Solid Boilers after 1.5.1. Wood source?

[Enigmius1]

The message I responded too has no mention of preheating. Here, let me quote you to yourself:

I don't care what one message said or did not say, because I've explained in several messages what I've been doing. This is why you don't just jump into a thread flailing your dork bat; you often end up looking like an moran. So chill or stop responding.

One cart growing vanilla oak trees, using track laid down to take up roughly an entire chunk, in 1.4.7, can easily support two solid fuel boilers and a number of liquid fueled besides, with an excess left over of wood. I know from experience. Many other people have similar experiences

My cart can't even keep my tree farm clear of trees. I don't have a shortage of trees. If anything, my track is too long and the delay the extra length creates is translating to the boilers. It doesn't matter. I'm not interested in sitting down and doing all the nerd math. It's not that important to me. I've got enough steam to do what needs doing now and I've got plans to generate more when I need more, but to call SC logging carts overpowered and need of a Galgadorian-style nerf is lunacy.

 

[KirinDave]

My cart can't even keep my tree farm clear of trees. I don't have a shortage of trees. If anything, my track is too long and the delay the extra length creates is translating to the boilers. It doesn't matter. I'm not interested in sitting down and doing all the nerd math. It's not that important to me. I've got enough steam to do what needs doing now and I've got plans to generate more when I need more, but to call SC logging carts overpowered and need of a Galgadorian-style nerf is lunacy.

Having personally run 7 boilers from one less-than-a-chunk treecart setup, I suspect you're doing something quite wrong here. I am not sure exactly what without inspecting your build, but I assure you that you can run multiple boilers from even a modest size treefarm if you set it up correctly. At least one solid fuel boiler should be possible. I can run 2 through the magic of sawmills. I've seen multiple carts on a 4-chunk sized farm (hi Poppycocks!) that ran a half-dozen with no stalling and fuel excess.

 

[immibis]

CHANGE: Doubled base Boiler fuel usage (3.2 -> 6.4), increased efficiency bonus per tank to 0.08, doubled liquid fuel values. Basically a nerf to solid fuel.

That was 4 months ago.

 

[DoctorOr]

I don't care what one message said or did not say, because I've explained in several messages what I've been doing. This is why you don't just jump into a thread flailing your dork bat; you often end up looking like an moran. So chill or stop responding.

Yeah the guy so massively disconnected from reality he's trying to claim that a steve's cart farm can't supply two solid fueled boilers is trying to claim I'm looking like the moron.

You are the error in whatever problem you're having.

 

[Enigmius1]

Having personally run 7 boilers from one less-than-a-chunk treecart setup, I suspect you're doing something quite wrong here. I am not sure exactly what without inspecting your build, but I assure you that you can run multiple boilers from even a modest size treefarm if you set it up correctly. At least one solid fuel boiler should be possible. I can run 2 through the magic of sawmills. I've seen multiple carts on a 4-chunk sized farm (hi Poppycocks!) that ran a half-dozen with no stalling and fuel excess.

I'm kind of getting to the point where people are responding to snippets of the situation because they've been drawn out over multiple posts in response to such accusations as "blatant fabrication" and the like, and it's starting to feel tiresome. I just hate repeating myself on forums and lack the pent up sexual aggression to continue doing so anyways simply out of spite. SC carts aren't as OP as some would obviously seem to think they are, and that's the bottom line for me. 1 boiler, 10 boilers, the boil on mom's ass...I don't care. Galgadorian components are expensive, and in no way justified by what SC loggers are doing now.[DOUBLEPOST=1366941066][/DOUBLEPOST]

Yeah the guy so massively disconnected from reality he's trying to claim that a steve's cart farm can't supply two solid fueled boilers is trying to claim I'm looking like the moron.

You are the error in whatever problem you're having.

I never said I was having a problem. I said I don't think SC loggers are OP. I've asked you to stop responding if you don't know how to behave and now I'm telling you. Knock it off.

 

[Hoff]

Oh goodie. I haven't seen a popcorn worthy thread in awhile.

I'll just be right back with my popcorn.

 

[DoctorOr]

I never said I was having a problem. I said I don't think SC loggers are OP.

If you're only getting one boiler from a SC farm, you're having a problem.

I've asked you to stop responding if you don't know how to behave and now I'm telling you. Knock it off.

I'll respond to correct blatant falsehoods, no matter how much you want me to stop.

 

[Mash]

Question: Is he like, a secret moderator or something?

Or does he just like to act like one?

 

[Hoff]

Question: Is he like, a secret moderator or something?

Or does he just like to act like one?

It's called mini-modding or backseat modding.

Anyway I'm back with my popcorn. Carry on people o/

 

[DoctorOr]

Question: Is he like, a secret moderator or something?

Double Oh Enig, secret moderator with a license to kill from her Majesty.

 

[EternalDensity]

 

[PonyKuu]

What happened to this thread?

Also, Enigmus. How you should start a new boiler:

1) Wait until you have ~9K wood
2) Start supplying it to a boiler.

Or, you can use other fuel to heat it up. If you don't have a big supply of fuel already - don't start it. It won't work on "excess fuel", it needs TONS of it during heatup - about 12 planks/second at the very beginning, taking away fuel supply that can be used with the first boiler and first one started to cool down and consume more fuel. It's just a chain reaction.
So, first - stock a lot of wood, and second - heat up a boiler. One boiler, not two.

 

[Lawbroken]

Enough is enough,
Please get back onto topic without being mad/angry/annoyied at one another.

 

[Dravarden]

disgonbgud.gif

anyway, if the nerf happens ill just cheat it in, as simple as that, forestry farms are ugly and don't make sense, sorry sengir, but multifarms were a mistake in my opinion.

 

[Enigmius1]

What happened to this thread?

Also, Enigmus. How you should start a new boiler:

1) Wait until you have ~9K wood
2) Start supplying it to a boiler.

Or, you can use other fuel to heat it up. If you don't have a big supply of fuel already - don't start it. It won't work on "excess fuel", it needs TONS of it during heatup - about 12 planks/second at the very beginning, taking away fuel supply that can be used with the first boiler and first one started to cool down and consume more fuel. It's just a chain reaction.
So, first - stock a lot of wood, and second - heat up a boiler. One boiler, not two.

I'm familiar with how to heat up a boiler. As I mentioned, I did have one boiler at 1k degrees. What was most likely at issue was the length of track I had. The cart simply couldn't keep up and took too long to make deliveries.

The point is that one SC logger isn't so powerful that it needs a dramatic increase in cost in order to retain its current performance. I just finished setting up a preliminary MFR tree farm setup. Extremely inexpensive for the machines compared to SC, but much more costly in terms of plumbing. Once it's set up, however, and properly tuned, it will produce more material per allotted space and will do so faster and with more consistent delivery than SC. So what mod developers might want to stop and consider is that if they swing the nerf bat too hard and too often, people will just stop using their mod. There's always an alternative. In addition to the increased cost of the logger tool, it looks like most tools are getting a durability component. Because what modpacks need these days is more micromanagement.

Edit for giggles:

For those curious about the cost of components for the Galgadorian Wood Cutter that will allow you to operate an SC logging cart at current efficiency (and no durability loss) it works out to roughly:

30 obsidian
21 diamonds
18 magma cream
15 iron ingots
15 fermented spider eyes
15 ghast tears
9 eyes of ender
9 glowstone

That doesn't count the materials for the woodcutting core or stabilized metal.

 

[Dravarden]

what i don't get if the old one is now slower and the new one faster or the new one just replaces the old one?

 

[PonyKuu]

Old one is much worse, and it loses a lot of wood as it harvests it. To get the same amount of wood you need a cart with a reinforced hull and galgadorian wood cutter. There are also other tier of cutter between galgadorian and old one.[DOUBLEPOST=1366967427][/DOUBLEPOST]Here is the link:
http://stevescarts2.wikispaces.com/Basic Wood Cutter

You also need to repair every cutter except galgadorian eventually. Oh, and please look at the construction time for those tools

 

[whythisname]

I'm familiar with how to heat up a boiler. As I mentioned, I did have one boiler at 1k degrees. What was most likely at issue was the length of track I had. The cart simply couldn't keep up and took too long to make deliveries.

Let's say your cart delivers 10 stacks of wood every 10 minutes, if you don't give the 1st boiler what it needs to run for 10 minutes it will run out of fuel and lose heat. The only surplus you can send to the 2nd boiler is what you have left after giving the first boiler what it needs to run for (at least) 10 minutes.
I don't know your setup and I'm sorry if you did that and it isn't working, but I'm suspecting you didn't do that because the first boiler should stay at 1K if you give it all the fuel it needs. And considering you say you think you can run that first boiler if it wasn't for the 2nd boiler I think you're sending wood to the 2nd boiler that the first boiler needs. Just put a chest or a few next to the first boiler (you can't have too many chests, so go crazy if you want) and only send surplus to the 2nd boiler after those are full. Boilers can pull fuel out of adjacent chests/inventories, so use that mechanic to do this.

I'm not trying to argue here, I'm trying to help you find out why your first boiler isn't staying at 1K if it should.

The point is that one SC logger isn't so powerful that it needs a dramatic increase in cost in order to retain its current performance. I just finished setting up a preliminary MFR tree farm setup. Extremely inexpensive for the machines compared to SC, but much more costly in terms of plumbing.

Last time I checked cobble/smoothstone + glass isn't expensive in any amount Unless you use gold tubing (and don't have a gold farm of some kind) I really don't see how the plumbing has any significant cost, ever.

That said, I really like the cost/reward ratio on the MFR farm and unlike Forestry's farms I can actually wrap my head around the stuff I need to get to make it and automate it. It's not really the cost that's the issue for me, it's the whole 20 layers of crafting that just makes my brain explode and not see what I need to actually get it working the way I want it to.

Edit for giggles:

For those curious about the cost of components for the Galgadorian Wood Cutter that will allow you to operate an SC logging cart at current efficiency (and no durability loss) it works out to roughly:

30 obsidian
21 diamonds
18 magma cream
15 iron ingots
15 fermented spider eyes
15 ghast tears
9 eyes of ender
9 glowstone

That doesn't count the materials for the woodcutting core or stabilized metal.

Ahahaha, yeah I'm not making that. Just like I will never make anything beyond a Basic Drill for a mining cart because I feel anything beyond that is just a waste of resources. The Advanced Drill might be worth the cost by a hair, but the Galgadorian is so expensive it is way cheaper to make 2-3 more mining carts with Basic/Advanced Drills.
And that is only if you're set on mining with mining carts, if you look at other options the SC mining carts just look weak and way too maintenance intensive. And even if they weren't maintenance intensive they still lose speed and efficiency every block they get further away from the "station" where they need to drop off whatever they mine.

 

[Hoff]

Edit for giggles:

For those curious about the cost of components for the Galgadorian Wood Cutter that will allow you to operate an SC logging cart at current efficiency (and no durability loss) it works out to roughly:

30 obsidian
21 diamonds
18 magma cream
15 iron ingots
15 fermented spider eyes
15 ghast tears
9 eyes of ender
9 glowstone

That doesn't count the materials for the woodcutting core or stabilized metal.

lolololol That's dirt cheap. Compared to a galga drill that's a joke.

Though I do agree Vswe should add in some configs for these things as he generally balances his stuff based on SMP because that's where he gets a lot of his hands on feedback. If you watch Eddie Ruckus on twitch you'd see just how insanely powerful a galga drill can be when it runs 24/7. Same with the current tree cart. They're by no means weak but they're certainly not the most efficient. I could set up 20 turtles Mining 5x4x300 and of course they'd be faster and get more stuff and could use ender chests but c'mon; how awesome is it to see a cart mining for you?

Also @^ He will likely be adding the same tool damaging effect to the drills as well.

 

[DoctorOr]

That doesn't count the materials for the woodcutting core or stabilized metal.

Curious, why have an item list when you leave out the actual expensive parts?

The actual cost is 47 diamonds, 18 ghast tears, and a bunch of dirt.

How a claim of 21 diamonds doesn't get blocked by a "this is absurd" filter I can't imagine. Every two galgadorian metal, of which five are required regardless of which recipe you choose, is 9 diamonds. That's 27 diamonds right there.

Every galgadorian metal requires a stabliized metal and those cost an additional 10 diamonds per 5, and because you need to make galgadorian in groups of two, you need to run the recipe twice

There is of course some simple increase in cost due to recipes not making even multiples of whats required. This means when you rebuild the cart after it disappears randomly, it will cost less the second time.

Note that the "upgrade path" from Basic Wood Cutter -> Hardened -> Galgadorian is significantly more expensive than just building it straight out. If you follow the path, expect to spend another 17 diamonds.