No but it shouldn't be hard to make it work like that. The RF api basically causes numbers coming from one block to show up in another. If nothing else you could run two separate instances of the API with each picking up and moving a separate set of numbers.
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No but it shouldn't be hard to make it work like that. The RF api basically causes numbers coming from one block to show up in another. If nothing else you could run two separate instances of the API with each picking up and moving a separate set of numbers.
Well one tile entity cannot implement it twice - you would need to make a copy of the whole RF API to make this work. Not a good idea.
In this case a dedicated two-variable system makes more sense.
Here's the thing. People are pressured to do things daily. What's stopping someone from quitting their job? The pressure of needing money to live. The pressure to use an API is nothing new in the world for everyone. It's just pressure being shown in a different light than normal.
I did not anywhere in my post imply that it's good to be under pressure for things that you don't want to do. I simply stated the obvious fact that everyone faces some sort of pressure and this is no different. Please do not attempt to make it seem like I said otherwise.
It was suggested that we REDThread this discussion. So here I am, moving it here.
In the interest of full disclosure I made two edits to my quote and didn't try to replicate all the nested quotes.
Now for my continuation on the thread.
The problem is it's the same exact functionally to a player. They get stuff they didn't work for. Which is the ONLY valid argument I have yet seen in this discussion (and other similar ones). There are a dozen ways to obtain Reikas materials that don't involve personally walking his tech tree, his focus on EMC in particular is blindered and shows a distinct lack of understanding on how the systems work as implemented by Project E, there's been a couple places on the comments where he's said things (paraphrasing here, possibly misremembering) like "I was told" or other hints that the information he was basing his opinion on is at best second hand. Obtaining it from another player does not magically make you able to use Reika's mods. It's literally functionally equivalent to using a Trade-o-mat or creative mode/NEI to cheat in those items. You get items for no personal effort, thereby skipping the tech tree. ProjectE is FAR from unique there, and in fact is a reasonably balanced method for obtainment of resources from ones you find otherwise useless.
"What about players that complain to me because they broke their world" Is some kind of logical fallacy or deflection that I don't know the whole list well enough to explicitly name, but it's most certainly disingenuous. Users WILL complain, those complaints WILL be illegitimate much of the time. What you do is inform them they're being idiots and MOVE ON. This is no author's fault in any way, and asking another author to subvert the ENTIRE POINT OF THEIR MOD because it can be made to interact poorly with yours is bad form! I may as well say to Reika "Your mods are OP. Players get unbreakable tools and armor, and can spawn mobs too fast, and fly, and generate millions of RF/tick, and radiation is deadly, and the neutrons are killing my livestock, and ore decitriplification (13 times multiplier... only available to some very specific ores, the extractor for "standard" ores is... 5? Why can I not remember the value right now? I know it's lower than 9 and above 3... oh well) is WAY overpowered!!!!111!one". It demonstrates a practically criminal negligence in my investigation of the mod and a blatant misunderstanding of the difficulty required to get these capabilities.
"Well if ProjectE does it, why aren't I allowed to do it?"
In what way? Project E allowing you to create items from useless stuff? Can't MineChem decompose/recompose reika's stuff (haven't tried), or the TT essentia constructor thingy? As far as I am currently aware, the only issue at current is with EMC. That could obviously be wrong as I haven't done any actual research into this... But it's irrelevant to my answer: "Because Project E does not allow me to block my items", or "because I have decided to personally support Project E", or "because you haven't asked", or any number of other responses you're going to have to deal with ANYWAY no matter WHAT you decide on basically ANY issue. People are people, and that kind of question is a part of life as a content creator, especially a mod author in Modded Minecraft.
As for EMC generation from power, that's actually not something that's in-line with the way EMC works originally and with the way Reika generates power could make the solar flowers look like dinky little toy waterwheels as compared to the Three Gorges Dam (it does do hydro-electric power, yeah?). EMC is at its core a method of turning items into other items via an intermediary step, sometimes using them as fuel. Being able to convert the millions of RF/tick that Reika's mods can generate into diamonds or whatever else is something I personally would NEVER support. I already dislike collectors being able to pump EMC into condensers with the relay bonus system, and the proposed idea would make that system look like a useless toy. I shudder in fear. That would do nothing but tarnish the reputation of EMC mods and Reika even further.
In the interest of full disclosure I made two edits to my quote and didn't try to replicate all the nested quotes.
This just happened:
https://github.com/sinkillerj/ProjectE/pull/588
I wonder if he is the same person as yoshiman22:
https://github.com/MightyPirates/OpenComputers/issues/911
https://github.com/SleepyTrousers/EnderIO/issues/2068
Now for my continuation on the thread.
The problem is it's the same exact functionally to a player. They get stuff they didn't work for. Which is the ONLY valid argument I have yet seen in this discussion (and other similar ones). There are a dozen ways to obtain Reikas materials that don't involve personally walking his tech tree, his focus on EMC in particular is blindered and shows a distinct lack of understanding on how the systems work as implemented by Project E, there's been a couple places on the comments where he's said things (paraphrasing here, possibly misremembering) like "I was told" or other hints that the information he was basing his opinion on is at best second hand. Obtaining it from another player does not magically make you able to use Reika's mods. It's literally functionally equivalent to using a Trade-o-mat or creative mode/NEI to cheat in those items. You get items for no personal effort, thereby skipping the tech tree. ProjectE is FAR from unique there, and in fact is a reasonably balanced method for obtainment of resources from ones you find otherwise useless.
"What about players that complain to me because they broke their world" Is some kind of logical fallacy or deflection that I don't know the whole list well enough to explicitly name, but it's most certainly disingenuous. Users WILL complain, those complaints WILL be illegitimate much of the time. What you do is inform them they're being idiots and MOVE ON. This is no author's fault in any way, and asking another author to subvert the ENTIRE POINT OF THEIR MOD because it can be made to interact poorly with yours is bad form! I may as well say to Reika "Your mods are OP. Players get unbreakable tools and armor, and can spawn mobs too fast, and fly, and generate millions of RF/tick, and radiation is deadly, and the neutrons are killing my livestock, and ore decitriplification (13 times multiplier... only available to some very specific ores, the extractor for "standard" ores is... 5? Why can I not remember the value right now? I know it's lower than 9 and above 3... oh well) is WAY overpowered!!!!111!one". It demonstrates a practically criminal negligence in my investigation of the mod and a blatant misunderstanding of the difficulty required to get these capabilities.
"Well if ProjectE does it, why aren't I allowed to do it?"
In what way? Project E allowing you to create items from useless stuff? Can't MineChem decompose/recompose reika's stuff (haven't tried), or the TT essentia constructor thingy? As far as I am currently aware, the only issue at current is with EMC. That could obviously be wrong as I haven't done any actual research into this... But it's irrelevant to my answer: "Because Project E does not allow me to block my items", or "because I have decided to personally support Project E", or "because you haven't asked", or any number of other responses you're going to have to deal with ANYWAY no matter WHAT you decide on basically ANY issue. People are people, and that kind of question is a part of life as a content creator, especially a mod author in Modded Minecraft.
As for EMC generation from power, that's actually not something that's in-line with the way EMC works originally and with the way Reika generates power could make the solar flowers look like dinky little toy waterwheels as compared to the Three Gorges Dam (it does do hydro-electric power, yeah?). EMC is at its core a method of turning items into other items via an intermediary step, sometimes using them as fuel. Being able to convert the millions of RF/tick that Reika's mods can generate into diamonds or whatever else is something I personally would NEVER support. I already dislike collectors being able to pump EMC into condensers with the relay bonus system, and the proposed idea would make that system look like a useless toy. I shudder in fear. That would do nothing but tarnish the reputation of EMC mods and Reika even further.
Rotarycraft is visible source, with a specific allowance of modifying it for personal use. This means he's outright saying you can do anything to the mod, to the tech tree, to the recipes, or anything else, to your heart's content.
Whether I want to use creative mode to spawn an item, modify the source code, use an alternative recipe mod, use magic numbers to create them based on their presumed value, use near-infinite energy production setups to auto-mine and auto-craft the materials to make them, or do it the old fashion hard way, it's all the same. It's the player's choice. Reika may have some limited control over what you can do with the mod itself, but not with how the mod interacts with the rest of the game or other mods. I can just as easily throw off Rotarycraft's (or any mod's) balance by creating a world with a massive deposits of the materials I need to make its machines. It's simply not the community's responsibility to maintain a single mod's balance. That's up to the player.
Whether I want to use creative mode to spawn an item, modify the source code, use an alternative recipe mod, use magic numbers to create them based on their presumed value, use near-infinite energy production setups to auto-mine and auto-craft the materials to make them, or do it the old fashion hard way, it's all the same. It's the player's choice. Reika may have some limited control over what you can do with the mod itself, but not with how the mod interacts with the rest of the game or other mods. I can just as easily throw off Rotarycraft's (or any mod's) balance by creating a world with a massive deposits of the materials I need to make its machines. It's simply not the community's responsibility to maintain a single mod's balance. That's up to the player.
Is this another argument about a certain mod dev trying to top players from using there mods in any way other than how the dev wants them to?
For bobs sake pull that stick out of your azz.
If your excuse is the number of bug posts you are getting. Fix your dingbat mods.
Or add a disclaimer stating "Not responsible for bus and issues derived from the third party modifications or mod interactions.".
Seriously no mod dev has the right to dictate how other devs make there mods. Or the right to say how players use there mods. (Seriously ProgectE has always bin the to hell with balance mod cause not even EE2's original dev could make it balanced. If you have that mod in your pack you do not care about balance. Not all pack devs give a freck about balance. Some of them want pack that are, shocking, supposed to be just fun.)
Once you distribute it you lose that sort of control. You are giving the mod out saying go have fun and do whatever.
The bottom line is you don't have to listen to there complaints but you can't say that they have no right to make them.
Just like devs can complain about those complaints but we do not have to listen.
On this subject, RF>EMC conversion is a terrible idea. I agree with that much.
Reika blacklisting projectE? I could see him not wanting you to make the machines or pre-processed materials with projectE, but raw materials? No. I should be able to turn my stack of diamond into fourite or whatever materials rotarycraft has. There's no tech tree jump. It may make progression faster yes, but you can't jump tiers with projectE. That's just not how it works.
Reika blacklisting projectE? I could see him not wanting you to make the machines or pre-processed materials with projectE, but raw materials? No. I should be able to turn my stack of diamond into fourite or whatever materials rotarycraft has. There's no tech tree jump. It may make progression faster yes, but you can't jump tiers with projectE. That's just not how it works.
Are you really that f***ing entitled? Go out and make your own mod and then do whatever you like with it instead of wasting our time.
Currently I am helping manage a pack that is ridiculously over powered. It includes Orespawn, ProjectE, Magical crops, MFR, Veinminer, morph and lucky blocks (as well as lots of others). Expoits are encouraged, not nerfed (e.g. ProjectE tome is enabled). Unfortunately it seems like I can't have any of Reika's mods in the pack.
Though who am I to say "Tinkers Construct, remove your silky jewel because it breaks my mod!!11" ?
Entitled: believing oneself to be inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment.
Where is that post did I suggest that I was entitled? If anything my post suggests it's some mod deves who act entitled.
The whole point of that post is to state that even if you create something that hardly gives you say so in how others use it once it's bin released to the public.
Every mod dev ever gets stupid bug complaints. Complaints about old long fixed bugs, using mods with the wrong version of mc, not installing required core mods, and complaints about bugs that has nothing to do with there mod. Most mod devs don't hop on to simi-related forums and complain about it every few months.
And false bugs caused by cross mod interactions are not false. They are valid bugs that need to be recognized.
Well, sort of. The problem with some of these interactions is that the stacktrace can easily point to the wrong mod. Happened just the other day with something pointing at CoFH. Unless Fastcraft is installed, then it points to Fastcraft. Fact is, it isn't either of those, it's an unknown mod messing with chunk loading.
B
Big Bad
Guest
Just popping my head in to remind everyone that civility is greatly appreciated here. I know modded Minecraft is srs bisniss, but if we could tone down the toxic antics a bit, that'd be super.
Oh, lets see. Having to work hard, and with great difficulty, to get some jet fuel, or performance additives, or even your first bucket of lube, only to then turn around and mass produce those in very large quantity ...
Or ... lets say I charge up an industrial coil to 720 (max), break it into item form, and duplicate it at that max charge level, assuming this is how EMC works.
Or, if I am able to generate my first bedrock dust, only to duplicate this little dust in large quantities with no effort.
Or, if the large amount of resources needed to make a solenoid, or magnet, or other expensive item that I need lots and lots of, can be skipped with the junk that I have tons of ...
And, now that I think of it, why not duplicate my nuclear waste and drop it through a portal that goes to an enemy base. Server griefing in a way that even the "pay money for bedrock tools" server didn't think of.
Or ... lets say I charge up an industrial coil to 720 (max), break it into item form, and duplicate it at that max charge level, assuming this is how EMC works.
Or, if I am able to generate my first bedrock dust, only to duplicate this little dust in large quantities with no effort.
Or, if the large amount of resources needed to make a solenoid, or magnet, or other expensive item that I need lots and lots of, can be skipped with the junk that I have tons of ...
And, now that I think of it, why not duplicate my nuclear waste and drop it through a portal that goes to an enemy base. Server griefing in a way that even the "pay money for bedrock tools" server didn't think of.
Sounds like you don't quite know how EMC works.
a. you won't be able to just pull this stuff out of nothing for free, it's a cost equal to the value of the item, and highly configurable, so you can make valuable stuff valuable and not so valuable stuff not so valuable, or even make the only items with EMC values are raw unprocessed materials like ore. So like, something that costs 10 diamonds and a stack of iron total to craft would be worth an EMC equal to the sum of 10 diamonds and a stack of iron.
b. that is absolutely not how projectE works. The industrial coil would be empty on production, not full.
c. if you even give bedrock dust an EMC value (which I personally wouldn't) it would be really high, somewhere from 5-7 digits. You won't be able to pull out a barrel's worth with little to no effort.
d. I don't know what any of those are, or how to make them, but how the heck would you skip them with projectE? If you can't skip it without projectE, you can't skip it with. And super expensive items would be super expensive in terms of EMC, so yeah.
e. If toxic waste isn't already used to grief, then they're expensive enough that if one did make an automatic production system for them, it would be really expensive and almost entirely not worth it. And besides that, any pack dev that decides to get toxic waste an EMC value is a fool.
True facts about projectE:
- tier skipping is not possible unless it's possible without projectE or you enable the tome.
- it has no defaults for rotarycraft. Creating the EMC values is up to the player/pack developer.
- Items with damage values enter the tablet at an undamaged, or empty state. Energy duplication is not a factor.
- EMC is supposed to be equivalent exchange, trading an item for its equivalent. It should not be NEI in block form.
Assuming this is how EMC works?!?
Are you kidding me?!?
You are complaining about a mod you have never even used before!!!
Excuse me while I go into another room and cus for a while.
Ok ignoring just how wrong it is to complain about things you know nothing about.
Mass producing anything using EMC takes a considerable effort to set up any system to make the emc in the first place. It's not simply a snap your fingers and get everything for free system.
Internal power states are not saved.
Bedrock can not be created using EMC normally.
And considering that all it takes to harvest more bedrock is to move the machines one block over and wait a while I don't see the problem with speeding things up. Monotony is the enemy of any game.
What items you do not use in one mod you will probably use in another.
And EMC values are based on rarity. So you would need many times the amount of common ingots to make just one rare.
Not that it matters as once you set up a proper quarry all resources become rather common.
And if nothing else this gives you a way to get rid of the items you deem junk instead of having them clutter up your inventory.
And if you think that only ProjectE allows players to grief like that thin you are in some serious denial.
TNT, mob spawner, lava. There are tones of ways to grief through portals that has nothing to do with ProjectE.