[1.7.10][LISTED] InfiTech 2 Modpack v3.2.21 [HQM][GregTech balanced hard-mode modpack]

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Pyure

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Aug 14, 2013
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You know, posts like these make me regret I'm posting here at all. Why the HECK!!!! is people's first reaction to these things ALWAYS "Remove it!"
Not all things, just things that break progression. Also, in this case it was suggested to replace the thing with something better, not just entirely remove it :p

I don't think you have anything to worry about, RTGs aren't a huge offender. They're not going anywhere and the wishlists are pure fun.
 

SolManX

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Jul 29, 2019
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Doesn't Thaumcraft break progression by providing very easy automation? Well, easy compared to anything GregTech.

I'm using so much charcoal to keep just one LV EBF going, I've given in and started Thaumcraft just to get a tree farm going. It's just so much easier and free once you've got it going (as far as I understand it - haven't got there yet).

Seriously not trying to start an argument, just wondering.
 

Pyure

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Aug 14, 2013
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Doesn't Thaumcraft break progression by providing very easy automation? Well, easy compared to anything GregTech.

I'm using so much charcoal to keep just one LV EBF going, I've given in and started Thaumcraft just to get a tree farm going. It's just so much easier and free once you've got it going (as far as I understand it - haven't got there yet).

Seriously not trying to start an argument, just wondering.
Golem tree farm is definitely an amazing way to get ahead. I have a personal goal of not using one, but only because I found it was too easy to reach virtually all energy goals with the power of charcoal, and with just a single tiny tree farm. There was no reason for me to check out nuclear, etc.

Thaumcraft does indeed break progression, not just with automation but in plenty of other ways. I wasn't a huge fan of it being in the pack at all, and its easy to see why: how many players actually use Forestry for tree-farming? Or any of the other science-based farming? Everyone uses thaumcraft because its free of charge.

Buuuut. It integrates well with GT in other ways and its fun. So, sometimes you just say, whatevs. But two wrongs don't make a right, and ya always gotta at least try to make an effort to keep the game streamlined.
 
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SolManX

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Jul 29, 2019
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I would have tried a forestry farm (never done one before), but after many moons of exploration I've never found any apatite. Also, the ender io farm is way out of reach at the moment.

Not happy to go thaumcraft, but I've cut down too many trees to mention :( Maybe I'll get rid of it once the elusive apatite is found.
 

DarknessShadow

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Jul 29, 2019
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You know, posts like these make me regret I'm posting here at all. Why the HECK!!!! is people's first reaction to these things ALWAYS "Remove it!"
Whoa stop right there... and visit https://github.com/JasonMcRay/InfiTech-1.7/issues/238
You would see that I first complained about it 14days ago and thats way before you posted something about this here.
And my suggestions was making it more expensive (replace plutonium ingots with dense ingots)
 
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Pyure

Not Totally Useless
Aug 14, 2013
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Waterloo, Ontario
I would have tried a forestry farm (never done one before), but after many moons of exploration I've never found any apatite. Also, the ender io farm is way out of reach at the moment.

Not happy to go thaumcraft, but I've cut down too many trees to mention :( Maybe I'll get rid of it once the elusive apatite is found.
Thaumcraft route is fun too :)
 

Tsuko

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Jul 29, 2019
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2015-07-03_16.33.33.png
Villager Express!, stretching almost a 500 blocks (not quite 1000):
 
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Ieldra

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Apr 25, 2014
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Golem tree farm is definitely an amazing way to get ahead. I have a personal goal of not using one, but only because I found it was too easy to reach virtually all energy goals with the power of charcoal, and with just a single tiny tree farm. There was no reason for me to check out nuclear, etc.

Thaumcraft does indeed break progression, not just with automation but in plenty of other ways. I wasn't a huge fan of it being in the pack at all, and its easy to see why: how many players actually use Forestry for tree-farming? Or any of the other science-based farming? Everyone uses thaumcraft because its free of charge.

Buuuut. It integrates well with GT in other ways and its fun. So, sometimes you just say, whatevs. But two wrongs don't make a right, and ya always gotta at least try to make an effort to keep the game streamlined.
I actually wanted to use Forestry for my tree farming. But for what do you *need* an infinite supply of trees but power? That means, if it's not feasible to use Forestry for tree farming to generate power people aren't going to use it.
Also, in the early game Thaumcraft is one of the few things that isn't frustrating.

Talk about any other farming, the thing is that progession in general is so slow that you simply don't need a lot of automated farming - except for "power" trees - for a very long time.
 
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Ieldra

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Apr 25, 2014
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Whoa stop right there... and visit https://github.com/JasonMcRay/InfiTech-1.7/issues/238
You would see that I first complained about it 14days ago and thats way before you posted something about this here.
And my suggestions was making it more expensive (replace plutonium ingots with dense ingots)
Nine times as much plutonium makes this non-feasible. It's expensive enough already. As I said, you could make a Big Reactor with ten times the output from a comparable amount of materials. It's definitely enough. Also, I don't think this pack needs even more grind. You know, "Make it more expensive" is, in my opinion, a sh*tty way to "balance" things and should be the last resort. It just means people have to mine more, and that's boring.
 
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DarknessShadow

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Nine times as much plutonium makes this non-feasible. It's expensive enough already. Also, I don't think this pack needs even more grind. You know, "Make it more expensive" is, in my opinion, a sh*tty way to "balance" things and should be the last resort. It just means people have to mine more, and that's boring.
It was supposed to be an energy source AFTER you've run a nuclear reactor for a long time and get a small amount of energy out of the extra plutonium you have.
In IC2 there was NO other way of getting plutonium then from depleted fuel rods and getting 4 stacks of plutoium ore from a vein is not exactly hard or alot of grind.
 

Pyure

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I actually wanted to use Forestry for my tree farming. But for what do you *need* an infinite supply of trees but power? That means, if it's not feasible to use Forestry for tree farming to generate power people aren't going to use it.
Also, in the early game Thaumcraft is one of the few things that isn't frustrating.

Talk about any other farming, the thing is that progression in general is so slow that you simply don't need a lot of automated farming - except for "power" trees - for a very long time.
You're pointing out the problems without providing a reasonable solution.

Crossed out your point that is extremely subjective and Ieldra-specific and irrelevant to the discussion. I feel exactly the opposite of your sentence there so what's the point of making it: it took me months to finally get into TC, after more tries than I can count. I hated it, and I only eventually did it because everyone else was skipping GT except for me to get ahead (steel and tree farms in particular)

An ideal solution here would involve ensuring you could get power from any tree farms, in such a way that they didn't scale well beyond a charcoal-type age. I really wish a "pollution" mod were available to assist with this: if you could easily get the equivalent of 512 eu/t from a tree farm, but it sloped off (diminishing returns), then people would look at other technologies.

Nine times as much plutonium makes this non-feasible. It's expensive enough already. Also, I don't think this pack needs even more grind. You know, "Make it more expensive" is, in my opinion, a sh*tty way to "balance" things and should be the last resort. It just means people have to mine more, and that's boring.
Don't say "its expensive enough already." Infinite-benefit divided by 1000-resources approaches zero cost. Also: The grind is terrible. Its horrible. Its soul-crushing. That's how it is. If its not the right pack for you, that is completely and totally understandable. Move on and let the rest of us idiots suffer.
 
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Ieldra

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It was supposed to be an energy source AFTER you've run a nuclear reactor for a long time and get a small amount of energy out of the extra plutonium you have.
In IC2 there was NO other way of getting plutonium then from depleted fuel rods and getting 4 stacks of plutoium ore from a vein is not exactly hard or alot of grind.
No, but finding the vein, that is hard. I said it's not exactly super-rare but it turns out they're rarer that I thought and I'd been lucky.
 

SolManX

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Jul 29, 2019
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I feel exactly the opposite of your sentence there so what's the point of making it: it took me months to finally get into TC, after more tries than I can count. I hated it, and I only eventually did it because everyone else was skipping GT except for me to get ahead (steel and tree farms in particular)

Can I ask what swung you over?
 

Ieldra

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Apr 25, 2014
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An ideal solution here would involve ensuring you could get power from any tree farms, in such a way that they didn't scale well beyond a charcoal-type age. I really wish a "pollution" mod were available to assist with this: if you could easily get the equivalent of 512 eu/t from a tree farm, but it sloped off (diminishing returns), then people would look at other technologies.
It would be hard to justify that for a golem-run farm, don't you think? I found that tree farms scale in a linear way, but power needs increase faster. I have no motivation to spam golem tree farms for power.

Don't say "its expensive enough already." Infinite-benefit divided by 1000-resources approaches zero cost.
Only if you assume an infinite playing time. We don't play for an infinite amount of time. Also, as a matter of principle I think that even in a pack like this, there should be room for different play styles.
 

SolManX

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Jul 29, 2019
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Stubbornness and setting myself specific goals. And I've always wanted to learn more about the mod.

Ah okay. I was just thinking about you saying it's fun now whereas previously you'd hated it. I was hoping for one killer argument for me to get properly into it, rather than just rushing a tree-farm (and maybe some boots).

But it's up to me to find out, of course!
 

Pyure

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Aug 14, 2013
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It would be hard to justify that for a golem-run farm, don't you think? I found that tree farms scale in a linear way, but power needs increase faster. I have no motivation to spam golem tree farms for power.
It would have to be applied mid-industry. Say, all machines that turn wood into charcoal create pollution. You can have 3-4 without any impact but 10-15 and they grind to a halt. Hypothetically.


Only if you assume an infinite playing time. We don't play for an infinite amount of time.
I do :p

Regardless, we all play long enough for it to pay off (or we wouldn't do it). Without speaking to what the cost SHOULD be, its always definitely worth keeping an eye on whether the costs and benefits are in an appropriate balance. For some, the argument persists that RNGs as they stand are a bit of a cop-out. I'm inclined to agree to a degree, but unlike most annoying "win buttons" I find this one reasonably easy to ignore.

In case anyone missed that: I violently reject any argument that says "if you don't like that overpowered thing, just don't use it." It breaks immersion when you know you can "win" at any time.
 

Tsuko

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Jul 29, 2019
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It would have to be applied mid-industry. Say, all machines that turn wood into charcoal create pollution. You can have 3-4 without any impact but 10-15 and they grind to a halt. Hypothetically.



I do :p

Regardless, we all play long enough for it to pay off (or we wouldn't do it). Without speaking to what the cost SHOULD be, its always definitely worth keeping an eye on whether the costs and benefits are in an appropriate balance. For some, the argument persists that RNGs as they stand are a bit of a cop-out. I'm inclined to agree to a degree, but unlike most annoying "win buttons" I find this one reasonably easy to ignore.

In case anyone missed that: I violently reject any argument that says "if you don't like that overpowered thing, just don't use it." It breaks immersion when you know you can "win" at any time.
*rant*
For me it seems pretty reasonable, TC treefarms, though i haven't experienced anything else, is there a GT way of doing it (no RF or forestry), you want all treefarms gone? just manual mining then =_=
For me it isn't about infinite resources but more about figuring out of stuff work and spending a lot of time to get that steady supply of resources and maybe sometimes manually doing stuff to keep things running smoothly, kinda like nuclear reactors, though you can fully automate them i believe for infinity?

Infinity is in the name of this modpack and one of the goals but should that only be achievable at the very end of the tech tree? is TC infinity too early? took my a very long time to get it up and running and i still don't have it, turns out my way of doing things was bugged so now i've to completely change my "farm". I don't mind the hunt for different resources, i've learned to like it even.

To me it seems a bit elitist to dismiss TC as being too easy or early, tin and antimony can be hard to find if you don't know where and how to look, but if you have the knowledge i'm betting it is quite easy, there seems to be very easy ways of flying with IC2 as well, harder in TC i think, maybe i'll find TC much easier the next time i start up as i know how to do things now and THEN it is a problem? (less grind than GT? if knowledge of both mods is perfect, achieve infinity easier with TC?)

Infinity is a hot topic, people start to think it is too easy for mods they learn compared to their first favorite mod for infinity, but that first mod may just be your favorite because you had to learn how to automate stuff in the first place, now you know how to do it makes other mods easier to achieve infinity with.

I dunno, i just don't like TC being bashed as too simple when it takes a lot of experimentation and research and knowledge to get stuff working, a forestry treefarm seems MUCH simpler to me, just feed it the fuel, go to wiki and build a multiblock structure (cannot do it without wiki, don't like), i'm sure you can fully automate it as well. With TC i had to learn so many different things. I've never done a forestry treefarm but i attempted one but because of RF power requirements and such it was unsuccessful.

What other treefarms are there?
*end rant*
 
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Pyure

Not Totally Useless
Aug 14, 2013
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*rant*
For me it seems pretty reasonable, TC treefarms, though i haven't experienced anything else, is there a GT way of doing it (no RF or forestry), you want all treefarms gone? just manual mining then =_=
For me it isn't about infinite resources but more about figuring out of stuff work and spending a lot of time to get that steady supply of resources and maybe sometimes manually doing stuff to keep things running smoothly, kinda like nuclear reactors, though you can fully automate them i believe for infinity?

Infinity is in the name of this modpack and one of the goals but should that only be achievable at the very of the tech tree? is TC infinity too early? took my a very long time to get it up and running and i still don't have it, turns out my way of doing things was bugged so now i've to completely change my "farm". I don't mind the hunt for different resources, i've learned to like it even.

To me it seems a bit elitist to dismiss TC as being too easy or early, tin and antimony can be hard to find if you don't know where and how to look, but if you have the knowledge i'm betting it is quite easy, there seems to be very easy ways of flying with IC2 as well, harder in TC i think, maybe i'll find TC much easier the next time i start up as i know how to do things now and THEN it is a problem? (less grind than GT? if knowledge of both mods is perfect, achieve infinity easier with TC?)

Infinity is a hot topic, people start to think it is too easy for mods they learn compared to their first favorite mod for infinity, but that first mod may just be your favorite because you had to learn how to automate stuff in the first place, now you know how to do it makes other mods easier to achieve infinity with.

I dunno, i just don't like TC being bashed as too simple when it takes a lot of experimentation and research and knowledge to get stuff working, a forestry treefarm seems MUCH simpler to me, just feed it the fuel, go to wiki and build a multiblock structure (cannot do it without wiki, don't like), i'm sure you can fully automate it as well. With TC i had to learn so many different things. I've never done a forestry treefarm but i attempted one but because of RF power requirements and such it was unsuccessful.

What other treefarms are there?
*end rant*
Interesting feedback Tsuko.

Nobody is dismissing anything here. I don't really care how hard or simple something is, so long as it has *ITS* place in the pack, and everything else gets that thing's place in the pack.

Right now, forestry treefarms have little or no place in the pack. They're deprecated at all stages because there's an option that runs free of charge. I'm mentioning this because its true, but I don't really see an ideal solution to the problem. Its just the way it is, so, whatever.

And while TC research and scanning and whatnot exists, I don't find it any harder or simpler than setting up a tree farm. I do find research mindbogglingly dull, but that's personal.

Tree farms for infinite resources is tolerable. What I'd like to avoid seeing is people having no reason to tech further. Tree farms make a lot of sense in the early/mid game, but its hard to swallow a charcoal-powered space industry :)
 
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