[1.6.4]Crash Landing [Hardcore, HQM] version 1.1.x BETA STABLE

[twisto51]

One thing that was brought up was that the survivalist generator is to easy to replicate en masse for industrial uses when it's supposed to be a early, weak energy generation option. Well, Mekanism's starting generator, the heat generator, is fairly inefficient on fuel but can run for free (for something like 5 RF/t) if it's surrounded by flowing lava on all sides (1 RF per side touching lava), making replication much less feasible while still providing early game accessibility.

I don't see the problem with massed survivalist generators. On top of that I've gone with mass heat generators the two times I've had Mekhanism in a pack. It is FTB, unless you make a generator stop working if it detects another one anywhere in the world people are going to make mass setups. Remember the mass redstone engine days? lol.

Powergen is really, really, really easy in Mekanism. While there are plenty of reasons to like and want it in the pack instead of any number of other mods I wouldn't say balance is one of them.

 

[schpeelah]

I don't see the problem with massed survivalist generators. On top of that I've gone with mass heat generators the two times I've had Mekhanism in a pack. It is FTB, unless you make a generator stop working if it detects another one anywhere in the world people are going to make mass setups. Remember the mass redstone engine days? lol.

Powergen is really, really, really easy in Mekanism. While there are plenty of reasons to like and want it in the pack instead of any number of other mods I wouldn't say balance is one of them.

Unlike Extra Utilities, Mekanism has a configurable power generator output on top of the ability to change recipes. The only unchangeable part is the mechanics of the generator's functioning. Surrounding the generator with lava makes it significantly more difficult for mass use than just providing fuel, especially in this pack where heat is an issue. I mean, we're talking a simple wall of generators versus an entire lava lake with generators in it.

I personally don't care about the generator wall "problem", but some people here do.

 

[ZackUnme]

I was drinking a bottle of water(not cold) and ten I got infinite dehydration try log in & log off not working

 

[Methusalem]

Too bad the higher tiers of ore processing aren't feasible in this pack, as 4x requires a ton of water. And getting to 3x is a bit too easy, EIO is more balanced with their 3x.
TE itemducts have the same problem, but at least logistical transporters do not backstuff.

3x is already too simple, just build a High Oven. (Which pretty much makes all other ways to process ores obsolete.)

I would love to see Mekanism as the core mod in CL for 1.7.10, maybe even together with Atomic Science. (Is that still a separate mod?)
One thing that bothers me a bit in the current pack, is that there is no incentive for more complex builds or to build up a mass production of anything. With Mekanism we could shoot for the rather involved 5x ore processing, which would require a lot of infrastructure to get the necessary water etc.

Then maybe Galacticraft as endgame mod, now that would be progression! You crash, work to survive, then build up a high tech infrastructure and finally leave the planet again and explore other places. Maybe make the Galacticraft fuel really expensive so that launching to another planet is a major achievement.

 

[Sifestia]

1.1.2.1 server download dont work. have anyone the right dl link?

 

[Hoff]

1.1.2.1 server download dont work. have anyone the right dl link?

Ftb hasn't updated it yet, apparently. Be patient.

 

[twisto51]

Unlike Extra Utilities, Mekanism has a configurable power generator output on top of the ability to change recipes. The only unchangeable part is the mechanics of the generator's functioning. Surrounding the generator with lava makes it significantly more difficult for mass use than just providing fuel, especially in this pack where heat is an issue. I mean, we're talking a simple wall of generators versus an entire lava lake with generators in it.

I personally don't care about the generator wall "problem", but some people here do.

It isn't hard at all to mass heat generators. Like I said not only have I done it, I've done it 100% of the time that Mekanism is in the pack. You don't make a lava lake. You make a wall with spaces between the generators, using your power cabling as part of the wall. It isn't hard at all. You start at the bottom and as you build more heat generators you expand upwards a layer at a time. It is actually quite easy, though admittedly working with lava can be dangerous if you make mistakes.

The difference is that regardless of how many survivalists generators you have they still need fuel. The Heat Generator doesn't need any fuel. The power source that requires 0 fuel cannot be positioned as more balanced vs. a power source that burns fuel, regardless of how much effort is required in the initial setup.

There is no generator wall problem because the same amount of resources/effort put into other systems will actually generate more power. In this pack in particular you don't need a lot of power until you also have the ability to make better power gen than industrialist generators. If you have the circuit boards to build power-hungry machines you have the circuit boards to build better power gen, right? I end up feeling sorry for somebody with a wall of survivalist generators instead of a couple grinders and 4-8 reactants.

[DOUBLEPOST=1410444375][/DOUBLEPOST]

One thing that bothers me a bit in the current pack, is that there is no incentive for more complex builds or to build up a mass production of anything. With Mekanism we could shoot for the rather involved 5x ore processing, which would require a lot of infrastructure to get the necessary water etc.

I've never played a pack where 5x ore processing was "worth it".

The problem is that when you really need 5x ore processing is at the very start of the game. Which is of course not when you ever get it since it is usually perched near the top of the tech tree for the mod in question. By the time you are capable of it you no longer need it.

There is always some sort of automated mining that ends up producing all the metals you'll ever need, even at 2x.

 

[schpeelah]

It isn't hard at all to mass heat generators. Like I said not only have I done it, I've done it 100% of the time that Mekanism is in the pack. You don't make a lava lake. You make a wall with spaces between the generators, using your power cabling as part of the wall. It isn't hard at all. You start at the bottom and as you build more heat generators you expand upwards a layer at a time. It is actually quite easy, though admittedly working with lava can be dangerous if you make mistakes.

The difference is that regardless of how many survivalists generators you have they still need fuel. The Heat Generator doesn't need any fuel. The power source that requires 0 fuel cannot be positioned as more balanced vs. a power source that burns fuel, regardless of how much effort is required in the initial setup.

The fuel is itself produced infinitely from sieving gravel/tree farm, both are exactly as free. The effort of the initial setup is everything.

 

[twisto51]

The fuel is itself produced infinitely from sieving gravel/tree farm, both are exactly as free. The effort of the initial setup is everything.

Not true at all. Gravel requires either power to pulverize cobble or materials for hammers. Either way gravel is not free. In the case of charcoal a self-sustaining tree farm is a hell of a lot more infastructure than it takes to produce a lava block for each heat generator in this pack.

A lava block that sits there forever, endlessly fueling a generator? That is free.

In both of your cases of "free" there is required infrastructure, infrastructure that has to continue producing for as long as you want to use survivalist generators.

The heat generators require no infrastructure once setup. None.

Don't know why you're hung up on survivalist generators. You'd be better off picking on reactant/grinder setups if you want to use balance as your argument for Mekanism and for Heat Generators. Even the solar generators would be a better fit for your argument as they only need a bit of redstone logic to be used effectively indefinitely with no resources/infrastructure.

 

[schpeelah]

If you do not yet have a pulverizer producing gravel all the time, then you are at the point where you don't need more than a single generator because you're only using power for the sync shell.


I'm not hung up on survivalist generators. People were calling for making generators quest reward only because the easy crafting recipe for survivalist generators made them a viable choice for mid-late game power production through making lots of them. So I'm telling them that Mekanism has a power generation option both possible early game and not as trivial to scale up to industrial uses.

 

[twisto51]

I'm not hung up on survivalist generators. People were calling for making generators quest reward only because the easy crafting recipe for survivalist generators made them a viable choice for mid-late game power production through making lots of them. So I'm telling them that Mekanism has a power generation option both possible early game and not as trivial to scale up to industrial uses.

We'll just have to agree to disagree then. I've proven to myself on two separate occasions how trivial it is to scale up Heat Generators, and I find it to be much more trivial than any powergen that requires ongoing fuel. The only thing simpler is solars in a perma-day/no-rain mystcraft age. Actually most wind power is simpler too if you have the right location.

Guess I'll build a wall of Heat Generators in creative now just so I can show a picture of how simple the build is. It is just a simple layer cake. Nah, i'll just do it in ASCII.

XXXXXXXXX
XOOOOOOOX
XO#O#O#OX
XXIXIXIXX

XXXXXXXXX
XOOOOOOOX
XOOOOOOOX
XXIXIXIXX

X= solid block
O=Lava
#=heat gen
I=Cable

Just alternate the layers, building upwards one layer at a time. Can extend it out either side as far as you want for as many generators per layer as you want. Easy to setup, easy to expand a layer at a time. I tend to put an energy cube at the bottom of each set of cable, then tie their output to a higher tier energy cube to power most of my materials processing.

I don't think I've ever need more than 16 of these to power all of my materials processing. On top of that a wall of Heat Gens looks much cooler---no pun intended---than a wall of survivalist generators.

The only real challenge in my experience was getting that much lava that early in a game, something that wouldn't be an issue in a pack with Ex Nihilo.

 

[Hexerin]

+1 for mekanism, new mods to learn is always a fun thing. it appears that iskandar will be using TE3+EIO though.

 

[Methusalem]

It isn't hard at all to mass heat generators. Like I said not only have I done it, I've done it 100% of the time that Mekanism is in the pack. You don't make a lava lake. You make a wall with spaces between the generators, using your power cabling as part of the wall. It isn't hard at all. You start at the bottom and as you build more heat generators you expand upwards a layer at a time. It is actually quite easy, though admittedly working with lava can be dangerous if you make mistakes.
The difference is that regardless of how many survivalists generators you have they still need fuel. The Heat Generator doesn't need any fuel. The power source that requires 0 fuel cannot be positioned as more balanced vs. a power source that burns fuel, regardless of how much effort is required in the initial setup.

My very basic starter setup uses 500RF/t. You need 50 Heat Generators, hundreds of lava blocks and dozens energy conduits to get this amount. ... Or you can build a simple 7x4x7 Big Reactor, using up 0.005mb/t. One stack of Yellorite lasts 400 Minecraft days, more than I played so far in the current world. Which one of these options is unbalanced?

I've never played a pack where 5x ore processing was "worth it".
The problem is that when you really need 5x ore processing is at the very start of the game. Which is of course not when you ever get it since it is usually perched near the top of the tech tree for the mod in question. By the time you are capable of it you no longer need it.
There is always some sort of automated mining that ends up producing all the metals you'll ever need, even at 2x.

You, my friend, show a remarkable lack of imagination.

Here a possible progression for CL2:

Early game: You crash, get the basics done, build the first Smeltery and High Oven for 2x ore processing. With that you can make up your Pneumaticraft setup. The circuits, transistors and capacitors are used to craft all tech mod blocks and allow you to set up the first Mekanism machines for 3x processing.

Mid game: You start to build efficient, automated, high output agricultural farms. The automation can be done with MFR or Drones. Power comes from Mekanism, MFR or ExU generators. Build up the dirt production, create buttloads of water (or use tree farms/crucibles to supplement it) and get the 4x/5x ore processing going. Build an array of mining Lasers in the sky, powered by Fission Reactors.

End game: Refine blocks of metals together with redstone/glowstone into tiny amounts of Galacticraft fuel, using obscene amounts of energy which can be supplied by Mekanism Fusion Reactors. Think of it like creating anti-matter. Being able to get all the fuel to launch to another planet should be a real achievement and opens up more gameplay options, like the moon villages and dungeons, building new outposts, the ability to upgrade the rocket etc. Maybe even the currently planned endgame options could be spawned on another planet.

 

[twisto51]

I tried auto-smelt on a lumber axe today, just in case 2x2 jungle trees weren't already my favorite.

 

[Hoff]

I tried auto-smelt on a lumber axe today, just in case 2x2 jungle trees weren't already my favorite.

Add fortune and chop some rubber trees.

 

[twisto51]

My very basic starter setup uses 500RF/t. You need 50 Heat Generators, hundreds of lava blocks and dozens energy conduits to get this amount. ... Or you can build a simple 7x4x7 Big Reactor, using up 0.005mb/t. One stack of Yellorite lasts 400 Minecraft days, more than I played so far in the current world. Which one of these options is unbalanced?

We weren't talking about reactors. We were specifically talking Survivalist Generators vs. Heat Generators. Big Reactors is ridiculously OP but that has nothing whatsoever to do with the discussion you're replying to. Big Reactors isn't early game in Crash Landing, nor is it in most modpacks.

You, my friend, show a remarkable lack of imagination.
Here a possible progression for CL2:

You, my friend, show a remarkable lack of reading comprehension.

What does imagination have to do with stating my experience is with every modpack I've played?
I'm not talking what if, I'm talking what is. The post I was replying to wasn't a what if, it was a what is. We're not theorizing about what could be, we're talking about what is. In every single modpack I've played greater than 2x ore doubling is near the end of the tech tree and not "worth it" when faced with simply mining more ores for more metals you don't need anyway. I wasn't talking about what could be done in future packs, I was talking about what has been done in every pack I've played up until this point.

So yes, you could make 5x important by a) making quests for it and b) nerfing all ore production automation methods.

What you're talking about is tedium. I don't need much imagination to know that tedium doesn't make a modpack more fun. That is why I'm playing through Crash Landing more than once while once was enough for Agrarian Skies.

What I'm starting to notice is a lot of people who don't like how other people play this modpack and want to change things so that they can't play it a certain way. Isn't it easier to just play it the way you want to and not care about how other people play it? Seems like there is a subset of the community for each modpack more concerned with what other people are doing in it than what they themselves can/do do in it. I'm not directing this specifically at the person I'm replying to.

 

[twisto51]

Add fortune and chop some rubber trees.

Fortune+auto-smelt gives me no rubber at all from rubber trees. Somehow I feel that using all of my lapis (408) for no reason is your fault!

 

[KRWren]

Ok, I'm considering making 1.1.3 the last of the 1.6.4 updates. There is a growing list of unfixable bugs that are getting quite, quite annoying. The only downside is I'll have to completely rebuild the pack, which would take a month...and a map reset would be absolutely MANDATORY. What do you guys think?

Speaking as a developer, it sounds like time to start over. Go for it. Just make sure the tools you need are ready before you being the process.

 

[DoomSquirter]

Sorry this was more in reference to the rebuilding the ship thing that Iskandar posted, for some reason when I was quoting things got a bit messed up and I ended up even quoting someone I didn't want to.
However I don't fully understand the new game starting mechnics involved as I've never looked in to it



You mean the same mods just for version 1.7, which I kinda though was implied

Yeah, sorry. My brain was awash in a word jumble last night. Thought I read mods, not worlds Apologize.[DOUBLEPOST=1410455228][/DOUBLEPOST]

Spoiler: Facepalm

Epic nerf hammer incomming ...

Spoiler: the real deal

hey, I linked an actual nerf hammer from hasbro. it's the epic one since it's a THOR nerf hammer

 

[DoomSquirter]

Have you tried other mods like Tubes? - http://www.minecraftforum.net/forum...-mods/1292474-1-7-10-tubes-2-0-4-21-july-2014


I've only just started fiddling with it so I don't know if it has any problems or if its not as fast?

The crafting is a bit long winded but not reliant on machines other than a basic furnace


Just another thought, since you can get the deep tank/high oven materials from the city like the smeltery, is/has the quest in the book changed to allow you to manually detect rather than having to still craft one? I think I have 2-3 of these now as I've found and built them.
I've not updated my pack yet but completed the quest so I don't know if it was changed

I don't really have an answer for this. After my many many RL days/weeks of scavenging, when I clicked through a bunch of quests, I had that one half done which I was beside myself on. I had not made anything, only scavenged and it did show one of the items (I don't recall which) but the other it was waiting for me to make it. Sometimes dropping on ground and picking up helps in this case but didn't.