If the mod comes with no way to remove its recipes, I am happy to put this recipe remover mod on. But why so if I have to keep adding mods for fixing something that supposed to be working?
Advanced safe?
- Thread starter vince959
- Start date
If the mod comes with no way to remove its recipes, I am happy to put this recipe remover mod on. But why so if I have to keep adding mods for fixing something that supposed to be working?
Unless you are living in America, that is indeed the case in most "western" countries - a reasonable suspicion is needed FIRST, before any action may take place against the suspect. What you want is a dictatorship over your servers "citizens". Which in the end usually never works out well. But I can agree that we disagree here. I prefer an admin that does his job in a "I trust my players until I'm proven wrong" way, rather than a "I don't trust my players at all" way. Which is fine - I just have to remember to not play on your server.
I was quoting what you said and giving out an example based on what you mean by that, or at least what I got based on what you said. So it is not me wanting dictatorship over my players.
It sounds more like "you don't trust the admin" rather than "the admin does not trust the players". You think when admin check on your safes, they must be trying to steal or grief.
Otherwise, why it has to come down to when the admin does not trust the player, he can only blow open the players safe just for inspection?
If the admin truly believes and have all evidence that the player griefs or steals (provided that the server has enough mod to check all players inventories in background), he can use the ban hammer without even checking the players safe. So I assume the purpose of the safe is for those more advanced server hostings. And so there is an option in config to disable this safe for good but in fact I cannot. For those who do not have the tools, why have to deal with this management hardship.
When police has a reasonable suspicion on someone, they open a file and would do checking in the background (without the suspect's knowing). Once they get hard evidence, then they will take action against the suspect. The law system working in many countries are "innocent unless proven guilty", hard evidence also not 100% fool proof and that does not mean the "suspect" is truly innocent before the judge announces him guilty.
And with the advanced safe in a state it currently at, admins has no way to check unless:
1. of course, install more mods, which increase server load no matter how lightweight the mod is.
2. going high profile, blast his way through, alerting the players.
Oh and you don't say "get more money to get a better server before hosting, otherwise you admins have to live with it", please. I am hosting with my own wallet and want people to have fun.
Every place has its own rules. Like it or not. But this game world is becoming more and more dictatorship like. Do you read EULA when you install games? You don't feel like binding by the rules the company set for the game, you can decline the EULA and stop installing or playing the game.
Uhm.. why does an admin have to have access to that safe? I mean, an admin knowing his or her tools of the trade does not have to worry about "illegal" blocks or the likes and if a player wants to store away stuff out of anyone's sight, so be it. And in case it is obvious, that action has to be taken due to someone hacking/duping/whatever.. well.. it CAN be destroyed with TNT and it's not really a shame to use this, as the person owning the a-safe has done something very wrong in the first place and probably is not a healthy addition to your servers' community. Though if I were said admin, I'd probably spawn in an ICBM and place a sign down the hole saying "That'll teach ya!".
I mean, if it's just a case of "I r teh admin. I must haz teh powah.".. thats a bit dodgy for an admin in the first place. ^^
Its not a case of I r teh Admin as you put it. Plain and simple if you are the owner of a server then you are the power. I have stashes all over my server 90% of which is protected in no way at all save I am the only one that knows the location. And hey, if someone found it then so be it; I lose out fair and square. For anything else there are regular safes that do the job nicely. So hey get this!! As the admin NOTHING should be off limits to you. Go play any MMO like WoW, Aion, Guild Wars 1 or 2, and a host of others and tell the admins. I am locking you out and you have no power, stuff it! Watch how fast they tell you buh-bye!! It boils down to no person no matter how good or bad their mod is should be making the game harder for an admin to manage their server. And again if you are an owner of a server and have an admin stealing from others slap them with the ban hammer and move on. To you admins out there ripping people off, STOP !! What sick satisfaction can you possibly get from that? I really love this special quote of yours "Unless you are living in America, that is indeed the case in most "western" countries - a reasonable suspicion is needed FIRST, before any action may take place against the suspect. What you want is a dictatorship over your servers "citizens". Which in the end usually never works out well." seriously? We do not need suspicion on a server. First I could if I so felt the need just ban you and ignore you without a second thought. Seems rude and it is, and so not my way of handling things. If a suspicion of someone stealing is ever brought to my attention then all I ever need to do if check the logs. They will tell me everything I need to know and I can then take appropriate action. Has nothing to do with America, or Dictatorships.. its about what true and fair!!
Get a clue. We do not provide servers for people to play on and have fun, just to have our hard work trashed. Not to mention there are those of us out there that pay for these servers out of our own pockets and do not require payment from their player base. Again Its not about dictatorship or because we are from America. Its about making sure we A) knowing whats being used or done (advanced safes are buggy at best) and also locks admins out, wrong. B) we are able to keep the server healthy (we disable items or other crap for a reason). C) we are able to protect our citizens from others doing harm to the best of our ability. No matter what form of harm that may be. Simply put follow your server rules and there is no issue.
Bunny... I suggest you take your meds. You seem a bit too excited. If you and vince959 deem it fine to sniff through your players private belongings, as I said, that's cool for me. But don't expect me to change my mind just because you say so. If a safe is offered by the server, I expect it to be just that: safe. if it isn't, leave it out completely. Oh and don't get me started on the whole patriot act business - seeing you all up in arms because I used america as an obvious prime example of ignorance in terms of privacy, appears to have hit a weak spot (come on, write another lengthy article about me being all anti-american^^).
Saying 'my server - my rules' is exactly the quintessence of small scale dictatorship. Replace server with country and voilà. Of COURSE you decide what's cool and what's not, because yes, it IS your server. But that does neither mean people have to fall on their knees and like it that way, nor does it magically create democracy out of thin air inside said servers community. I never wrote about what an admin "must do in order to", but rather what I "prefer about an admin doing his job in another way".
And finally, don't be all that swanky about important admin business. I host myself, no need to recite the whole admin 101. I'll just add yours to the list of "Don't play there" servers and we both can go on with our lives.
Saying 'my server - my rules' is exactly the quintessence of small scale dictatorship. Replace server with country and voilà. Of COURSE you decide what's cool and what's not, because yes, it IS your server. But that does neither mean people have to fall on their knees and like it that way, nor does it magically create democracy out of thin air inside said servers community. I never wrote about what an admin "must do in order to", but rather what I "prefer about an admin doing his job in another way".
And finally, don't be all that swanky about important admin business. I host myself, no need to recite the whole admin 101. I'll just add yours to the list of "Don't play there" servers and we both can go on with our lives.
Bunny... I suggest you take your meds. You seem a bit too excited. If you and vince959 deem it fine to sniff through your players private belongings, as I said, that's cool for me. But don't expect me to change my mind just because you say so. If a safe is offered by the server, I expect it to be just that: safe. if it isn't, leave it out completely. Oh and don't get me started on the whole patriot act business - seeing you all up in arms because I used america as an obvious prime example of ignorance in terms of privacy, appears to have hit a weak spot (come on, write another lengthy article about me being all anti-american^^).
Saying 'my server - my rules' is exactly the quintessence of small scale dictatorship. Replace server with country and voilà. Of COURSE you decide what's cool and what's not, because yes, it IS your server. But that does neither mean people have to fall on their knees and like it that way, nor does it magically create democracy out of thin air inside said servers community. I never wrote about what an admin "must do in order to", but rather what I "prefer about an admin doing his job in another way".
And finally, don't be all that swanky about important admin business. I host myself, no need to recite the whole admin 101. I'll just add yours to the list of "Don't play there" servers and we both can go on with our lives.
I do not expect you would change your mind but obviously you did not get my point or did you even pay attention reading. You keep saying when the safe is OFFERED by the server and I tell you it is an INVOLUNTARY OFFER from the server. I do not want this block to exist on server in the first place. It is just like people using anti griefing tools and asking a list of blocks to disable. But you keep arguing like I want it there. If predetermining and configuring what I want to put in the server is what you called dictatorship, then probably you are doing it as well. You say you host a server but you don't have rules? I am surprised.
Even a simple statement like "no griefing" IS a rule, and hence your dictatorship, by your definition.My discussion about the safe is I cannot disable it in config but not how the safe functions, because I have known how it works. I am not asking the mod author to change it at all because the author offered me the option to turn this block on and off but I cannot use it. So at this point, this block is an "illegal" block to me and my server, and the mod has a BUG. If you think that block is legal on your server, I am totally cool with it. You have your definition on what is legal and what not, and that's your dictatorship, by your definition about dictatorship. If you allow it there, I am quite sure you have your way to control that block. By control I do NOT mean DIRECT ACCESS to the safe. But I do not have to tool to handle that block, so I choose to disable it. That block would be legal to me if and only if I can access it because that is my way to control that block (without other admin mods installed).
First off, it is interesting, that both of you resort to nearly personal attacks. Which is uncalled for. Second off, why not go, where this block comes from, post a question in the GT thread and get things done, instead of argueing over the definition of "dictatorship" with me? Rules a community defined and agreed to are different to rules made solely to empower the admin for the admins pleasure. Therein lies a small, but present difference. And you could've indeed made it a tad bit clearer, that you do not wish to access the content of the block itself. But that may have as well been me failing at reading a foreign language. =) I am afraid that, unless someone posts the aforementionend "three lines of code", there is not much that can be done, as (reading the thread over at the ic² forum) it seems that it was a deliberate design decision by the modauthor of GregTech, not an oversight or bug. Which, that much we can agree, is indeed a weird choice to make. I could understand making it optional, as bigger servers tend to have several admins (and, near fact, not ALL of these can be trusted at all times - errare humanum est, after all). But forbidden altogether? Hum.. moves the whole mod into a "take it all, leave it all" position. Which is not very wise, considering the amount of unsettled dust GT generates in the first place.
Well instead of contributing to a pointless argument, I'll just offer some advice for server owners: look into the features of NEI.
open the NEI server config file and here you can add items to prevent players from having access to them. you can even set them on a per player basis.
I'm not sure how well it works because when I run a server its always for a small group (4 to 8) of personal friends so I don't ever need to use item banning features.
GLHF and enjoy your flame war.
Sent from my HTC One X+ using Tapatalk 2
open the NEI server config file and here you can add items to prevent players from having access to them. you can even set them on a per player basis.
I'm not sure how well it works because when I run a server its always for a small group (4 to 8) of personal friends so I don't ever need to use item banning features.
GLHF and enjoy your flame war.
Sent from my HTC One X+ using Tapatalk 2
First off, it is interesting, that both of you resort to nearly personal attacks. Which is uncalled for. Second off, why not go, where this block comes from, post a question in the GT thread and get things done, instead of argueing over the definition of "dictatorship" with me? Rules a community defined and agreed to are different to rules made solely to empower the admin for the admins pleasure. Therein lies a small, but present difference. And you could've indeed made it a tad bit clearer, that you do not wish to access the content of the block itself. But that may have as well been me failing at reading a foreign language. =) I am afraid that, unless someone posts the aforementionend "three lines of code", there is not much that can be done, as (reading the thread over at the ic² forum) it seems that it was a deliberate design decision by the modauthor of GregTech, not an oversight or bug. Which, that much we can agree, is indeed a weird choice to make. I could understand making it optional, as bigger servers tend to have several admins (and, near fact, not ALL of these can be trusted at all times - errare humanum est, after all). But forbidden altogether? Hum.. moves the whole mod into a "take it all, leave it all" position. Which is not very wise, considering the amount of unsettled dust GT generates in the first place.
First, it was you put this "dictatorship" on the table and I found that the definition of your "dictatorship" not appropriate, or even offensive to me, especially the "my server my rules" part. This is kind of off topic on this post but I have made my point clear for a few times.
Rules and configs must be set if the admin/host needs to run a good server, but setting rules and configs before you can build up your own community does not make the admin/host a dictator. Therefore "my server my rules" is not necessarily equal to "dictatorship", at least when the rules are open and everybody on the server knows. The "my server my rule" you imply (on me) is the kind that when the host/admin does whatever he likes to the extreme only. Hence the discussion, or you could call this a debate, to defend myself in this case.
I do agree that there is difference in "Rules a community defined and agreed to are different to rules made solely to empower the admin for the admins pleasure.", where latter can be defined as dictatorship.
What I understand is: that 3 lines of code is not there so the admins cannot access the safe. Not making the option in config fail, so the failure in config option is a bug.
Like you said, if there is option to set which admin can access the safe, that would make more sense to this block. I still think all things on the server somehow, in some way, have to be controlled by admin(s) and this is not necessarily equal to dictatorship. Direct access or not, admin may still know what you are storing inside the safe. And direct access (without TNT) is probably the easiest and fastest way to know.
Thanks, didn't know NEI config could do this. I've never looked, thought it only holds recipes.
haha you claim its interesting that we both resort to nearly personal tactics, and you are the one suggesting I take my meds. I will not dignify your post further because you all you wish to do is troll. So back under the bridge where you belong.First off, it is interesting, that both of you resort to nearly personal attacks. Which is uncalled for. Second off, why not go, where this block comes from, post a question in the GT thread and get things done, instead of argueing over the definition of "dictatorship" with me? Rules a community defined and agreed to are different to rules made solely to empower the admin for the admins pleasure. Therein lies a small, but present difference. And you could've indeed made it a tad bit clearer, that you do not wish to access the content of the block itself. But that may have as well been me failing at reading a foreign language. =) I am afraid that, unless someone posts the aforementionend "three lines of code", there is not much that can be done, as (reading the thread over at the ic² forum) it seems that it was a deliberate design decision by the modauthor of GregTech, not an oversight or bug. Which, that much we can agree, is indeed a weird choice to make. I could understand making it optional, as bigger servers tend to have several admins (and, near fact, not ALL of these can be trusted at all times - errare humanum est, after all). But forbidden altogether? Hum.. moves the whole mod into a "take it all, leave it all" position. Which is not very wise, considering the amount of unsettled dust GT generates in the first place.
TGB[DOUBLEPOST=1364552833][/DOUBLEPOST]
Thank you for the suggestion
I will look into it and if it works I will post out here for the other admins that want to use it.TGB
Here here!! I could not agree with you more Vince..I do not expect you would change your mind but obviously you did not get my point or did you even pay attention reading. You keep saying when the safe is OFFERED by the server and I tell you it is an INVOLUNTARY OFFER from the server. I do not want this block to exist on server in the first place. It is just like people using anti griefing tools and asking a list of blocks to disable. But you keep arguing like I want it there. If predetermining and configuring what I want to put in the server is what you called dictatorship, then probably you are doing it as well. You say you host a server but you don't have rules? I am surprised.
My discussion about the safe is I cannot disable it in config but not how the safe functions, because I have known how it works. I am not asking the mod author to change it at all because the author offered me the option to turn this block on and off but I cannot use it. So at this point, this block is an "illegal" block to me and my server, and the mod has a BUG. If you think that block is legal on your server, I am totally cool with it. You have your definition on what is legal and what not, and that's your dictatorship, by your definition about dictatorship. If you allow it there, I am quite sure you have your way to control that block. By control I do NOT mean DIRECT ACCESS to the safe. But I do not have to tool to handle that block, so I choose to disable it. That block would be legal to me if and only if I can access it because that is my way to control that block (without other admin mods installed).
TGB
is this not just like the enderchest, right click a diamond on an enderchest and only you can see whats in the chest and only you can pump items out.
(note, items in the chest prior to adding the diamond will show up, new items added after the diamond will not show up)
(note, items in the chest prior to adding the diamond will show up, new items added after the diamond will not show up)
I don't think that's how pumps work, and ops can still open diamond'd ender.
I love flame wars, so I'mma put a word in: I semi-admin a server, and I understand privacy. It's part of why I moved out of the USA. But I know a player who keeps books filled with secret projects and coords of his nuclear submarines in safes. I admit, I snoop, but I wish I'd never stumbled across it, because it would have been damn cool. He semi-roleplays a dictator and blows everyone up once and awhile, we form an uprising, and then after playing for a bit, rollback the server. That's just me. I'm just sayin' you should chill out a bit. I agree with Freakscar.
Unless your server is public. In that case, I'm so sorry for you.
You speak of a dictatorship, but it's really more of an autocracy. It's not a bad thing at all and I think it's absolutely vital for a server's survival. At the end of the day, you need somebody to make the final decision. Having absolute power does not necessarily imply an admin's autonomous decision-making process and it's what separates good and bad leadership.
That being said, I have found that the best decisions are made when one is properly informed of the subject at hand. Without access, there is no way to gather the necessary information and it absolutely applies to the discussed advanced safe. You need to understand that by playing on a server, you are agreeing to mutual trust with the administration and the other players. The administration needs a way to make sure you honor that trust and sometimes that comes at the cost of privacy. Then again, you never had much privacy to begin with. If you want absolute privacy then you shouldn't be playing the game in the first place and if you simply want the illusion of privacy then you are not worth anyone's time anyway.
That being said, I have found that the best decisions are made when one is properly informed of the subject at hand. Without access, there is no way to gather the necessary information and it absolutely applies to the discussed advanced safe. You need to understand that by playing on a server, you are agreeing to mutual trust with the administration and the other players. The administration needs a way to make sure you honor that trust and sometimes that comes at the cost of privacy. Then again, you never had much privacy to begin with. If you want absolute privacy then you shouldn't be playing the game in the first place and if you simply want the illusion of privacy then you are not worth anyone's time anyway.
ops can open it but they will not see the diamond hidden contents.( I am an OP on a server and me and another player tested this) so unless it changed in an update.
the arguement about an op not being able to look into the safe comes down to this. Someone steals something, they put said item into the safe. How can the op check that safe for said items. op has to blow it up to check it.
But that's fun!
Different playstyles for different servers, I guess. I personally don't mind stealing, but the victim has to get the item back himself.
I'm the kind of admin that doesn't believe in griefing. Then again, if you're a dick, you get banned. Simple. It's just a game, really.
This Safe sounds like it has good and bad traits, but its a "why not" item, if we did not have this item it would not effect the game at all but its nice just in case you are on a bad sever with bad admins and you don't want to leave(Even though you should) I would not use it just because its not creeper proof, yet it may be a item that is necessary at times. Agreed? And there is always a way to remove a item this one is just a little harder to get ride of. Instead make the crafting recipe like a iridium block or something like that.