Spacetoad is back to modding

[Ashzification]

TL,DR: Stop yelling at CJ. He done good.

Agreed. You've done good too

things I don't understand

I think you've done a great job maintaining Buildcraft. A really great job with Railcraft. I say both of these things not knowing how the things work, but that they work, and it makes my game fun. So, thank you


The long and short of it: Each mod author does things their own way. When a vacancy is there, someone comes in to fill that spot. They may do it really well, they may do it not so well.
End result: hopefully we have a bunch of really fun mods to play with
Frankly, if you don't like the way someone does something, go right ahead and do it better. Until you can, don't complain about the way someone else chooses to do things.

Now, moderator voice: I appreciate continued civility and an elevated tone of discussion. We can agree to disagree on some things but let's keep our noses clean here and not get personal about this, folks. Thank you.

Modspeak should be in a different color


And YAY Spacetoad!

 

[Sarda]

If your refineries sat there doing nothing, they would pull 1MJ/t as that is the loss programmed into them. This is the value that was set at the same time the Power API was redone. Prior to the Power API change, it was programmed for a 2MJ/t loss.

I never seen this 2MJ loss. In 1.5.x I had TE batteries connected to them thru TE conduits and they never pulled any power, the batteries level never changed.

 

[ShneekeyTheLost]

This seems to be a problem caused by having a vision and sticking to it. And there is nothing wrong with that.

BC has a vision for how power should run. KL politely disagreed with said vision and made his own. The larger community looked at both and many/most chose RF. That's no indictment of MJ. It's just that people preferred what they found to be a better system for their needs.

As I see it there is no reason to look down on either vision or system. Both have their strengths and their flaws.

As for SpaceToad returning? I can't wait to see what he'll bring to BC. I want a reason to re-add it to my private modpack again!

I wish to submit a service ticket. I seem to be unable to 'like' this post more than once. This is clearly a deficiency in the 'like' system which needs to get rectified.

THANK YOU for stating this clearly and concisely.

I may prefer to not use MJ anymore, but that doesn't mean it is 'bad' or 'evil' or inherently 'wrong'. It simply means it does not meet my needs or wants as a gamer and a mod pack developer.

 

[CovertJaguar]

If i'm thinking of what your thinking is that when you looped the pipe in a circle and it blew up in your face? It was amusing the first time I did it and I never really though of a way to make it a buffer. The TE Conduits held 1000MJ in each segment before the change now they hold 10000 RF, this gives you a buffer of energy so you can swap engines/batteries around without interupting something.

Buildcraft Kinesis Pipes cannot explode anymore. No matter what you do to them. A Diamond Kinesis Pipe can store 14,336 MJ, fourteen times that of a TE Conduit. Admittedly, this is not really a supported use of Pipes.

But what if you only want to connect a single device and it touches 2 different devices (tight spaces, ect). Mah fist can't just turn off one of the connections. :O

Plugs? They are dirt cheap.

Then you'd just see someone add a Quarry and Filler to Thermal Expansion and BC would be truely up shit creak. Forestry and Railcraft don't have anything special that another mod doesn't do easier atm.

I also would rather see a clean split rather than having Thermal Expansion lock BC/RC and Forestry out of the Power Generation side of the equation.

 

[Munaus]

Welcome back SpaceToad! Loved your work!
Hope you make it to the introduction section someday soon

 

[CovertJaguar]

Then the only reason they ever used MJ was because KL covered up the part of the power system they didn't like which happens to be the crux of the power system you wish to achieve. In the end those that turned away never wanted MJ; they wanted the best of MJ and EU combined. RF does this and more.

The part of the power system people didn't like was the powerloss per pipe and exploding pipes. Both of which have since been removed, I didn't like them either.

 

[Hoff]

I also would rather see a clean split rather than having Thermal Expansion lock BC/RC and Forestry out of the Power Generation side of the equation.

Then most would just use Mekanism to do it if they wanted it without the BC/RC/Forestry production.

I don't see why you take issue with people wanting to use some of the things the mods have to offer even if they don't agree with other parts. What is bad in that?

 

[King Lemming]

If i'm thinking of what your thinking is that when you looped the pipe in a circle and it blew up in your face? It was amusing the first time I did it and I never really though of a way to make it a buffer. The TE Conduits held 1000MJ in each segment before the change now they hold 10000 RF, this gives you a buffer of energy so you can swap engines/batteries around without interupting something.

Technically, this isn't *quite* right. Certain conduits have a buffer, and the buffer is 6 times the throughput of the conduit. So, 60k RF on the top-end ones, but not every conduit in the grid has a need for a buffer.

 

[Vauthil]

Modspeak should be in a different color

I usually use the red, it's true. I didn't want to come off as angry in this particular thread, though, so I stuck with just bold.

Oh, and for folks worrying about this wandering off-topic: as long as the rhetorical knives remain sheathed, a little diversion hither and thither isn't bad. If we locked every thread that wandered, there'd be a lot of little padlocks all over the forums. I think the discussion's current turn gives a window into stuff people in the community don't normally feel engaged with, though, so I'm going to sit and enjoy as long as people play nice. I'm getting an education myself on stuff I haven't looked into/thought about for a good while, at least. =)

 

[Hoff]

The part of the power system people didn't like was the powerloss per pipe and exploding pipes. Both of which have since been removed, I didn't like them either.

Doesn't seem to be quite so since most seem to prefer RF.

I will again stress that the way with which you want people to use MJ is not bad it just will not(IMO) suit most players. Why then lock them out of the rest of your mod?

 

[Sarda]

I also would rather see a clean split rather than having Thermal Expansion lock BC/RC and Forestry out of the Power Generation side of the equation.

Why not just get rid of MJ and adopt RF for BC/RC/Forestry? Then you'd be part of the power generation.

 

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Plugs? They are dirt cheap.

The assembly tables and lasers required to make them, however, are not.

This is kinda one of my problems with pipes these days. If you want to do anything with them, you've got to have an Assembly Table and a whole mess of Lasers (unless you wish to just set it up and go AFK for a few hours while it processes your request) to make it work. Pipes were supposed to be early-game. Now they're really not.

I also would rather see a clean split rather than having Thermal Expansion lock BC/RC and Forestry out of the Power Generation side of the equation.

I don't see what you mean by 'locking BC/RC out of the power generation side of the equation'.

Mekanism already has a better Quarry. My only real hangup in not wanting to get rid of Railcraft are the actual rails themselves. I have yet to use Railcraft to produce power at all in 1.6.x.

 

[CovertJaguar]

Doesn't seem to be quite so since most seem to prefer RF.

Most people switched back when Conductive Pipes were exploding right and left. And I don't blame them. Pipes sucked. Now they don't, but the people still think they do.

 

[Hoff]

Now they don't, but the people still think they do.

Why are you presuming on that though? I've tried kinetic pipes. They're pretty good. Made some nice systems. In the end though I didn't want to have to focus on my power generation. It's a bit of a minigame in BC/RC/Forestry which it would seem most do not wish to participate.

 

[CovertJaguar]

Why are you presuming on that though? I've tried kinetic pipes. They're pretty good. Made some nice systems. In the end though I didn't want to have to focus on my power generation. It's a bit of a minigame in BC/RC/Forestry which it would seem most do not wish to participate.

Which is why I'd rather see a clean split, because right now we have two different target audiences. And frankly I'm tired of seeing the TE people rant on BC constantly.

 

[mohrad]

Most people switched back when Conductive Pipes were exploding right and left. And I don't blame them. Pipes sucked. Now they don't, but the people still think they do.

Well, if i am to be honest here. I do not think pipes suck, for me pipes were equal to the conduits (never cared for powerloss, could work around 'splosions) up to the point when KL implemented the thingmajig that lets you adjust the conduit to input/output per side within one block. I'm always seeking for ways to have my builds simplified and more compact.
Pipes become great once more with the Plugs, but again the assembly table is a hinderance for early game while both pipes and conduits are "almost" equally cheap - leading to obvious choice if You are a extension-type builder of your maps.

 

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Most people switched back when Conductive Pipes were exploding right and left. And I don't blame them. Pipes sucked. Now they don't, but the people still think they do.

Redstone Flux mechanic didn't come out until the Kenesis Pipe update.

People switched back when Conductive Pipes were lossy, not because of possible explosions. Now Kenesis Pipes aren't lossy, however there are other problems inherent in the system.

Which is why I'd rather see a clean split, because right now we have two different target audiences. And frankly I'm tired of seeing the TE people rant on BC constantly.

There are -always- going to be comparisons. Back in 1.2 era, it was comparing IC2 EU vs BC MJ. Now it's MJ vs RF because most people have thrown up their hands at the IC2-EX power network, so it isn't even worth discussing in comparison to the others anymore.

Comparison isn't a bad thing. In fact, for users, it is critical and absolutely necessary to determine which mod better suits their needs. I will, however, agree that people need to put comparisons in a positive rather than negative light.

 

[Hoff]

Which is why I'd rather see a clean split, because right now we have two different target audiences. And frankly I'm tired of seeing the TE people rant on BC constantly.

I would still like a reason why you'd want to lock people out of the other content if they don't want to participate in said "minigame". While the audiences may be different in some areas there are obviously overlaps. Those that do want to use MJ the way you envision it will. Those that don't won't but will still be able to use other parts of the mod as envisioned.

I won't say that you shouldn't be against a clean split but to me it just seems odd that you'd want to keep people out from using your mod if they don't follow specific guidelines.

 

[CovertJaguar]

I would still like a reason why you'd want to lock people out of the other content if they don't want to participate in said "minigame". While the audiences may be different in some areas there are obviously overlaps. Those that do want to use MJ the way you envision it will. Those that don't won't but will still be able to use other parts of the mod as envisioned.

I won't say that you shouldn't be against a clean split but to me it just seems odd that you'd want to keep people out from using your mod if they don't follow specific guidelines.

Flip the situation around and ask, "Why is Thermal Expansion is locking out people from using BC/RC/Forestry power generation?"

Because right now, if I want to use a Combustion Engine to power a Thermal Expansion machine, I can't. But I can use a Dynamo to power an Assembly Laser just fine.

I think you see must see why I don't like this situation.

 

[CascadingDragon]

Flip the situation around and ask, "Why is Thermal Expansion is locking out people from using BC/RC/Forestry power generation?"

How are they? If they have BC/RC/Forestry installed, they can use conductive pipes, and then use conduits for their TE stuff. No one is locking anyone out...