They have ignored it by not removing it completely. I can very easily make a server lag and/or crash by adding lots of any RP machine and turning them on. The only way to do it is to rip the band-aid off quick and make them rebuild their bases. There are other mods that add pretty much the exact same items to the game.
Xycraft Multitanks and Lag.
- Thread starter Torigoma
- Start date
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That's really what it comes down to. They know what the problems really are, they're not stupid. Everything they've demonstrated - and the fact that lag has indeed gone away in all the episodes that went live today - shows that they know and that it's mostly solved. They're just trying to save face. It's really unfortunate that this is going to result in a lot of the less informed Mindcrackers jumping to conclusions that are wrong. In Bdub's latest video he even says that he's going to avoid ALL XYCraft stuff from now on. Sigh.
I don't think that's really an option for them as some members use it extensively. If RP2 was removed, the likes of Vintagebeef may as well stop playing FTB completely
I am curious to see if the lag returns when VB gets on while another mindcracker is recording.
Right now I believe the lag fix to be like bubblegum stopping a leaking dam. Sooner or later its gonna start leaking again.
Yeah I forgot that pyro has a lagmachinemobspawnerdeluxe. It's funny that I have one almost the same and I solved the tick lag from it by collecting all of the XP in an XPturtle and not letting the xp sit and collect anywhere. From what I have seen pyro has nothing collecting the XP except himself.
Honestly, even if multitanks are proven to create large amounts of lag... I can't afford to stop using them. I very much enjoy the way they work.
They're even more powerful in 1.5.1, it seems. So yeah.
The goal is to have a fun game with intricate builds, not a fast game.
There's a problem with the word "lag", which makes me avoid using it entirely - it's used to describe a wide variety of unrelated phenomena. Generik's frame rate dropped noticeably while he was at spawn, but that has entirely to do with client side performance, and nothing at all on the server. The problem they're trying to address is server performance. He was able to break blocks just fine at spawn without the server sending him back in time, which means the server was performing well.
The reason blocks sometimes reappear for a moment after being broken is something like this: The server attempts to tick 20 times per second. If simulating one tick takes longer than 1/20th of a second in real time, the server is unable to keep up with the speed the client assumes it's running at (and in fact, the Minecraft server spits a message out to the log when this happens; something like "Can't keep up! Did the system time change, or is the server overloaded?"). The client thinks the player spent x ticks mining the block, while the server has in fact only run for y ticks, where y < x. Client says "I broke this block", server comes back and says "no you didn't, you've only been mining for y ticks" and tells the client to put it back. Once the server catches up, it says "OK, you've been mining for x ticks, this block is now broken", and the client removes it again.
If your frame rate drops, it's due to the client running too many computations or rendering too much geometry at once. This is why I'm suspicious when people point to things like microblocks as a potential source of the problem they're seeing, or at least I was until CovertJaguar's post explaining that they're implemented as tile entities, which adds CPU load to the server per tick for each one. If not for that, they'd just be an extra load on the client side GPU for rendering, and have zero effect on server performance.
And honestly, I play primarily on single player. If this is proven to be some server-breaking mechanic, then I simply will knuckle down and use RC tanks on a server. I think the way my build works will be a bit off (can you have two RC tanks share a wall and contents?), but I think I'd be able to manage.
Until then, I'll keep using them.
And in what way did they possibly get more powerful? Was the amount of liquid they hold scaled up or something?
Dunno. Depends on if the world-regen works with Underground Biomes. I think everyone agrees we love Underground Biomes and would hate to lose it. It adds so much–what's the word?–texture! Texture to the world of minecraft. One of my biggest goals with RR was to make sure the worldgen was exciting and fresh and made you go, "Wow, this is different." This is a general sentiment in the modding community as well, and it's a message well-received by the playerbase that is going nuts over Natura's Nether and re-welcoming Biomes O Plenty into the fold.
I adore it. I have never felt so attached to cobblestone :3
perhaps a test to see if generating a world with UB and Xy works out, then we could just make a mining age with mystcraft for people to get their xystuff
Here on the Mindcrack server, correlation does imply causation
The video image reminds me of when I saw Nebris building his cobble generation for scrap. I about yelled at the screen. The only thing he was building was a lag machine.[DOUBLEPOST=1368677826][/DOUBLEPOST]
Sometimes a slow game gets in the way of fun though.
Etho in his latest video didn't directly blame Xycraft. He said that they turned off chunkloaders and it didn't resolve the problem. Then he talked about how portals and other items that keep chunks loaded and if something like an MFSU is in that chunk, and it's connected to something else in another chunk, it will load that chunk too and cause a chain reaction. Then he said there was a Xycraft tank that was exhibiting the same behavior as the MFSU. I'm not sure how much of what he said was accurate, but he seemed to be downplaying Xycraft being the sole cause. Guude's tweet told a totally different story, of course, but I think they found what was causing the server lag.
I'm willing to bet £20 that if they removed :
- RP timers
- RP relays
- RP rs tubes
- in fact anything related to RP item transport
that 90% of their lag issues would be gone instantly. Imho the so-called fix was solely the result of removing all the chunk loaders. I reckon that if they replaced all the multi-tanks as the server stands now (ie. sans chunk loaders) there would be no noticeable increase in lag. Let's see Guude get ALL the mindcrackers onto the server at the same time and all stood in their respective bases, then we'll see just how "smooth" the server runs. My bet is that the tick will be sky high and they'll struggle to play. I hope you like humble pie and have a cloth ready to wipe all that egg off your face Guude when the truth comes out.
- RP timers
- RP relays
- RP rs tubes
- in fact anything related to RP item transport
that 90% of their lag issues would be gone instantly. Imho the so-called fix was solely the result of removing all the chunk loaders. I reckon that if they replaced all the multi-tanks as the server stands now (ie. sans chunk loaders) there would be no noticeable increase in lag. Let's see Guude get ALL the mindcrackers onto the server at the same time and all stood in their respective bases, then we'll see just how "smooth" the server runs. My bet is that the tick will be sky high and they'll struggle to play. I hope you like humble pie and have a cloth ready to wipe all that egg off your face Guude when the truth comes out.
We need to ignore Guudes tweet. He's a human being that has has the misfortune of admining a FTB server. This is not a fun thing to do and after a while will grate on your god damn nerves soul especially considering the server is an LP server and needs to preform well. He really outta hand off server debugging to more people (as he's started to do now) to take the pressure off himself.
90% of the issue IMO is the chunk loading/unloading that was happening and is still happening to a lesser degree. RP and overkill setups and apparently three chickens flapping in water are the last 10%. Its possible the wireless redstone is doing something to load and unload chunks as well. The limitations of Minecraft itself are really showing though, and until Minecraft is designed FOR MODDING these sort of issues will rear their ugly head over and over. The game needs hardest ceilings that mods have to follow so this crap doesn't happen. You cant expect people like Nebris to know this stuff is going to cause issues, we are all just here to make cool stuff and have fun.[DOUBLEPOST=1368681806][/DOUBLEPOST]
90% of the issue IMO is the chunk loading/unloading that was happening and is still happening to a lesser degree. RP and overkill setups and apparently three chickens flapping in water are the last 10%. Its possible the wireless redstone is doing something to load and unload chunks as well. The limitations of Minecraft itself are really showing though, and until Minecraft is designed FOR MODDING these sort of issues will rear their ugly head over and over. The game needs hardest ceilings that mods have to follow so this crap doesn't happen. You cant expect people like Nebris to know this stuff is going to cause issues, we are all just here to make cool stuff and have fun.[DOUBLEPOST=1368681806][/DOUBLEPOST]
If you watched the video, GB explained that 90% of their lag issues was due to unloading and loading chunks. Keep up.I'm willing to bet £20 that if they removed :
- RP timers
- RP relays
- RP rs tubes
- in fact anything related to RP item transport
that 90% of their lag issues would be gone instantly. Imho the so-called fix was solely the result of removing all the chunk loaders. I reckon that if they replaced all the multi-tanks as the server stands now (ie. sans chunk loaders) there would be no noticeable increase in lag. Let's see Guude get ALL the mindcrackers onto the server at the same time and all stood in their respective bases, then we'll see just how "smooth" the server runs. My bet is that the tick will be sky high and they'll struggle to play. I hope you like humble pie and have a cloth ready to wipe all that egg off your face Guude when the truth comes out.
I'm willing to bet £20 that if they removed :
- RP timers
- RP relays
- RP rs tubes
- in fact anything related to RP item transport
that 90% of their lag issues would be gone instantly. Imho the so-called fix was solely the result of removing all the chunk loaders. I reckon that if they replaced all the multi-tanks as the server stands now (ie. sans chunk loaders) there would be no noticeable increase in lag. Let's see Guude get ALL the mindcrackers onto the server at the same time and all stood in their respective bases, then we'll see just how "smooth" the server runs. My bet is that the tick will be sky high and they'll struggle to play. I hope you like humble pie and have a cloth ready to wipe all that egg off your face Guude when the truth comes out.
The lag didn't go away when they disabled chunkloaders. Etho said machines, including the Xycraft tanks were leaving residual chunks loaded. When they found the last Xycraft tank and got rid of it, the lag was gone. Is it solely Xycraft tanks? No, of course not. But anything that causes a cascade of chunks to load. From what they have seen, it seems that Xycraft tanks do this as well. Personally I don't know if that's accurate, but Etho explains everything they did in his most recent FTB video.
I think the problem the Mindcrackers are having is they see chunks load/unload and a log message about xy tanks. So, naturally they think xy tank = thing causing problems with chunk loading. This doesn't seem too ridiculous, really. However, what's actually happening is stuff causing chunk loading problems, leading to log messages about xy tanks being loaded/unloaded. Guude is correct that there's a connection between the xy tank log entries and the lag, he just got the causal relationship backwards.
I really don't understand why Xycraft would 'cause' chunkloading. This decision should be up to the player, not the modmakes.
That explains.