FTB Mod Discussion: Greg-Tech

[CrissHill]

Kenken, I notice that you and the few people actually defending this mod are resorting more to insults rather than facts. Please stop that. Remember what the first page postings said, we don't need this to be a 20 page flame war. You've said your piece, move on.

I'm not sure why you're even saying this to Kenken though. I think we're reading different threads.

 

[Xeonen]

Yet getting Awesome Sowrd of Awesomeness (quarry), that lets you kill everything with single blow, on first defeated enemy is a good game design? You don't see people QQing about that, do you?

If you are thinking that minecraft is a game that can be won or lost, then you are either not understanding the whole concept of minecraft or you do understand but your fanaticsm is causing you a huge degree of cognitive dissonance.

Here you complain about tool that actually lets you decrease amount of grind you have problem with. The only thing in GT that is really "grindy" is Fussion Reactor And that's top-tier endgame stuff. If you don't feel like going for it who forces you? For some people it's a goal to go towards. Neither Ind. Grinder or Electrillizer require much resources to make. And GT actually helps you start with easier MFE and MFSU recipes for example.

I am seriously thinking that you either do not read what I do write or just can not understand that the time required even to advance the tech required to make an industrial electrolyzer is far more than enough to reach post scarcity game level in other mods and in vanilla minecraft.

BTW. How would you place a difference between "hard" and "grindy"? I guess you'd say learning how to play the violine is not hard, just grindy, would you?
Maybe just drop saying GT is hard and let people play however they want, without going into who is "right" about it.

I am glad that you haven given such a fine example, learning to play violin is hard because you are not learning just to do same swings instead you are learning micro-blocks of information, learning to use the bow is like learning to dig, learning each note is a different crafting recipe, simple on it's own yet requires a skill build up to be able to use them effectively and finally composing and playing that song is the ultimate thing since you create a complex system out of simple things.

If Gregory changed the method of learning to play the violin, you would only be using major notes but in order to play each note first you would have say "Oh Gregory thank you for the bow" for 1500 times then touch the string but it the area must be 15 micron or else you have to say "Oh Gregory forgive me." for 15000 times and in the end each song must be a tribute to the Gregorness of Gregory.

Hard hitting monsters and complexes that require very intricate design are hard things, making a strip mining shaft and doing branch mining for 15 hours is grinding.

 

[Adonis0]

Just an idea, I wonder if people are so polarised to greg-tech, simply because of threads like this?

Like, they become hate it and love it, because the people that liked it and disliked it started insulting each other and having their own go at shouting at the brick wall of the opposing sides opinion. And because they then start having strong feelings, people also take their sides, and thus perpetuate it..

Just an idea I had, wondering if it's true.

 

[Kocyk]

If you are thinking that minecraft is a game that can be won or lost, then you are either not understanding the whole concept of minecraft or you do understand but your fanaticsm is causing you a huge degree of cognitive dissonance.

Fanaticism? No, i'm just tired of one-sided ranting. I did not stated GT is a perfect mod or that i'm in love with Greg. And using fancy words trying to insult me doesn't make you less of a "phallus".
And the point was that once you get the best tools early on all others can just as well be removed, as using them is pointless. It was no more about winning or losing a game then your argument was.

I am seriously thinking that you either do not read what I do write or just can not understand that the time required even to advance the tech required to make an industrial electrolyzer is far more than enough to reach post scarcity game level in other mods and in vanilla minecraft.

So? That is why GT delays things like quarry or macerator further down the technological tree. Instead of making his mod fit to other ones, he goes the other way around. Is that "the bad way"? Or it just different?

Will you do strip mining after getting a quarry? I doubt it. At that point there is no grind, unless you consider placing a quarry 3-4 times grind.

 

[Loufmier]

Instead of making his mod fit to other ones, he goes the other way around. Is that "the bad way"?

that`s actually the reason for gt hatred. instead of being just an add on for IC2 it changes other mods to not look, lets say, unattractive. so in server environment with default confings(pretty much most of the servers) you are simply forced to mess around with gregtech.

 

[Harvest88]

that`s actually the reason for gt hatred. instead of being just an add on for IC2 it changes other mods to not look, lets say, unattractive. so in server environment with default confings(pretty much most of the servers) you are simply forced to mess around with gregtech.

Ever thought of working in a good team? Harder to get things done make sense to team up or at least each one does fewer things on the server. Also it's make the server's map last longer before it's boring to play on vs. vanilla ic2 where you fire up a mass fab overnight and make USPs the next day and the next couple of days making USPs automated then finally adding them on the roof automatically.

 

[Xeonen]

Fanaticism? No, i'm just tired of one-sided ranting. I did not stated GT is a perfect mod or that i'm in love with Greg. And using fancy words trying to insult me doesn't make you less of a "phallus".
And the point was that once you get the best tools early on all others can just as well be removed, as using them is pointless. It was no more about winning or losing a game then your argument was.

Will you produce an actually valid counter arguments call people dicks here and there?

You are still looking at Minecraft through the cognitive dissonance glasses, I will again point out that Minecraft isn't getting lots of minerals as quickly as possible. You aren't thinking like that as well, if you were you would've long stopped playing after reaching there three or four times. Minecraft is about building, design, contraptions. I will not share my observations from my server and hours of lets play series I've watched with and without GTech. People do not quit using their old tools as soon as they make new ones, I bet you haven seen anyone not carrying at least a drill, a pickaxe, power tool or at least a tinker's pick after they get to make a quarry, mining bore or mining laser and speaking of laser I bet you also keep and use your drill even after you get your mining laser. Not to grind ores but instead build and adventure.

In the end whole game is about variety and design, not reaching end of tech tree as soon as possible. Minecraft is Lego for adults.

So? That is why GT delays things like quarry or macerator further down the technological tree. Instead of making his mod fit to other ones, he goes the other way around. Is that "the bad way"? Or it just different?

Will you do strip mining after getting a quarry? I doubt it. At that point there is no grind, unless you consider placing a quarry 3-4 times grind.

Gregory doesn't need to code his add-on to IC2 in accordance with other mods and APIs, I don't see ShadowDrgn coding Soul Shards to fit other mods point of view or author of Ars Magica doing same thing, even there is Universal Electricity, couple of mods living in their own universe. Some modders including author of IC2 add on GTech add support for other mods like power support or configs to disable spawn of their own ores yet how many mods have you seen that changes other mods and forces you to play the way exactly author wishes. GTech is just an add on and it does that.

Terra Firma is very similar to GTech in most aspects yet you can't see me hating it for being what it is, I may even play it with joy.

 

[Loufmier]

Ever thought of working in a good team? Harder to get things done make sense to team up or at least each one does fewer things on the server.

playing in team solves 0 issues that gt has and pushes to other mods. and again there is no "hard to get" thing in gt, maybe you meant "long time wait to get"?

 

[Kocyk]

Will you produce an actually valid counter arguments call people dicks here and there?

You were the one to throw insults at me, i just responded in a simillar manner.

Minecraft is about building, design, contraptions.

Or is minecraft about playing however you want and for the most important part, having fun? If someone like to run around caves mining for resources do you have any right to say they play the game wrong?
And how exactly is GT stops you from doing that anyway?

Greg lately was adding stuff that makes some people belive he wants his mod to be standalone, not a add-on anymore. Time will tell.

 

[Xeonen]

You were the one to throw insults at me, i just responded in a simillar manner.


Or is minecraft about playing however you want and for the most important part, having fun? If someone like to run around caves mining for resources do you have any right to say they play the game wrong?
And how exactly is GT stops you from doing that anyway?

Greg lately was adding stuff that makes some people belive he wants his mod to be standalone, not a add-on anymore. Time will tell.

You do call other people dick and act all offended, being afraid of the things you don't know is primitive, you are more than that so act like it.

One of the mods which add tons of worldgen is Natura & Tinker's Construct couple, still I can play whole game without eating a single berry and making a single Tinker's Construct tool and it doesn't make game any harder but Gregory made the game so broken that I can not even enter nether without a huge deal of luck if I choose not to use GTech and do not act all apogeletic and say "But Gregory has blessed us with confiiigs!" I've kept trying GTech more than a few times even in our server and let me tell you even if you know what you are doing and familiar with the configs it takes around two hours of configuration and testing and you can still find a problem after two or three weeks.

Gregory also announced that he will keep his add-on IC2 only yet even if he wakes up one day and decides to use Buildcraft API, it doesn't change that he forces you to play the game according to his idea of "how minecraft should be played." he is essentially leeching other mods to get his add-on used. If you believe it is that good of an add-on then I happily challenge you to play Minecraft with IC2 and GTech.

 

[Kocyk]

You do call other people dick and act all offended, being afraid of the things you don't know is primitive, you are more than that so act like it.

You diagnosed me with a mental disorder after a single post. Should i be ok with that? Now you are acting offended after i called you a dick. From my standpoint i just described your personality with one word, knowing the same about you that you know about me. Offending YOU is being primitive, right?

I can not even enter nether without a huge deal of luck

If you are referring to change requiring steel in steel and flint recipe then i agree, he went too far there. That alone doesn't make it worth all that hate. Is GT doing anything else to stop you from playing the way you want? Or why can't you guys just remove GT from server? If not that means someone wants it there.

I've been playing FTB with GT since Mindcrack pack came out. I never complained about it being too intrusive, i actually liked how it was trying to bring some mods together.

 

[Xeonen]

You diagnosed me with a mental disorder after a single post. Should i be ok with that? Now you are acting offended after i called you a dick. From my standpoint i just described your personality with one word, knowing the same about you that you know about me. Offending YOU is being primitive, right?

It is no shame not to know things, but thinking that every word is an insult and starting to call names after that; well that is shameful, shame on you Kocyk, shame on you. Next time, do a google search.

If you are referring to change requiring steel in steel and flint recipe then i agree, he went too far there. That alone doesn't make it worth all that hate. Is GT doing anything else to stop you from playing the way you want? Or why can't you guys just remove GT from server? If not that means someone wants it there.

I've been playing FTB with GT since Mindcrack pack came out. I never complained about it being too intrusive, i actually liked how it was trying to bring some mods together.

What you are saying is equivalent of "If you don't like people not getting permissions for their packs, do not use those packs." well, FTB is here because of people above and beyond that thought, thankfully moreover, it is amusing to see someone finding an add-on that changes more than a hundred recipes from other mods, not intrusive.

Kocyk, lets do it this way, act mature and objective and we'll have a grown up discussion like I do with many others who like GTech and can think objectively.

 

[ICanHazCooKie]

Gregtech adds some cool stuff, but changes a lot and tends to make things take too long (data orbs take 10+minutes to make? ridiculous IMO).

 

[Kocyk]

It is no shame not to know things, but thinking that every word is an insult and starting to call names after that; well that is shameful, shame on you Kocyk, shame on you. Next time, do a google search.

Keep trying. You may be suprised, but i can recognise someone trying to play psychology games with me. It's and old trick to try lower the other person self-esteem. You are doing this in your every single response to me.

What you are saying is equivalent of "If you don't like people not getting permissions for their packs, do not use those packs." well, FTB is here because of people above and beyond that thought, thankfully moreover, it is amusing to see someone finding an add-on that changes more than a hundred recipes from other mods, not intrusive.

How that stops you from removing the mod altogether from your server? What i ment was saying that GT intrusiveness is not a problem to me, not that mod is not intrusive.

Kocyk, lets do it this way, act mature and objective and we'll have a grown up discussion like I do with many others who like GTech and can think objectively.

Start by dropping your narrow-minded hatred to GT, then we talk.

 

[snooder]

How that stops you from removing the mod altogether from your server? What i ment was saying that GT intrusiveness is not a problem to me, not that mod is not intrusive

A) The whole point of using a modpack is to have a solid defined set of mods that everyone on the server can use with minimal to zero setup time. Just download and go. When you have to start mucking around with configs and uninstalling mods to get the modpack to play correctly, you have a problem.

B) Overall what quite a few people are saying is that GregTech would be better if it was less intrusive. He has some good ideas and decent machines, but it's just ruined by how much he fucks with stuff he shouldn't. And they aren't wrong for making that opinion known.

 

[Kocyk]

I'm not saying people have no right to say their mind, considering i can see how some will not like GT. I am stating my own opinions as well. We have 1.5 beta pack with and without GT, maybe they will add woth options to Ultimate.
Thing is, Xeonen was already changing configs on his server, so he could've as well removed the mod if he don't like it so much.

 

[Dravarden]

I find gregtech to be an okay mod to add new stuff, but stop messing with my tin buckets/cells, scaffold, and the other shitload of recipes you have nerfed and not added a config option for no apparent fucking reason.

 

[Morvelaira]

Just because someone disagrees with you, does not mean that they are breaking forum rules. If you are going to report someone, make sure they are doing something that is actually rule-breaking. Any further frivolous, whiny reports (i.e., he disagreed with me, he's a dick and his post should be deleted) out of this thread will have consequences.
That said, if there are actual issues - the development of a flame war, name calling, personal attacks, or anything else that falls under the prohibitions on the rules tab at the top of the page - do not hesitate to report it to bring it to the moderator's attention. Just PLEASE know the difference between those things, and debate anger.

 

[PsionicArchon]

I'll be frank with everyone, I'm new to this board. I also neglected to read this thread in its entirety, during my months of lurking I know how these threads usually dissolve. The arguments I've seen on this last page alone have me believing that this comment will simply be overlooked as others attempt to continue squabbling with one another.

I enjoy Gregtech. May this not grab unwanted attention before my explanation is read..

As someone who's watched quite a number of Minecraft tutorials/videos/Let's Play series, who has also been the owner of an on and off server for several years now I have one thing to say about Gregtech: It forces automation. I say this loosely of course as Minecraft is a "play it your way" sort of game. You can always opt to take a more manual approach to resource gathering/processing however, in doing so you're going to inflate the time required to get your hands on some of the more advanced technical tools.

Allow me to explain. During my observations I've noted one thing. Servers that have Gregtech disabled, or have opted out of the "hard-mode" recipes all follow a singular trend: "Alright, I have a gravity chest plate that makes me indestructible and sixteen barrels full of UU-Matter, nothing can stop me!" or "I'm copping so and so to get all this free stuff with relative ease in the shortest amount of time possible." Most of these people duplicate Direwolf in the most un-creative ways imaginable. I've noticed this about FTB players.. If there's an easy solution to a problem, they'll latch onto it. So many people clamber for purely renewable energy sources like solar panels (slap it down and away you go!). Few people build complex frame contraptions to accomplish early game tasks (frames are inexpensive). Barely anyone dabbles with nuclear reactors anymore (why bother, I can just stack ultimate solars) ignoring the fact that there are some truly efficient hybrid setups (thank you Gregtech).

What I'm getting at here (it's late) is that many FTB players have become creatively stagnant. Minecraft is a game OF creativity, and if a mod comes out that adds a sleuth of new machines to a decaying mod, I'm all for it. It isn't perfect, but the approach it's taking can have enjoyable outcomes. "What do you mean I can't use my bare hands to squash metal together anymore!"

If you can't figure out what I'm getting at, during your next playthrough, disable advanced solars (if you have it enabled).

As for Gregtech modifying the recipes of other mods, I don't have a problem with this. This is going to piss off a lot of people but, I don't share the same philosophies or the mentality of many of the Minecraft modders. I'm an old gamer, I've been modding games for many years now. As a result, I've had the privilege of being a part of several modding communities and, never have I seen a community full of so many gargantuan egos. I see so many developers at each others throats and, at the throats of mod-pack compilers over copyright issues to content they've already signed off to Mojang (Minecraft TOS).

Take UT2004 for example. I never once had to beg for permission to use a mutator, or given mod on one of my servers. All that was required of me was that I not claim their mod as my own. No problem, I'm not going to steal what you rightfully worked on. There's a post here literally two pages long of stipulations and requirements for PRIVATE mod packs.. Are people honestly getting bent out of shape about Greg altering recipes? Aren't mods in general all about altering the content of someone else? Do you think that every KOTOR modder asks Bioware for explicit permission each time they wish to change something about their game?

All of these debates are rather silly. Here's an easy, manageable solution. Why doesn't the FTB team offer an option for a pre-configured configs for Gregtech during pack instillation? People have a tendency to play on servers that match their preferred style of mod configuration anyway.

 

[Celestialphoenix]

Personally I like gregtech- though I feel the same about some of the nerfs, it does force you to take a different route and play the modpack as a whole.

Once you really get into it you'll find there's a work around for almost all the nerfs in game. With a bit of ingenuity and imagination there's a solution available (sometimes better than was once nerfed).​

​

Result? an interesting challenge that'll reward your effort, and you'll feel kinda epic for getting there.

Not to mention GT adds several things which make the early, mid and late game a lot easier without feeling too overpowered.​

All of these debates are rather silly. Here's an easy, manageable solution. Why doesn't the FTB team offer an option for a pre-configured configs for Gregtech during pack instillation? People have a tendency to play on servers that match their preferred style of mod configuration anyway.

That is brilliant. Well said indeed.
(I've also noticed similar things with easymode or non-GT servers, there's always someone throwing UUM/diamonds about like candy. Its not quite like EE2- but feels very close to it)