Dartcraft: One of the most overpowered mods of our time

[schyman]

People, haters gonna hate. But don't let haters hurt bluedart because he is awesome

I don't see how there's any "hate" here and I might have missed it, but I've seen no negative statements about bluedart either, except for saying that he's using code that one shouldn't use with the force wrench.

Saying something might not be in line with other stuff in the pack (in other words, that it's "OP") is not remotely the same thing as hating the creator of said modpack.

I think bluedart does good things. I like some of the concepts (like spoil bags). That doesn't mean I think the mod is balanced compared to the other mods, just like in old technic railcraft and EE2 where unbalanced (in different directions, railcraft being very very low-power and EE2 being very very high-power).

 

[RedBoss]

Why couldn't mods allow more control in their configs or offer different versions with different power levels? MFR tree farms are OP compared to Steve's carts and forestry farms, why couldn't mfr offer configs that let you use harvesters as they are or a nerfed version closer to a forestry farm?

Why shouldn't Forestry and Steve's Carts offer configs so that they can be as effective as MFR?



MFR is about making mundane vanilla tasks simple. Read the MC Forum description of the mod. Mod devs make their mods for themselves.

 

[MCsherlock]

i really don't think dart craft is all that OP. for me the only things i have used are lumberjack axe and speed armor and they just save time which is brilliant.
and if you spend tonnes of time getting to higher levels then you deseve the small bonuses like furtune 5, which is still manual mining so thats boring

 

[YX33A]

I forget if I posted in this thread, but over powered is subjective. No, I don't really mean that everyone draws the line differently, I mean the fact that you HAVE to draw a line somewhere makes it subjective in this regard. I don't need a quantum physicists to tell me it's "over powered" compared to, say, vanilla minecraft. The fact that it allows for flight outside of creative mode is "over powered" enough there.

But drawing the line further then that means all kinds of fights can break out because everyone draws the line differently. As I might have stated, I know it's often very powerful to the point of almost being as easy a choice as "should I use energy condensers to make these" from EE2 whether or not to use it. But... I don't really mind. It's a fun mod that seems to have been meant for having fun while not making the grind needed too painful.

Though yeah, I agree about the Force Wrench. Tad bit too buggy for most peoples tastes. Could be handy, though.

 

[MCsherlock]

can someone tell me why force wrench on spawners is OP. vinilla spawners aren't that fast and the only time you would use it on soulshards is if you miss placed it.

 

[Zenthon_127]

Because they're bugged so that you can basically make them all blaze/skele spawners. Soul Shards is also leagues harder to get than a few Force Ingots, cobble and wood.

Honestly, it's not that bad, it's just the other bugs that corrupt maps that are truly terrible.

 

[KingTriaxx]

Okay, fine, but if you sit and grind for an hour, you can be end-game strong with any mod.

Because they have diamond everything. Armor, picks, shovels, axes, swords. Iron is good enough for everything but obsidian, and yet they're mining everything with diamond. There's no point to be burning diamond picks mining stone.

 

[Dravarden]

With a force wrench I got an ur ghast boss spawner.

 

[Succubism]

Because balance is important for server play. Single player it's typically not an issue, but it's annoying if you play on a server and try to 'restrain' yourself while the rest doesn't. There's a fine balance between making stuff too easy and making stuff too tedious, and it's good if mod authors provide configurations so they can be balanced in a pack against other mods. It's not good if 'new' mods make older mods more or less completely useless with the stuff they add. That's what I dislike about the force engine: it totally blows away other early power gen methods.

So what your saying is, if you have to make yourself suffer, everyone else should? That's fairly selfish of you to say. Who gives a rat's ass if people do shit differently? I see people doing massive, complicated shit with the modpack that I couldn't dream of doing with my feeble female mind. They're doing touch screen, Tony Stark shit fo' cryin' out loud. But you don't see me complaining that shit's too complicated for me to learn so everything should be simpler.
Let people do whatever the hell they want, it should only effect you if you're directly involved in a game with someone, in which case you may have a talk about how you want to play it with them. God forbid you spend a few minutes of your life doing so.

And well hey, maybe people would like a simpler option for an early game energy method. Maybe what's already existing has already been nerfed to no end so it's hard for people - like me - to get into it.

Do you know how hard it is for people like me to get into these modpacks when everything simple or uncompleted is made into a complex mess?
Bloody hell, I've been trying to get my fiance into this modpack since it came out of Beta. She's not having any of it. She finds it way too overwhelming, messy and complicated.

It's fine just to sit in your own bubble and say everything's terribly and inconveniently easy when you know it all, but when you're an average or "just starting" player you don't know anything because if it's not already complicated the chances are it will be in the next damn update.

So yeah, just maybe we'd like the simple option in what's designed to be an easier modpack without having to worry about someone tripping up your baby steps.

 

[KingTriaxx]

It's technically a couple of versions old, but might I suggest Laurence M's: Iskandar's Travels in Industrial Minecraft series? It's what got me into Minecraft and showed me the mods. Without that, I'd have been pretty overwhelmed.

 

[ShneekeyTheLost]

People comparing Dartcraft to EE2 might want to take something into consideration:

EE2 was balanced within itself, however it wasn't balanced with respect to other mods. The problem with EE2 wasn't that it required Dark Matter which was thousands and thousands of diamonds, the problem was that it forced you to be able to MAKE thousands and thousands of diamonds to be able to achieve this goal, and that being able to produce things in that quantity effectively trivialized every other mod, because the power level was just set so much higher.

It wasn't the toys and tools in EE2 that made it so unbalancing, it was the infrastructure that could trivialize other mods resource requirements. By the time you had, for example, Swiftwolf... you already HAD everything else in every other mod ever.

 

[Succubism]

It's technically a couple of versions old, but might I suggest Laurence M's: Iskandar's Travels in Industrial Minecraft series? It's what got me into Minecraft and showed me the mods. Without that, I'd have been pretty overwhelmed.

I'm not sure if this was directed at me or not, however I'mma answer anyway.
Back in "the day", my lass used to play Tekkit a lot. She liked it because it was simple, easy for her to grasp and mess with and it yielded fair reward whilst still posing a challenge to her creativity.
While there were "OP" mods like EE2 and such, she liked to use them but then think "well this is fairly easy to use, but how can I do shit without relying on it?"

I introduced FTB to her as "Tekkit with more in it." and she was fairly into it in the beginning until the challenge turned into "everything's basically rocket science" and she just lost interest.
I told her to watch the videos, but most of what we found just spoke in incoherent babble and jargon which she couldn't get into and again she lost interest.
I even tried teaching her myself but I'm a crappy teacher.

YogsCraft was good for a while. We like watching Yogscast together and we played that for a bit but the novelty wore off as it began to grow stale and abandoned. She took to new modpacks like Void's Wrath and Hexxit.

I'm slooowly turning her around to Unleashed, which is why I'm hoping desperately that shit doesn't just turn into a tremendous pile of fuck because I do like playing Unleashed and I enjoy playing with her.

 

[fergcraft]

People comparing Dartcraft to EE2 might want to take something into consideration:

EE2 was balanced within itself, however it wasn't balanced with respect to other mods. The problem with EE2 wasn't that it required Dark Matter which was thousands and thousands of diamonds, the problem was that it forced you to be able to MAKE thousands and thousands of diamonds to be able to achieve this goal, and that being able to produce things in that quantity effectively trivialized every other mod, because the power level was just set so much higher.

It wasn't the toys and tools in EE2 that made it so unbalancing, it was the infrastructure that could trivialize other mods resource requirements. By the time you had, for example, Swiftwolf... you already HAD everything else in every other mod ever.

I totally agree with you and my use of EE2 was just the complaint structure not the mod it's self because by itself it was awesome mod.

 

[Succubism]

I remember EE1, where I turned a single cobble into 9 diamonds with relays and retro-condensers.
That was amazing.

 

[KingTriaxx]

That's why I recommended Iskandar, because he's also confused by Technical Jargon so if he runs into it he'll stop and explain it. Plus he's funny, since he has a tendency to fall off of things, which I at least find humorous, because after a couple of videos you can tell when he's about to fall off something. It really does allieviate the tedium of building complex things.

 

[Flipz]

I'm giving a much-belated Be Nice warning, and a few other actions may be taken as well. This thread was not on my radar, but it certainly is now. Again, Be Nice.​

 

[Dravarden]

with EE2 being overpowered I would like to see someone use it as a stand-alone mod.

good luck making a single diamond out of only cobble

 

[ShneekeyTheLost]

with EE2 being overpowered I would like to see someone use it stand alone.

good luck making a single diamond out of only cobble

This is rather the point I was making, however it is ultimately a false one. Alchemy Bag + Black Hole Band + Gem of Eternal Density (or simply void ring). Then you just use the Destruction Catalyst to clear out All The Things. Heck, the Destruction Catalyst is FAR faster than any quarry ever thought up, and since we're talking 'no other mods', there's no reason to mine at any level other than diamond, so you don't even have the layers upon layers to dig through, just run one tier at 6-8, one at 9-11. and one at 12-15. Three layers of tunnels, and you've got All The Things you could ever want to get your flowers set up properly.

 

[thephoenixlodge]

Honestly, I don't have much of a qualm with DartCraft in general except for one thing; the ability to upgrade impregnated frames to Proven frames by the addition of 8 force sticks. While yes, this is amazingly convenient, it outright just spits in the face of Forestry's balance of having the 3x longer lasting frame normally only available by villager trading by changing this otherwise less than convenient system to one that adds the small cost of a resource that is in my opinion, very cheap and usually trivial to obtain by the time you usually have the infrastructure to make impregnated frames set up in the first place, essentially allowing for a free tripling of frame durability for bee automation.
I would find this hugely more acceptable if it was configurable (feel free to inform me if it is configurable in newer versions than is present in unleashed v1.1.3). The alternate BC quarry recipe is configurable, so why shouldn't this frame recipe be configurable too?

 

[zorn]

Why shouldn't Forestry and Steve's Carts offer configs so that they can be as effective as MFR?



MFR is about making mundane vanilla tasks simple. Read the MC Forum description of the mod. Mod devs make their mods for themselves.

Yes this is exactly right. I personally would nerf the mfr harvester but other might want to buff the others. If you look at all of these arguments, offering more configs solves them all.

Dartcraft can makes changes, but it won't ever stop thes discussions IMO. There will always be people arguing a mid is too much like EE2 and others arguing a mod is too much like gregtech.

Deeper configs would solve everything. Like getting to creative style play in an hour? Have fun. Want to balance out some items so people on your server aren't all racing for the few strong items? You can both play the same mod.

THAT, I think is what all mod authors want - more people playing their mod. If they made it for themselves they wouldn't release them publicly.