ReactorCraft - clever reactor setups?

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Braidedheadman

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Jul 29, 2019
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Use a duty cycle. Also, see my above reply.
ycwgm.png

:D
 
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Braidedheadman

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Greetings and Merry Christmas (or happy holidays, whichever way you take it) and Happy New year! I'm back home after an extendo-vacation from the far corners of the globe and right back in the thick of where I left off here. \o/

My next project will be LN2 production, starting with the Dewpoint Aggregator. However, there's a sharp lack of documentation in the wikis to go by, particularly where formulae and other practical matters are concerned. So, I've taken it upon myself to document my progress with this and other machines along the way, updating any wiki articles along the LN2 route that are lacking as I go.

I do want to make sure that my information is correct, however. At the moment, specifically, the lines of code that govern the production of water in the DPA, as in (TileEntityAggregator, lines 100-103):

Code:
private int getWaterProduced(BiomeGenBase biome) {
      return Math.max(2, (int)(torque*torque*ReikaBiomeHelper.getBiomeHumidity(biome)));
}

@Reika
Am I reading the code correctly when I interpret the above to mean that the production formula is:

gif.download


Where we have
gif.download
, I assume that this means that, supplying a minimum torque, this machine will produce at least two millibuckets (2 mb) of water per cycle rather than two full buckets (2000mb), correct? But given higher torque values, is there any upper limit to the volume of water that can be produced? Say, for instance, I decided to get a little crazy and give the machine 16384 Nm. Even in a desert biome (humidity modifier = 0.2) this would result in 53,687 buckets(!!) per operation, correct? Can the DPA truly achieve such astonishingly high water production rates? Or am I missing something and have gone way, way out to lunch here? :eek:

For the humidity modifiers, can you clarify for me whether or not my assumption is correct that the first IF block between ReikaBiomeHelper lines 403-434 pertains to vanilla MC biomes and that the second block (biomes by "type") between lines 437-452 are applied to modded biomes or otherwise a handler for biomes not caught in the first block? Is there any method that players can use to determine the humidity of the biome they're standing in?

Also, just as an aside, I noticed that in line 442, one of the modifier values was not typecast to a float as you did with the others. I doubt that it would impact anything negatively, as the affected line is effectively an int(1) anyway, but I thought I'd be a good Working Joe* and bring that to your attention just in case. :)

The completed draft wiki article: http://rotarycraft.wikia.com/wiki/Dew_Point_Aggregator

*(Alien: Isolation reference, ho! Great game, btw!)
 

zemerick

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Jul 29, 2019
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Greetings and Merry Christmas (or happy holidays, whichever way you take it) and Happy New year! I'm back home after an extendo-vacation from the far corners of the globe and right back in the thick of where I left off here. \o/

My next project will be LN2 production, starting with the Dewpoint Aggregator. However, there's a sharp lack of documentation in the wikis to go by, particularly where formulae and other practical matters are concerned. So, I've taken it upon myself to document my progress with this and other machines along the way, updating any wiki articles along the LN2 route that are lacking as I go.

I do want to make sure that my information is correct, however. At the moment, specifically, the lines of code that govern the production of water in the DPA, as in (TileEntityAggregator, lines 100-103):

Code:
private int getWaterProduced(BiomeGenBase biome) {
      return Math.max(2, (int)(torque*torque*ReikaBiomeHelper.getBiomeHumidity(biome)));
}

@Reika
Am I reading the code correctly when I interpret the above to mean that the production formula is:

gif.download


Where we have
gif.download
, I assume that this means that, supplying a minimum torque, this machine will produce at least two millibuckets (2 mb) of water per cycle rather than two full buckets (2000mb), correct? But given higher torque values, is there any upper limit to the volume of water that can be produced? Say, for instance, I decided to get a little crazy and give the machine 16384 Nm. Even in a desert biome (humidity modifier = 0.2) this would result in 53,687 buckets(!!) per operation, correct? Can the DPA truly achieve such astonishingly high water production rates? Or am I missing something and have gone way, way out to lunch here? :eek:

For the humidity modifiers, can you clarify for me whether or not my assumption is correct that the first IF block between ReikaBiomeHelper lines 403-434 pertains to vanilla MC biomes and that the second block (biomes by "type") between lines 437-452 are applied to modded biomes or otherwise a handler for biomes not caught in the first block? Is there any method that players can use to determine the humidity of the biome they're standing in?

Also, just as an aside, I noticed that in line 442, one of the modifier values was not typecast to a float as you did with the others. I doubt that it would impact anything negatively, as the affected line is effectively an int(1) anyway, but I thought I'd be a good Working Joe* and bring that to your attention just in case. :)

The completed draft wiki article: http://rotarycraft.wikia.com/wiki/Dew_Point_Aggregator

*(Alien: Isolation reference, ho! Great game, btw!)

Yes, the minimum is 2mb/t and it can completely fill the 128 bucket tank in 1 operation with enough torque. This is why it is basically the only choice for the fusion reactor.

Now, also be aware that as soon as you publish the exact details of something in RoC/ReC, Reika will change it. More general information, such as I have said here, is fine however. He just doesn't want set builds/calculators/etc.
 

Pyure

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Aug 14, 2013
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Yes, the minimum is 2mb/t and it can completely fill the 128 bucket tank in 1 operation with enough torque. This is why it is basically the only choice for the fusion reactor.

Now, also be aware that as soon as you publish the exact details of something in RoC/ReC, Reika will change it. More general information, such as I have said here, is fine however. He just doesn't want set builds/calculators/etc.
i gather you're kinda kidding here?

I haven't really observed that Reika will change something just because you release specific numbers on it. He might use those numbers to adjust an undesirable behavior if the numbers reveal such, but I haven't really seen him masking things just for the sake of masking them (which would be a pretty self-defeating exercise )
 

Reika

RotaryCraft Dev
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Sep 3, 2013
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i gather you're kinda kidding here?

I haven't really observed that Reika will change something just because you release specific numbers on it. He might use those numbers to adjust an undesirable behavior if the numbers reveal such, but I haven't really seen him masking things just for the sake of masking them (which would be a pretty self-defeating exercise )
He is referring to - and somewhat misinterpreting - something I said on the Teamspeak a couple of days ago. The topic was of "follow-the-leader" type tutorials, which I have repeatedly and publicly expressed a disdain for and do have a policy of (and have in fact done so in the past) taking measures to invalidate them. Something as simple as someone working out a formula would never elicit such an action.

And I quite like the wiki article.

Also, @Braidedheadman : The DPA does not produce LN2. The refrigeration unit does.
 
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Pyure

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Aug 14, 2013
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He is referring to - and somewhat misinterpreting - something I said on the Teamspeak a couple of days ago. The topic was of "follow-the-leader" type tutorials, which I have repeatedly and publicly expressed a disdain for and do have a policy of (and have in fact done so in the past) taking measures to invalidate them. Something as simple as someone working out a formula would never elicit such an action.

And I quite like the wiki article.

Also, @Braidedheadman : The DPA does not produce LN2. The refrigeration unit does.
Oh. Well, if you want to take the time to invalidate walkthroughs that's your problem :p
 

zemerick

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Jul 29, 2019
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He is referring to - and somewhat misinterpreting - something I said on the Teamspeak a couple of days ago. The topic was of "follow-the-leader" type tutorials, which I have repeatedly and publicly expressed a disdain for and do have a policy of (and have in fact done so in the past) taking measures to invalidate them. Something as simple as someone working out a formula would never elicit such an action.

And I quite like the wiki article.

Also, @Braidedheadman : The DPA does not produce LN2. The refrigeration unit does.

I understood it fine, just didn't explain it here very well I guess. Hence the end of "he just doesn't want set builds/calculators/etc." I myself have given out plenty of specifics, such as the power numbers for specific parts of the fusion reactor. Just pointing out that it's easy to go from providing useful detailed info, to copy/paste builds. Oh, and I was actually more speaking from the past. I try not to include anything specific from TS as only a few people would have access to that information and it is easy to get details wrong, or they might change.

Also, I think he meant the full LN2 production cycle of Water -> Ice -> LN2. So, his first step is getting enough water to feed the Fluid Crystallizer which will feed the RU for final LN2 production.
 

Braidedheadman

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Jul 29, 2019
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Yes, the minimum is 2mb/t and it can completely fill the 128 bucket tank in 1 operation with enough torque. This is why it is basically the only choice for the fusion reactor.

Now, also be aware that as soon as you publish the exact details of something in RoC/ReC, Reika will change it. More general information, such as I have said here, is fine however. He just doesn't want set builds/calculators/etc.
As I have no intention of writing a tutorial with any of the articles I may contribute to, I don't think there's any danger of that happening. I'm writing what amounts to a page in a technical manual, not doing other people's thinking for them! :p

And I quite like the wiki article.

Also, @Braidedheadman : The DPA does not produce LN2. The refrigeration unit does.
Thanks! :)

Also, no, I realize this, but allow me to clarify: LN2 is an end-goal for this project, a step toward a larger goal of building a legit SMP fusion reactor. What I meant was that the DPA is my (completely arbitrary) starting point in the production chain toward LN2 (water >> ice >> LN2).
 

Moharadan

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Jul 29, 2019
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Well, here we go again folks. This time a 16-core reactor. This one's a bit more flexibile for controlling heat levels.

Be careful with it; unlike the 12-core, this one will explode if you don't adjust your # of reflectors carefully.


View attachment 11442

OUTPUT:
  • 1 HP Turbine (1 x 8.59GW)
  • 2 Small Turbines (2 x 0.94GW)
  • Total: 10.47 GW (~1,857,000 RF/T)
  • May support one more turbine, not sure.

IMPORTANT NOTES:
  • In V23d this reactor can start a HP Turbine without any shenanigans
  • All testing done in a Plains biome
  • Heat level in this reactor is adjusted by adding Reflectors, preferably behind Control Rods (See Optional Reflector+Control Rod in the legend)
  • Add each reflector carefully. One at a time, and monitor the heat of your cores for several minutes afterwards.
  • Inserted Control Rods may prevent meltdowns but the reactor will run warm and inefficiently. (In the recent12-core setup, inserted rods almost shut down the reactor)
  • In my testing, 6+ reflectors incurred a meltdown; 5 reflectors (shown) causes occassional particle warnings around 500C
  • Some optional Reflector/Control Rods may be useful in colder biomes
  • 4 Gany's Infinite Water supplies were necessary; not sure if its because I wasn't extracting liquid as quickly as possible (Ender IO pressurized fluid pipes, no settings tweaked in their guis)
So, I finally have the infrastructure to get into fission reactors, and I decided to use this setup as a basis for my experimentation. With a few tweaks, I think I've come up with a pretty viable alternate configuration.
16 core reactor.png


This is currently powering two high-pressure turbines and two regular turbines, for a total of approximately 19 GW of power. One thing to note is that this is NOT ammonia-safe as is; I have seen boiler temperature spikes into the low 500's. However, with about 6 hours of runtime, I've seen 0 SCRAMs or meltdowns from this build. This is currently producing a small surplus of steam, but not enough to add another turbine.

Few notes: This is built in a Desert biome, ambient daytime temperature of 37 degrees. Adding two reflectors triggered a SCRAM relatively quickly; you might be able to add one, but I'm not sure it would increase output by an appreciable amount. Also, not sure if this has changed since the days of Pyure's testing, but I found it necessary to include steel blocks behind reflectors; non-reflected neutrons seemed to pass through and potentially cause radiation.

Next goal is to see if it's possible to make this ammonia-friendly while maintaining the ability to power two HT turbines, which would output almost 25 GW.
 
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zemerick

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So, I finally have the infrastructure to get into fission reactors, and I decided to use this setup as a basis for my experimentation. With a few tweaks, I think I've come up with a pretty viable alternate configuration.
View attachment 25266

This is currently powering two high-pressure turbines and two regular turbines, for a total of approximately 19 GW of power. One thing to note is that this is NOT ammonia-safe as is; I have seen boiler temperature spikes into the low 500's. However, with about 6 hours of runtime, I've seen 0 SCRAMs or meltdowns from this build. This is currently producing a small surplus of steam, but not enough to add another turbine.

Few notes: This is built in a Desert biome, ambient daytime temperature of 37 degrees. Adding two reflectors triggered a SCRAM relatively quickly; you might be able to add one, but I'm not sure it would increase output by an appreciable amount. Also, not sure if this has changed since the days of Pyure's testing, but I found it necessary to include steel blocks behind reflectors; non-reflected neutrons seemed to pass through and potentially cause radiation.

Next goal is to see if it's possible to make this ammonia-friendly while maintaining the ability to power two HT turbines, which would output almost 25 GW.

Just add more boilers, especially between the cores. Not sure about all of your design, you didn't include a key.

With fission, you can always have neutrons escape and cause radiation. Nothing at all can stop them entirely. I recommend placing the reflectors right against the boilers, 2 or 3 deep. Then bedrock ingot alloy blocks several deep after that to really decrease the amount of neutrons that slip out, and maximize power gain. ( Any shielding item placed before reflectors is wasted potential power. ) Boilers transfer heat in all 6 directions, so don't be afraid to really fill them in. You should also place blocks around anything that has a temperature to "insulate" it. This will prevent more power loss, and also means the biome/height don't matter.
 

Moharadan

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Jul 29, 2019
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I believe everything is insulated by neighboring blocks/steam&water lines/item conduits, except maybe the boilers that I removed in the "T" areas, since they weren't in line with any cores. They seemed unnecessary, since they weren't receiving any direct heat, and their neighbors were not the hot-spots in the reactor. Key was the same as Pyure's in the post that I quoted, B = Boiler, U = Core, O = Control Rod, R = Reflector, Grey = steel blocks. My plan was to try an additional boiler between in the row and column between the 2x2 sets of cores, since those are the boilers that tend to get the hottest, from my observations.

Glad someone is around, I was really hoping to have some outside input into design. Reactorcraft (and Reika's mods in general) are fascinating to me, and the potential variable design means that there's always room for improvement :p
 

Pyure

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Aug 14, 2013
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Yeah, my designs here predate a number of changes, one of which is less-reliable reflectors.

There's a neat hybrid breeder reactor in here somewhere that probably doesn't work anymore too.
 

Moharadan

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Jul 29, 2019
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Reflectors have 50% passthrough; that reactor is going to cause radiation leakage.
Hence the statement that reflectors still need steel blocks behind them, as I found out the hard way when testing :p I was just minimizing the size of the image a bit by not including them in the diagram. I LOVE your mods by the way, keep up the good work and hope to see more from you in the future!
 

ChemE

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Jul 29, 2019
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Do bedrock alloy blocks just absorb rather than reflect? I thought they were more reflective than were neutron reflectors.
 

LC14199

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Jul 29, 2019
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ok gents, I've managed to get a fission reactor running that uses plutonium and 4 boilers to run a regular turbine. Now I've decided to back track and see if I can get this Pebble Red reactor to work again, because in my most recent tests, I've thrown every design I had from Monster on it (I'm using revolution now), and all of em have failed. But knowing its been nerfed, this was expected. So I've tried different combinations for over an hour now, and I'm just not having any luck. Are these required to be stacked vertically now? Because that's the only thing I haven't tried, a vertical design. So does anyone have any regular 1 block high designs?

Cheers,
LC
 

Moharadan

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Jul 29, 2019
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ok gents, I've managed to get a fission reactor running that uses plutonium and 4 boilers to run a regular turbine. Now I've decided to back track and see if I can get this Pebble Red reactor to work again, because in my most recent tests, I've thrown every design I had from Monster on it (I'm using revolution now), and all of em have failed. But knowing its been nerfed, this was expected. So I've tried different combinations for over an hour now, and I'm just not having any luck. Are these required to be stacked vertically now? Because that's the only thing I haven't tried, a vertical design. So does anyone have any regular 1 block high designs?

Cheers,
LC
I'm not sure about a single-layer design, but I'm happy to share the one that I've had up and running for a bit now. It's 4 pebble bed cores and 1 CO2 heat exchanger in a cross-shape, stacked 4 high. This runs to 1 heat exchanger and 2 boilers, which produces enough steam to run 2 turbines. My only tips would be to make sure that it is insulated on all sides, and to just experiment with it. Seems like you have to manufacture CO2 in creative, but other than that it's fairly easy to try different configurations.
 

Reika

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Sep 3, 2013
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ok gents, I've managed to get a fission reactor running that uses plutonium and 4 boilers to run a regular turbine. Now I've decided to back track and see if I can get this Pebble Red reactor to work again, because in my most recent tests, I've thrown every design I had from Monster on it (I'm using revolution now), and all of em have failed. But knowing its been nerfed, this was expected. So I've tried different combinations for over an hour now, and I'm just not having any luck. Are these required to be stacked vertically now? Because that's the only thing I haven't tried, a vertical design. So does anyone have any regular 1 block high designs?

Cheers,
LC
HTGRs are intended to be stacked.
 

ChemE

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Jul 29, 2019
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ok gents, I've managed to get a fission reactor running that uses plutonium and 4 boilers to run a regular turbine. Now I've decided to back track and see if I can get this Pebble Red reactor to work again, because in my most recent tests, I've thrown every design I had from Monster on it (I'm using revolution now), and all of em have failed. But knowing its been nerfed, this was expected. So I've tried different combinations for over an hour now, and I'm just not having any luck. Are these required to be stacked vertically now? Because that's the only thing I haven't tried, a vertical design. So does anyone have any regular 1 block high designs?

Cheers,
LC

Perhaps Reika won't like it but if you plant 1 CO2 heat exchanger in the nether and surround it by a 5x3 of HTGRs and insulate every side of the HTGRs, you will make hot CO2. It isn't quite enough to run a LP steam turbine continuously though. I fill a drum with hot CO2 and then carry it back to my base and plug it into my ammonia setup and get insane amounts of power banked in an auroral battery.