standing in my way are the artificial limitations you are placing in my way to prevent me automating several extractors.

In the name of balance. not science.

fix it. please.

The rigor you approached this mod with is attractive to my OCD. The extractor does not fit.

 

[Physicist]

So I can. Nice.

Now I'm having the same issue with AM2 Vintium Dust(dear lord WHY?!). But it's asserting control over the stuff even though AM2 doesn't use the Ore Dictionary for its own resources, thus breaking my ability to produce anything that uses Vintium dust aside from power with GT. I may end up having to use GT's Inventory Unification just to fix this one issue.
*Shudder*

You can keep inventory unification disabled, but crafting unification on. Crafting unification *only* unifies things that go specifically into a GT block with an inventory, like it's machines, metal crafting tables, and automation blocks. You could set a GT buffer flowing into ME storage that unifies only what you put into it (ores, gems that don't lose functionality, etc.).