Why don't people like IC2 anymore?

[YX33A]

Exploding machines! Oh, wait...

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Railcraft Boilers and BC Combustion Engines are great makeshift bombs if you know how to use them correctly. Also, a couple UE mods have machines that explode if given too much power(does anyone else here care about UE mods?), so... No, even the Exploding Machines has been done better in other mods.

No, wait, did that post say useful?

Uh... UUM? No, sorry, UE Atomic Science has offered a weird and somewhat stupid way to duplicate things that is roughly as hard to do as using UUM. Nerf Obsidian? Hm, no, that wasn't really "useful" so much as "needed to make one of the blocks added by our mod not useless". Nerf water?(blast resistance, namely) I think the last point stands here as well.

Blast Resistance Glass? Nope, not unique.
But then again...

It's a trick question. IC2-EX is too new to have any new content. Nothing it has is unique anymore. I do hope that this changes. Most of it, when it was first added to IC2, was unique and useful. Not the Brewing system, though. It was Unique, but useless.

 

[PierceSG]

I'm not exactly looking for uniqueness in it now but rather, a point to use it besides liking it (for those that likes it) enough to want to use it.
Last time, I bear with IC2 because of the Induction Furnace. Now I have Mekanism's Elite Factory - Smelting with 7 slots for processing, x9 speed and energy efficiency upgrade for that. Macerator with overclockers? Elite Factories again.

Power storage? A lot of other mods does it better. And almost (if not all) allows moving the storage itself and keeping the power in it.

Item transportation? None in IC2.

Facade/Microblocks/Aesthetic stuffs? I know IC2 has CFoam but in my own opinion, other mods has it beat.
I prefer BC's facades over IC2's CFoam for couple of reasons. The facade is removable without breaking the pipe itself. Pipe plug can be used together with facades to create nice looking walls that doesn't connect to other inventories/machines if pipe plug is installed.
TE3 supports FMP now. Which is also removable without breaking the cables, can be used to separate the cables from connecting to parallel cables.
Ender IO's painter does a superb job, in fact I would want to argue it does cable hiding the best out of all the competitors since you can access the cables without removing the facade.
Now, if CFoam can be removed without breaking the cables, please do correct me.

Nanosuit, nice suit be to frank. I will not compare it to MPS because MPS is a mod dedicated to power suits and weaponry so in my opinion would be unfair against IC2 since IC2 isn't just about the Nano suit and Nano sword. When comparing it to it's "competitors", I would say it has no equal.

Nano sword. Was nice but I always dislike the fact you can't block with it, might have changed to a key toggle and allows you to block with it now. Drains power when you turn it on, regardless if you are using it or not. I do not like that. Nearest competition would be the recent addition from TE3 in the form of Redstone Arsenal's Flux Sword. Great weapon where you can use it like a regular iron sword (or slightly better?) or you can activate Flux mode and deals more damage at the cost of higher power requirement. It is also able to accept enchantment which is a great. Sharpness IV + Flux mode is awesome.

Jetpack. Mekanism has it too and both work pretty similar.

Mining Laser. Has no equal and I can say I have pretty good experience with it and say it is a nifty tool. Just don't try to change setting while in base.

Drill/Chainsaw. I would not compare TiCo with it, again on the basis that TiCo specializes in tools and that would be unfair against IC2. So I would say that it is unique for IC2 as a mod by itself. Redstone Arsenal does provide pickaxe and axe but from my own experience, they do not fair as well as the IC2's counterparts. I might be using them wrong, so do correct me.

Lastly, IC2 Crops. Or rather, cropsticks. I like those little buggers a lot. I didn't play with crossbreeding much but I do like how compact it allows my farm to be when I had IC2 installed. Sugarcane not requiring to be beside water. Wheat not replanting. Netherwarts on dirt! Melons and Pumpkins in 1x1x1 area! So you can fill the entire 9x9 farm with all Melons and Pumpkins for maximum efficient use of land! They would with MFR's Harvester too! I do wish IC2 team would develop IC2 Crops as an optional addon and not requiring IC2 dependency.

 

[Badger]

@PierceSG -
Sorry, but Rotarycraft has all those examples beat. except nano armor, but dartcraft one ups that nicely.

I will agree with you. If I could disable every single item in IC2 except cropsticks and scaffolding, I would. Not even the complicated stuff, just the simple wooden scaffold and more crossbreeding. with a few new items, actual 'rewards' for going through the complicated crossbreeding process. Maybe better bowstrings from genegineered flax, or grain that causes Cows to have twins. Maybe a flower that allows you to lead off villagers, or breed them. Perhaps something completely new, like a circuit breaker or elevator.

making things 'completely new' for IC2 would be tough, but it is called 'industrial craft'. Try to get more industry into it. Maybe a vehicle of some sort like glacticraft's moon rover. How about a simple deployer?

This may seem stupid, but IC2's strength has always been Redpower... get over it guys, redpower is gone, and it took the best parts of IC2 with it.. IC2 needs to either lead, follow, or get the hell out of the way.

 

[YX33A]

~Mining Laser. Has no equal and I can say I have pretty good experience with it and say it is a nifty tool. Just don't try to change setting while in base.
~

Wand Cap of Excavation? OK, fine, doesn't double as a shotgun, actual rifle, and a rocket launcher, but so? All of those are covered by other mods(again, better).

That being said, I DON'T have good experience with the mining laser. I've ruined too many houses to count with them. Also they are all kinds of Wonky for shooting through things.

@PierceSG -
Sorry, but Rotarycraft has all those examples beat. except nano armor, but dartcraft one ups that nicely.

I will agree with you. If I could disable every single item in IC2 except cropsticks and scaffolding, ~

Miss your Scaffolds? Same here. MFR has some, but since it's only unofficial ports ATM(IIRC), you may want to get Artifice for that ol' Scaffold Itch.

 

[RavynousHunter]

I will say this, I love the IC2 crops and their interoperability with MFR. Also, how is RedPower the strength of IC2? I've seen that said more than once, and I never get it. Not being an arse here, I'm legitimately curious and legitimately don't understand.

If a mod that isn't an add-on can't stand on its own, then its a bad mod. TE can stand on its own. Hell, some minor IC2 requirements aside, even GregTech stands on its own. If IC2 can't stand on its own, then something needs to be done about that. A base mod, unless its a library around which other mods are build, like Universal Electricity, that can't be reasonably and enjoyable played on its own needs a rethink on a pretty large scale. Simply because someone can play your mod alongside others, doesn't mean they will; you know what they say about assumptions.

 

[PierceSG]

Oh I know other mods has ic2 beaten in different categories but I'm mentioning it as a package deal as well as no cross mods interactions.
RotaryCraft really looks like the closest competitor to ic2 in terms of a package deal.

 

[Dorque]

Wand Cap of Excavation? OK, fine, doesn't double as a shotgun, actual rifle, and a rocket launcher, but so? All of those are covered by other mods(again, better).

That being said, I DON'T have good experience with the mining laser. I've ruined too many houses to count with them. Also they are all kinds of Wonky for shooting through things.

They have their issues, but I still find the laser is unmatched at certain tasks; rapidly flattening an area by hand, picking off very distant blocks, shotgunning the remains of redwood leaves =P Ghast sniping too, often enough.

It's limited in a lot of ways, but I have yet to see its versatility matched, and if you want to remove a bunch of blocks very quickly, long-range laser fire is still the stuff to give the troops. Drill a hole through the bottom two layers of a mountain with horizontal, switch to long range, point straight up and watch the magic happen.

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[matpower123]

Wand Cap of Excavation? OK, fine, doesn't double as a shotgun, actual rifle, and a rocket launcher, but so? All of those are covered by other mods(again, better).

That being said, I DON'T have good experience with the mining laser. I've ruined too many houses to count with them. Also they are all kinds of Wonky for shooting through things.

Miss your Scaffolds? Same here. MFR has some, but since it's only unofficial ports ATM(IIRC), you may want to get Artifice for that ol' Scaffold Itch.

Actually, Skyboy's fork got "permission" from Powercrystals, it is the real deal.

 

[SlightlyVisible]

I will say this, I love the IC2 crops and their interoperability with MFR. Also, how is RedPower the strength of IC2? I've seen that said more than once, and I never get it. Not being an arse here, I'm legitimately curious and legitimately don't understand.

If a mod that isn't an add-on can't stand on its own, then its a bad mod. TE can stand on its own. Hell, some minor IC2 requirements aside, even GregTech stands on its own. If IC2 can't stand on its own, then something needs to be done about that. A base mod, unless its a library around which other mods are build, like Universal Electricity, that can't be reasonably and enjoyable played on its own needs a rethink on a pretty large scale. Simply because someone can play your mod alongside others, doesn't mean they will; you know what they say about assumptions.

I would argue TE3 has just as much problem standing on its own. Yes it adds automation, but outside the simplification of tasks, and flobs, what does it do that adds to the gameplay in minecraft. For me TE must be used with other mods for there being any sense in having it in the first place.

Even build-craft suffers from this problems. Luckily for it, railcraft and forestry, extra bees, and magic bees provide it content

 

[Zenthon_127]

I would argue TE3 has just as much problem standing on its own. Yes it adds automation, but outside the simplification of tasks, and flobs, what does it do that adds to the gameplay in minecraft. For me TE must be used with other mods for there being any sense in having it in the first place.

Even build-craft suffers from this problems. Luckily for it, railcraft and forestry, extra bees, and magic bees provide it content

I'll just go out and say it: no tech mod is good on its own. Magic mods can be, but I've never seen a tech mod that's good by itself.

 

[KingTriaxx]

TE3 stands alone by being added to a world and expanding the available resources. If I plug just TE3 into the world, I do need to find a few new resources, but at the same time, I can take the ones available already and increase my supply. I can bring down one 4 high tree and get 24 planks instead of 16, and still come up with sawdust to make charcoal out of, to fuel the process to make more planks and charcoal. Yes, I have to do the crafting into compressed sawdust for making charcoal by hand, but it's a simple process. I can double my iron and gold ore, and since I've only got to make a few machines, the rest can be used for building with, which is one half of the game. It also gives me improved access to certain resources I would have a hard time getting. I can make smooth right away, without needing to first make a cobble gen, then cooking it. Yes, it costs water, but again, TE3 provides with Fluiducts, and the Aqueous Accumulator. Now I have infinite smooth stone, without having to deal with chewing up cobble, and then smelting it. I can concentrate on building. Or I can make Obsidian, as long as I keep feeding lava into the system, which is slightly annoying, but that's fine, it's still less annoying than manually mining each individual piece.

In short, TE3 increases my resources, without causing an increased drain on them.

 

[Dorque]

In short, TE3 increases my resources, without causing an increased drain on them.

I actually feel that TE adds relatively little when it comes to resource processing, on a standalone basis; that sort of addition is minor at best, TBH. What TE really brings to the standalone game, in my opinion, is transport options.

 

[Azzanine]

The bulk of IC2 is designed to be a means to an end the most fun thing it brought to the table was the jetpack. The rest where considered as tools to make things easier.
When they strayed from that it no longer served it original purpose. I like IC2 but I never had fun with it.
I feel the same with TE3 which has supplanted IC2 purely becasue TE3 is easier and serves my purposes better. But I have never had fun with TE3.

 

[Loufmier]

The punishment is that you are getting less value for your time, i.e. your ores. That, for some people, me included, leads to the described bad feeling. As I said, the game is not forcing you to double ores, but it is rewarding that behavior with increased efficiency. Which is, in my opinion, the wrong incentive to give.

ore processing is a mechanic that rewards certain behavior, however it doesn't tax you if don't follow the rewarding path. i just can't see the punishment here. it like: you can eat a cookie and feel better or you can not do that and feel the same.

when it's come to explosive machinery, we can see the actual punitive behavior of IC2. you either wire it right or machine goes boom.
the analogy here is following: you can eat a cookie that has an antidote and feel better or you can not do that and die.

 

[Cronos988]

ore processing is a mechanic that rewards certain behavior, however it doesn't tax you if don't follow the rewarding path. i just can't see the punishment here. it like: you can eat a cookie and feel better or you can not do that and feel the same.

Of course, but that is beside the point. I use punishment as the opposite category of "reward" here. If you say it "rewards" certain behavior, that is exactly what I meant when I stated it "punishes" other behavior.

To get it out of the way: Minecraft is a game, games are a useless waste of time, and there is no reward nor punishment in playing any game in any specific way, as long as you are having fun. That is true, but also ends every possible discussion about game mechanics. In the context of minecraft survival, we have a structured game experience (as opposed to creative minecraft, which is unstructured). As such it has certain incentives - rewards - for certain behaviors. Balancing these incentives properly is what determines the structure of the experience.

Incidentially, that is what I think balance should mean in a singleplayer game: Structuring the experience so that nothing you do appears useless of ineffective compared to other solutions for the same problem.

 

[Loufmier]

Of course, but that is beside the point. I use punishment as the opposite category of "reward" here. If you say it "rewards" certain behavior, that is exactly what I meant when I stated it "punishes" other behavior.

To get it out of the way: Minecraft is a game, games are a useless waste of time, and there is no reward nor punishment in playing any game in any specific way, as long as you are having fun. That is true, but also ends every possible discussion about game mechanics. In the context of minecraft survival, we have a structured game experience (as opposed to creative minecraft, which is unstructured). As such it has certain incentives - rewards - for certain behaviors. Balancing these incentives properly is what determines the structure of the experience.

Incidentially, that is what I think balance should mean in a singleplayer game: Structuring the experience so that nothing you do appears useless of ineffective compared to other solutions for the same problem.

well i don't think a single tech mod can provide what you want, don't get me wrong it'd be good to have what you want, it just you kinda want too much from 1 mod.if we look at IC2 as a corridor shooter(which it kinda is) however you want it to become a RPG.

it's possible to achieve what you want with different mods i.e. modpack.

 

[Cronos988]

well i don't think a single tech mod can provide what you want, don't get me wrong it'd be good to have what you want, it just you kinda want too much from 1 mod.if we look at IC2 as a corridor shooter(which it kinda is) however you want it to become a RPG.

it's possible to achieve what you want with different mods i.e. modpack.

Well, I agree that what I said is not related to IC2 specifically. It's more a general statement about the resource-doubling mechanics of mods and, by extension, modpacks. It's not really that I want IC2 to give me a certain experience. It's more that I think that the mechanics IC2 (or any other mod) introduces should not lead to wrong incentives, i.e. hoarding of materials until you can afford ore doubling/tripling/etc.

 

[Protocurity]

I have not played with IC2e. The last interaction I had with IC2 was in 1.4.7 FTB, particularly with gretech machines involved. I loved most of the mod. I remember my sis was always baffled when she would wake up one day to find that I had come up with some convoluted methane or nitrodiesel powered system she had never heard before, and I was always glad when I thought of something. It was actually hard to do, since we lived in an underwater multi-dome structure made entirely out of warded glass and warded stone, so "expanding" wasn't something to be taken lightly.

But otherwise, I liked how things worked. I liked that I had to adjust energy output and voltages through wires to make systems work. I like how, without the addition of other mods or high end gear, transporting power could become expensive, so I had to do things like invest power into making methane or nitro for power to be truly portable. I liked having a big tech room, which had a bunch of machines that had specialized functions that did different things.

What I didn't like about it was the punishment for failure. The first time I accidentally blew up my entire arsenal of machines due to a wiring mistake, I nearly cried. That is one of the big things keeping me away from IC2e: the whole thing isn't refined yet, so strange bugs in the power system causes your machines to detonate. This, IMO, is one of the worst things you can have happen in any tech mod. It isn't hard, just punishing.

So now I use Mekkanism and Rotarycraft for most of my tech needs, with TE3 making appearances here and there.

 

[zorn]

Who is the IC guy that is all about the word HAYO and what does it mean?

This is kind of funny, this is just a guess. But i saw your comment here yesterday and today on reddit I see a post about a famous anime director.

His name is Hayao Miyazaki and his company is called Studio Ghibli. "Hayo". "Gibbl"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Studio_Ghibli

Its a stretch and Im probably just spending too much time on minecraft and have it on the brain, but this kind of stood out to me.

 

[Mevansuto]

does anyone else here care about UE mods?

I was gonna like and then I saw this.
This is a real shame that it's such a common attitude, I personally blame the FTB team for not including any but MFFS (which a lot of people still assume is an IC2 addon).

I would argue TE3 has just as much problem standing on its own. Yes it adds automation, but outside the simplification of tasks, and flobs, what does it do that adds to the gameplay in minecraft. For me TE must be used with other mods for there being any sense in having it in the first place.

Even build-craft suffers from this problems. Luckily for it, railcraft and forestry, extra bees, and magic bees provide it content

TE can stand alone well. FTB only has 3 major mods in (MFR, XU and TE) this really highlights TE.