Let's talk about RF

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Drbretto

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Mar 5, 2016
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I'm still fairly new to this RF system. I started my modded minecraft with buildcraft so I get the basic theory here, but the stuff that's out there for it is pretty overwhelming at first.

For one, let's say I go and set up enough solar panels to collect RF all day, how do I store large quantities? The only thing I know how to use is the EnderIO capacitors, and the biggest non-creative option only holds 25,000,000 RF. Am I supposed to just keep making those to hold it all, or are there better options? MY modpack has the thermal foundation/expansion etc mods, enderIO and draconic evolution or whatever, but I'm more than willing to add on to it. Is Big Reactors for creating RF, or storing, or both?

I'd love to read any links on the matter if anyone knows of anything worth reading, too.
 

Pyure

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I'm still fairly new to this RF system. I started my modded minecraft with buildcraft so I get the basic theory here, but the stuff that's out there for it is pretty overwhelming at first.

For one, let's say I go and set up enough solar panels to collect RF all day, how do I store large quantities? The only thing I know how to use is the EnderIO capacitors, and the biggest non-creative option only holds 25,000,000 RF. Am I supposed to just keep making those to hold it all, or are there better options? MY modpack has the thermal foundation/expansion etc mods, enderIO and draconic evolution or whatever, but I'm more than willing to add on to it. Is Big Reactors for creating RF, or storing, or both?

I'd love to read any links on the matter if anyone knows of anything worth reading, too.
For the capacitors: if you put them beside each other, they make a convenient, freeform multiblock. So two touching capacitors hold 50,000,000 etc.

For alternatives: Draconic Evolution has a really amazing-looking energy-storage solution https://ftbwiki.org/Energy_Storage_Multiblock

The images in that link don't show the end result, just how to assemble it, so:
upload_2017-2-13_9-44-29.png


This thing also holds an absurd quantity of power at its highest tier, with 2.14 TRF (2,140,000,000,000)
 
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Drbretto

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I have seen that, and that's pretty much the sole reason I installed that mod! lol. But I figure I'm a ways off for that one. I was intending to stack those capacitors if all else failed, so I guess that's where we are at. I shall make a bunch of them for now.
 

LordPINE

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Mekanism always has its giant induction multiblock, if you need a lot of storage, otherwise, its ultimate energy cube can store quite a lot of power, if I remember correctly.
 

malicious_bloke

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Early-mid game options, either EnderIO capacitors as above, or the basic TE energy cells are quite cost-effective.

Depending on what MC version you're playing Electricraft adds some quite large scale storage. Auroral batteries hold a staggering amount.

Other than that, yeah the big Draconic Ball of Doom Pyure pictured above is fantastic. It's a nice aesthetic feature for any base too :)
 
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Drbretto

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What about big reactors? Where does that fall into this? It looks like it's for generation. Would it be worth adding?

One of my goals will be to make octocobble, so I intend to be running lots of quarries and I am not interested in just running to the nether to pump lava every time. Even when I'm set up with ender tanks, eventually, that will run out. I basically need to collect more fuel via quarry than I am using to run the quarries, I think.

I don't even know what else I'm using this power for, all I know is I WANT it, lol. That draconic thing is definitely going to happen. Just to have it.
 

Pyure

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What about big reactors? Where does that fall into this? It looks like it's for generation. Would it be worth adding?

One of my goals will be to make octocobble, so I intend to be running lots of quarries and I am not interested in just running to the nether to pump lava every time. Even when I'm set up with ender tanks, eventually, that will run out. I basically need to collect more fuel via quarry than I am using to run the quarries, I think.

I don't even know what else I'm using this power for, all I know is I WANT it, lol. That draconic thing is definitely going to happen. Just to have it.
Big Reactors is great for generating power, but I don't know offhand that it has anything for storing it.
 

Drbretto

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This thread can go beyond power storage. I'm ok with it :p I'm new to the whole thing, so I don't even know if I have all the right questions yet. As of right now, I'm generating all of my power from a buildcraft pump 50 meters above an ocean of lava in the nether. I have 8 256k mB barrels I fill up manually and connect them to 12 lava generators. I'm very much open to new ideas on power generation as well.

Though,I think I probably will get by for a good solid while on solar power for now. But it can't hurt to get an idea for the future. What else am I gonna do today? Work? psh! :p
 

DeathGoth

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I am not interested in just running to the nether to pump lava every time.

I lucked out here.. Randoming ages wit mystcraft I fell on a lava ocean..

What I do beginning is make a few of the cells from thermal expansion that are 80 million..

I did this on my last world but I didn't like the world so I restarted somewhere else..

But the 80 mill cells from thermal expansion and you should be fine plus for quarrying you can shut them off and such wit a Redstone signal.. Have a few 5 or 10 mills for that.
 

ShneekeyTheLost

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So, let's talk about RF, how to move it around, how to store it, and such.

There's several mods that handle RF distribution/storage, each one takes a slightly different tack, with different merits and flaws.

EnderIO's Conduit and Capacitor Bank system is a fairly elegant way to get RF running around. The advantage Conduits have over other methods is that they can occupy the same block-space as other conduits. So, for example, you can have Fluids, Items, and RF running in the same block-space, which is unique among mods. It also has the Dimensional Transceiver which lets you transport it over long distances wirelessly. The Capacitor Banks have several interesting features besides simply storing RF. First, it can be used directly to charge items needing RF, second it keeps track of and tells you about energy consumption as positive or negative, and third it can form multiblocks for more capacity AND higher throughput. You also have the Monitor which can generate redstone signals based on a percentage of capacity of the bank, which can be invaluable for certain automation tasks. This is why it tends to be the 'default' go-to.

Thermal Expansion goes with a different mindset. It has the least impact on your CPU and RAM of any of the systems, by a significant margin. EnderIO's ability to be compact comes at the cost of performance, TE is very 'lightweight' and elegant. Having said that, the fact that you cannot have FluxDucts in the same space as, say, Fluiducts or Itemducts can really hamper compact build designs. The Energy Cube can be set to emit redstone signal on a few conditions (full, empty, not full, not empty), but it doesn't really keep track of the rate of energy consumption/creation like the Capacitor Bank does, and cannot be set up to emit redstone under discrete conditions like the Monitor can provide. So, better performance, not as many bells and whistles. Plus it looks cool.

Mekanism's system just plain sucks, taking the worst of both worlds. Don't use it.

Draconic Evolution is strictly end-game. By the time you can build it, you've already effectively won.

Now, let's talk about energy creation

Mekanism has several passive RF generation systems. Between the Windmill Generator and the Heat Generator surrounded by lava, you can have a passive RF system for your early-game. Mind you, it won't last you forever, but it's passive, and it's at least enough to get you started into your respective tech trees. Some people call this a huge negative, others swear by it. YMMV. There's also the Gas Generator which has undergone many changes, but can provide mid-tier RF production solutions.

Thermal Expansion has the classic fuel methods, mostly because that was the idea... to create machines and energy production based on the BC model (and as far as I am concerned, ended up replacing it). With that goal in mind, they knocked it out of the park, and has extremely low performance requirements compared to the predecessors. So you've got your 'burning dynamo', your 'lava dynamo', and your 'liquid fuel dynamo that requires coolant' as your mainstays. They then added the Reactant Dynamo, which basically is what you can use to run your mob grinder with since it runs on mob drops and liquid xp. There are no 'passive' RF generation methods in TE, but Lava is so plentiful in the Nether that, once you get a way to pump it from the nether and get it to your power plant, it is effectively so, and typically the primary power system of most early-game Skyblock style maps as a result.

EnderIO decided to take things 'out of the box' with their power generation. Of course, they've got the basic 'burning generator', which (with an Octadic Capacitor) is pretty darn good at what it does. The other generators typically need processing to make what they run off of, you've got the 'liquid fuel burning but needs coolant' one, and you've got one that runs off of Nutrient.
 

Drbretto

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That's a hell of a post, Shneeky, thank you! Very informative. Especially about the Mob Juicer 10000. I was really hoping there would be some generators that take advantage of things like zombie flesh and whatnot. I just hadn't really gotten around to looking into all that yet.

So, the lava generation method is worth it, huh? My Nether generation is particularly atrocious, but I did manage to find a spot I can get to that I blocked off with a pump and 4 redstone engines to pump it. In the beginning, I was pulling the lava from caves and the rate it was sucking it up had me slightly concerned. So far, the 8 barrels I've pumped out of there looks like it hasn't touched it yet, but that section will run dry and moving to a new spot is not going to be an easy task. But then again, I'm not necessarily lookin' for easy, so it is what it is.

Thanks everyone for the replies so far. I've got a much clearer picture now. I do think I'll be sticking primarily to enderIO mothods for now, if only because I'm already a little bit familiar with what it has, but it seems like there's a reason it's so popular.

I've been using buildcraft to transport things, but I might take the time to see how the EnderIO conduits work. Eventually might even graduate to a world where I don't need buildcraft at all, bbecause it sounds like it's bordering on obsolete anyway.
 

ShneekeyTheLost

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That's a hell of a post, Shneeky, thank you! Very informative. Especially about the Mob Juicer 10000. I was really hoping there would be some generators that take advantage of things like zombie flesh and whatnot. I just hadn't really gotten around to looking into all that yet.
Yea, the EnderIO zombie generator can turn things like rotten flesh into a power source. Look up what you need to make Nutrient in a Vat.

So, the lava generation method is worth it, huh? My Nether generation is particularly atrocious, but I did manage to find a spot I can get to that I blocked off with a pump and 4 redstone engines to pump it. In the beginning, I was pulling the lava from caves and the rate it was sucking it up had me slightly concerned. So far, the 8 barrels I've pumped out of there looks like it hasn't touched it yet, but that section will run dry and moving to a new spot is not going to be an easy task. But then again, I'm not necessarily lookin' for easy, so it is what it is.
It is used especially in Skyblock maps because Ex Nihilio creates means of generating lava very early game, and also enough invar to make one very early game. In regular play, it was a quick and easy setup once you had your EnderThermic Pump and a Tesseract/EnderTank to transport the lava across dimensions.

I've been using buildcraft to transport things, but I might take the time to see how the EnderIO conduits work. Eventually might even graduate to a world where I don't need buildcraft at all, bbecause it sounds like it's bordering on obsolete anyway.
As far as I've been concerned, it's been obsolete since 1.5 or 1.6. Ducts are everything Pipes wished they were, Dynamos are everything Engines wish they were, it just... takes everything BC does, and does it better. BUT, that is just my personal opinion, not a definitive or objective statement. YMMV.
 

Drbretto

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I'm not going to be offended by working with an outdated mod. The first mod I ever used was Runecraft (the first mod ever made) on my first paid server only a year ago. I'd have kept using that one if I could have, to be honest. It was new to me! lol

I started with buildcraft because I found the quarries to be mesmerizing when I'm... tranced out. And I loved the idea of watching the items going through the pipes for sorting and whatnot.

But, from what I'm seeing, EnderIO covers all that without the visual effects. And does it better. EnderThermic Pump even has its own chunk loader, right? And it replaces it with cobblestone, so if I ever do have to move it, it'll be easier. The Ender Quarry also seems less laggy, replaces everything with dirt so I don't leave craters (though I dig under water usually anyway) and can get silk touch or fortune 3.

So, I'm mostly just using buildcraft because it's familiar. I'm weening myself off of it so I can make the jump to a more up to date base some day.
 

DeathGoth

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You should try ender quarry..

They fill in the hole wit dirt when it takes things out.. Or you can have a hole. You also have the ability for fortune and silk touch and speed upgrades..

I used to use bc quarry and when I got back into mc they were on 1.7.10 so I tried the ender quarry it is it fast and good.
 

Drbretto

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Just want to make sure, though. Does the Ender Quarry let you mine the cobblestone? I have plans for loooooooots of cobblestone.

Bonus question: Anyone know if ender quarry is faster/slower and more or less efficient power-wise? Compared to BC.
 

ShneekeyTheLost

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Just want to make sure, though. Does the Ender Quarry let you mine the cobblestone? I have plans for loooooooots of cobblestone.

Bonus question: Anyone know if ender quarry is faster/slower and more or less efficient power-wise? Compared to BC.
* you don't need to *mine* Cobble. Put a water source two blocks away form a lava source, and put an ExUtil item with a mining/world interaction upgrade in it and you have arbitrary quantities of cobble.
 

DeathGoth

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Ya just don't have silk touch.

Also what he said above..

Ender quarry is faster if you give it enough power.
 

Drbretto

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That's actually a good point about cobblestone generation. I wasn't thinking of it that way only because I only started collecting it in the first place because on my last game, I thought it was a shame to destroy all that cobblestone.

Well, I got enough to do for like a month now, lol.
 

Inaeo

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If you're interested in large scale power generation, Big Reactors is your go to mod. Since you can scale them to your needs, many people start out with a 3^3 Reactor to power a Quarry setup. Usually the Quarry will mine up more fuel than it uses, or at least comes close enough that your basic exploring and ground clearance can uncover the rest. Once you get set up, a larger, generally more fuel efficient Reactor is in order (some people will salvage parts from the original Reactor to do this, others will build a second from scratch). When your power needs outpace that, you can turn the previous Reactor into an actively cooled setup using Turbines to generate even more power. If you have the right mods at your disposal, and a little ingenuity, you can actually cut out the Reactor all together and use a closed loop infinite power system (as described in my signature).

As much as I love giant, mass producing, RF systems, I've found it generally more efficient to have a number of small generator stations near areas of need. In most cases, it is far easier to transport and store fuel than power. As long as your generators can handle any spikes in usage, providing enough fuel to run those generators at the site needed not only saves on cabling and chunkloading, but also makes the power system more resilient. If you have issues with spikes in usage, a capacitor (not necessarily an EnderIO Capacitor Bank, but any storage with sufficient capacity and throughput) can alleviate most of if not all of the issue, while again making the grid more resilient.

Don't be afraid to think outside the BC box. Traditional fuels are wonderful and reliable, but there are so many ways to generate power out there for 1.7 that it's nearly impossible to not have 20 ways to do it. For instance, I powered a server of four until endgame on a large mob farm complex - Blaze Rods burn longer than coal, Mob Essence and Gunpowder in Reactant Dynamos, XU Potion Generator, and so on. I won that bet at the expense of my FPS, but a win's a win.

My only other advice, is keeping RF production slightly higher than consumption. Too many times have I made huge power generation systems, only to have to figure out how the hell to store it all. Once I'm storing it, I have to figure out what to spend it on. I'm learning this is the wrong approach. It's far better to have a generation system powering a large buffer (EnderIO Capacitor Bank does work wonders for this) to near full, then automatically shutting down until the buffer is around half full (EnderIO Power Monitor works wonders for this). This saves on fuel, worry, and hassle, while still offering the ability to grow your power grid in new and dynamic ways (since you don't already have " all the power").

Long winded, I know, but one last thing: if you like to see items zipping around in pipes, use Thermal Dynamics. If not, use Thermal Dynamics. My god how awesome those ducts are once you get to know them.
 

Drbretto

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Another great reply!

What is the difference in the Thermal Dynamics pipes? Sometimes these things aren't that easy to decipher from a wiki.

Two things I liked about BC were the different materials not connecting to each other, so I can pack them in, and the diamond sorting pipes are very simple to work with. Does Thermal Dynamics have an answer there?

I'm already going to use BC for the building I'm in now, just because I could easily end up in a rabbit hole, but after this build I am more than willing to experiment.