Recent Events Discussion (RED) Thread

[Yusunoha]

Guys.
Seriously.​

sorry I didn't know the discussion was taken here, so I didn't realize what happened in the other topic

and with the PiP debate... would it be possible for PiP to only work if the other player you're trying to follow also has PiP installed?
so let's say 1 person is using PiP on a server, if no one else is using it that person wouldn't be able to follow other people on the server

with that you could perhaps even take it a step further by having people using PiP first have to accept a request for another to follow you through PiP before it works...
I don't know much about coding so I'm just rambling here...

and with ExU gates? I'm all for it, I love the functionality of gates and would seriously love to see other mods give their twist on them
I actually hoped MFR would've added gate functionality with their rednet system, sadly that never happened...

 

[VapourDrive]

My personal opinion on the PiP mod is that it should be required server side if people want to use it as a client side mod, the check would only need to be done on player login (minimal server load). I find that this makes the most sense and stays on the proper side of what is fair and such etc. I also believe that a mod author should not have 2 dozen buggy mods that add no legit substance to the game...
The stuff that Tema has been working on looks very cool, I just hope that it gets moved to a standalone mod that has a well done api and does a few things very well instead of just having more things lumped into ExU, sadly if they stay in ExU I will not be able to play with them, which is a bit of a shame.
Final note: Berating, seriously guys? This is a fairly mature forum, people are expected to act mature.
I lied, smiley to end on a happy note:

 

[CarbonBasedGhost]

sorry I didn't know the discussion was taken here, so I didn't realize what happened in the other topic

and with the PiP debate... would it be possible for PiP to only work if the other player you're trying to follow also has PiP installed?
so let's say 1 person is using PiP on a server, if no one else is using it that person wouldn't be able to follow other people on the server

with that you could perhaps even take it a step further by having people using PiP first have to accept a request for another to follow you through PiP before it works...
I don't know much about coding so I'm just rambling here...

and with ExU gates? I'm all for it, I love the functionality of gates and would seriously love to see other mods give their twist on them
I actually hoped MFR would've added gate functionality with their rednet system, sadly that never happened...

Actually yes it would be possible to test if a person has the PiP, it's just iChun is being touchy about people telling him to do stuff with his mod.

 

[portablejim]

Note: I haven't used PiP or seen the code, so what I say may be off

The problem with PiP is that the client is already given the other players location and rotation as long as they are nearby (I imagine the same distance that PiP works in), so you just need the code to give a view of the world rendered from those co-ordinates. Even if from the start PiP was written like

if(serverSideAllows() && hatersDontHate()) {
  enablePiP()
}

It is simple to bypass

• Remove the server checking code
• Stop the server mod being required
  
• Change the mod ID so it is not seen as the same mod.

And the exact people you are worried about are the same people not affected.

 

[Yusunoha]

has anyone noticed that there's now a new hype in modded minecraft?
a while ago it was to add machines and mechanics to increase ore output, the next one was to add as much fancy models as possible and now the new hype seems to be to add some sort of drone type of entity doing chores for you...

 

[Sidorion]

to add some sort of drone type of entity doing chores for you...

We are the borg, all your bases are belong to us!
(Yes, I mixed them on purpose)

Edit:
btw. BC always had this little drone building the frame of quarries and if I remember correctly, the builder had one, too.

 

[NJM1564]

has anyone noticed that there's now a new hype in modded minecraft?
a while ago it was to add machines and mechanics to increase ore output, the next one was to add as much fancy models as possible and now the new hype seems to be to add some sort of drone type of entity doing chores for you...

It's not hype so much as mod devs seeing some thing shiny and whanting there own.

 

[Yusunoha]

We are the borg, all your bases are belong to us!
(Yes, I mixed them on purpose)

Edit:
btw. BC always had this little drone building the frame of quarries and if I remember correctly, the builder had one, too.

that was more of a fake entity as you couldn't hit it or anything
like the BC lasers, there's lasers shooting around, but they don't hurt you or anything, it's just for the show

 

[belgabor]

has anyone noticed that there's now a new hype in modded minecraft?
a while ago it was to add machines and mechanics to increase ore output, the next one was to add as much fancy models as possible and now the new hype seems to be to add some sort of drone type of entity doing chores for you...

Being lazy I have a hard time seeing this as a bad thing. More power to them I say =)

 

[trajing]

It is fairly simple to create a stop PiP server mod, at least from what I know. Just check if the player is being looked at by your client, and if it isn't, stop sending data. This would work with minimaps too.

 

[RedBoss]

It is fairly simple to create a stop PiP server mod, at least from what I know. Just check if the player is being looked at by your client, and if it isn't, stop sending data. This would work with minimaps too.

That would be awesome and something vanilla server admins would appreciate.

 

[CarbonBasedGhost]

It is fairly simple to create a stop PiP server mod, at least from what I know. Just check if the player is being looked at by your client, and if it isn't, stop sending data. This would work with minimaps too.

There is also the possibility that iChun is checking for the x, y, z and f coordinates of the player and spawning a camera there. In that case there is no way you could stop sending data to him as you would have to stop sending data to the server aswell. And because you have to be in rendering distance of the player that is most likely the case.

 

[trajing]

There is also the possibility that iChun is checking for the x, y, z and f coordinates of the player and spawning a camera there. In that case there is no way you could stop sending data to him as you would have to stop sending data to the server aswell. And because you have to be in rendering distance of the player that is most likely the case.

Isn't it possible to not tell the client the xyz of the other player unless it is looking at the player?

 

[Narc]

Isn't it possible to not tell the client the xyz of the other player unless it is looking at the player?

It should be. The server knows each player's position and view angles. It's a little bit of extra per-player processing, but it's feasible.

You do still need to deal with stale data on the client side, though (you look away from a player, the player moves, you look back to where you last saw the player and he's still there... because the server didn't tell you he moved). The easy fix for that would be to tell the client the other player teleported into the sky when he goes out of view. There may be other edge cases.

Heck, even just sending bogus angles (e.g. "the player is now looking directly up") when they're out of view would limit the usefulness of PiP.

Edit: Oh, and, technically, you could use the knowledge of when PiP starts working to find a hidden player -- just look around slowly and watch the PiP display. The server probably won't be doing occlusion testing to verify that you _actually can_ see the other player, just whether you're looking in their general direction.

Although, having said that, the occlusion testing does sound feasible, too...

 

[CarbonBasedGhost]

Isn't it possible to not tell the client the xyz of the other player unless it is looking at the player?

Nope they are rendered whenever they are in looking distance.

 

[Narc]

Nope they are rendered whenever they are in looking distance.

That wasn't the question. The question was whether it was possible to mod a server so that it only sends player data to clients whose players are looking in the right place. And the answer is probably yes.

 

[CarbonBasedGhost]

That wasn't the question. The question was whether it was possible to mod a server so that it only sends player data to clients whose players are looking in the right place. And the answer is probably yes.

Actually, no that was the question
See below:

Isn't it possible to not tell the client the xyz of the other player unless it is looking at the player?

 

[Narc]

Actually, no that was the question
See below:

Right, "to not tell the client". The only other entity that *could* tell the client anything is the server. Thus, can the server be persuaded to not tell the client about stuff.

At least, that's how I read it.

 

[trajing]

Nope they are rendered whenever they are in looking distance.

We're talking about a rendering overhaul. How the render system should have been to prevent exploits like this in the first place.

 

[Narc]

We're talking about a rendering overhaul. How the render system should have been to prevent exploits like this in the first place.

It's not even about rendering -- the client shows what the server tells it to show.