greg has lost his mind.......

[KingTriaxx]

Yes, newer versions need nether quartz for the cables, and actually the conversion matrices. However, even in Ultimate, you can make the processors directly in an Assembly Table. One redstone, one silicon and either a gold or diamond. No need to additionally cook, just a bit of time for the lasers to work.

All at once, Greg giveth and taketh. I mean, remember in Ultimate trying to make RP2 frame motors? Know that draw plate you made? Useless. Run 3 copper wire through the wiremill. Yes, macerators are more expensive, but he didn't touch the recipe for Thermal Expansion's equivalent Pulverizers. Besides, because of Greg and RP2, you could have infinite diamonds. (Nikolite ore gives diamond dust, implosion compressor makes diamonds. Slight loss, but chances are you have an infinite supply of Nikolite.)

The two changes I always make are the recipe for solar panels, and the steel requirement for tools. I like the alternate crafting patterns using refined Iron, instead of normal tools with circuits and batteries.

The real problem I find is that... I'm using IC2 for less and less. If I want rubber, I use MFR's. If I want flight, I have MPS, Thaumic Tinkerer, and Thaumcraft itself. I can mine so much faster with a well designed TiC hammer that the drill is almost worthless. And most trees I can cut down in seconds with the Lumber Axe. The Nano Saber is completely outclassed by the Sword of the Zephyr, and well constructed TiC weapons.

Sorry, rant, but look closely at IC2, he's just taking IC2 to it's ultimate conclusion.

Edit: Also you can find rubies and use those in Energy Crystals, instead of Diamonds by the by.

 

[khorozm]

The difference: AE works outside it's own mod eco-system.
Also, notice I said "over 200 iron, 100 rubber, a fuckton of redstone, 4 diamonds (for the MFE)" just to go to the Nether. And I forgot Copper! While some may say that ore doubling shouldn't be easy to get, it should not cost more than what most people have after they get ore doubling. There's this fine line between just enough so you feel like you worked for it and downright forcing you to become a mole.

Or just find a loot chest which 99% of them have steel in it?
Not everybody enjoy psudocreative mode after one week of playing, it took me one week in 1.6.2 gregtech to get into electric age, which I see is fun and feel like I have advanced in something

 

[Hoff]

Or just find a loot chest which 99% of them have steel in it?
Not everybody enjoy psudocreative mode after one week of playing, it took me one week in 1.6.2 gregtech to get into electric age, which I see is fun and feel like I have advanced in something

Gregtech doesn't prevent you from doing so in actuality. It just makes the time you spend on the game less valuable(Speaking in terms of in-game progress here) thus spending more time would counter-balance it. I guarantee you could still charge straight through everything just like you always could. I don't mean to be overly blunt about it, because it is obviously the way you enjoy the game, but sugar-coating it into something it's not is a bit pointless and misleading.

Though I also find the nether bit a moot point since you only have to work extremely hard to get to the nether conveniently when there are a handful of ways to do it without; regardless it just made the way most people are used to doing it stupidly ineffective without real reason.

 

[ShneekeyTheLost]

 

[PonyKuu]

GregTech is not about making things hard.

Of course not. GregTech is about making all the things you can possibly do in Minecraft depend on GregTech.

 

[SpitefulFox]

Not everybody enjoy psudocreative mode after one week of playing, it took me one week in 1.6.2 gregtech to get into electric age, which I see is fun and feel like I have advanced in something

And not everyone feels the need to compare every mod they don't like to creative mode.

 

[zorn]

I think if people ignore that you have to mindlessly smelt a processor to get the final product, and this useless crafting step is accepted, then people should at least admit that gregtech is just more steps/tedium whatever than you want to deal with.

Notch could have made ores become metal 'lumps' in your inventory when you mined them, and then just used these lumps to make items directly. two sticks, 3 lumps of iron.. an iron pickaxe. No furnace needed. Why force us to go through more steps to make items we need?

The most basic aspects of minecraft are just tedium. Someone could make a furnace mod tomorrow that smelts 64 ores a tick, and has a built in solar panel and battery, and runs 24/7, all on it's own. Cost, 3 cobble and a piece of dirt. If you agree that this would be kind of lame and boring, then you admit that sitting down to your pc to spend a few real life hours setting up a tree farm and furnaces to make charcoal to run a boiler so you can run a machine that takes a bunch of 1s and 0s in a program on your computer that is called "Iron Ore" and turn it into two dusts... well you have to admit that you enjoy tedium. Everything about crafting AT ALL is about tedium. Any step to make or obtain resources in survival mode is tedium. Try and tell me that running a quarry has anything to do with being creative, and is not 100% tedium. And IMO it really shows the basic anti gregtech argument is just false. Tedium is not bad for the game. It's just that everyone has their own idea on how much they want to deal with.

 

[PonyKuu]

Not everybody enjoy psudocreative mode after one week of playing, it took me one week in 1.6.2 gregtech to get into electric age, which I see is fun and feel like I have advanced in something

You know, people are saying that GT is not about making things hard, but according to these comments that call everything else "creative mod" it is. (However, my opinion is posted above)
And you know... you spent a week to get stuff I need to spend a couple of days for. Why do you think that more time spent is better? There are 100+ mods in every big modpack, don't you want to check at least some of them instead of spending your time on grinding for a macerator?

 

[SatanicSanta]

Of course not. GregTech is about making all the things you can possibly do in Minecraft depend on GregTech.

This is why we have config files. His is quite great actually.

Or just find a loot chest which 99% of them have steel in it?
Not everybody enjoy psudocreative mode after one week of playing, it took me one week in 1.6.2 gregtech to get into electric age, which I see is fun and feel like I have advanced in something

Oh good, more "play creative mode" posts...

snip

Actually, most of this post has a pretty good point. There is nearly no need for a furnace, and before there was hunger, there was certainly no need for a furnace other than smelting iron, which could've been lumps. However, the part about how GT is just more tedium, yeah, no its not. It adds a lot of interesting machines and tools, while, yes, adding things required to make those machines.

You know, people are saying that GT is not about making things hard, but according to these comments that call everything else "creative mod" it is. (However, my opinion is posted above)
And you know... you spent a week to get stuff I need to spend a couple of days for. Why do you think that more time spent is better? There are 100+ mods in every big modpack, don't you want to check at least some of them instead of spending your time on grinding for a macerator?

Most machines are really not that hard to get, most of it you can do while afk or doing some other task.

 

[dannypeck]

well, this thread got out of hand....

OT: the thing with gregtech is, some people want more challenge/tedium. ok, putting it in the 1.4.7 ultimate pack wasn't the best thing for the majority of players. but then again, power converters is another divider in the community. I personally find that vanilla IC2 progresses too easy, but people seem to forget its all about choice. hell, if there was a mod called rubbishcraft, that only one other guy liked, isn't it his right to enjoy that mod?

 

[TheSirusKing]

Pretty sure Osmium is not from GregTech.
Go blame whoever added it for making the ore, that is super mega rare in real life (IT IS THE LEAST COMMON METAL ON THE PLANET) so common. In Real life, the majority of the osmium found is actually in a Compound that is heavily Iridium based. This recipe makes complete sense, it is just whoever adds osmium ore that doesn't.

 

[Loufmier]

greg has lost his mind.......

you dont say. can anyone remind how many times it`s happened?

 

[r00teniy]

Also, notice I said "over 200 iron, 100 rubber, a fuckton of redstone, 4 diamonds (for the MFE)" just to go to the Nether. And I forgot Copper! While some may say that ore doubling shouldn't be easy to get, it should not cost more than what most people have after they get ore doubling. There's this fine line between just enough so you feel like you worked for it and downright forcing you to become a mole.

To go to the Nether you only need a bucket, 2 planks and some cobble(6 iron for hammer +6 iron for bucket).

 

[PonyKuu]

This is why we have config files. His is quite great actually.

Well, yes. But what would we get if we remove all that "I know how your mod should work better" and "These are definitely need to be made out of tungsten" crap via config? A couple of very hungry machines, a lot of insanely expensive end-game stuff that's not very interesting and a rock cutter. Not very impressive in my opinion.

Most machines are really not that hard to get, most of it you can do while afk or doing some other task.

But much harder than you usually get them. The main issue is that it makes the same stuff require much more grinding to get. Like with quarry - you have to build his bloody machines, and supply them with MV just to make that freakin' titanium and get... the same old quarry that's needed to be moved each time it finishes mining and that leaves holes in the ground.

well, this thread got out of hand....
OT: the thing with gregtech is, some people want more challenge/tedium. ok, putting it in the 1.4.7 ultimate pack wasn't the best thing for the majority of players. but then again, power converters is another divider in the community. I personally find that vanilla IC2 progresses too easy, but people seem to forget its all about choice. hell, if there was a mod called rubbishcraft, that only one other guy liked, isn't it his right to enjoy that mod?

Hey, I'm not telling you how to play. The things I say is just my opinion. I just want that "Y NO LIKE GT - USE CREATIVE THEN" crap to stop.
And for me the main issue with vanilla IC2 is not the ease of progress but the fact that there are three options for power generation:
1) Solar/Windmill spam
2) Pumping Nether dry
3) crappy ones.

 

[khorozm]

You know, people are saying that GT is not about making things hard, but according to these comments that call everything else "creative mod" it is. (However, my opinion is posted above)
And you know... you spent a week to get stuff I need to spend a couple of days for. Why do you think that more time spent is better? There are 100+ mods in every big modpack, don't you want to check at least some of them instead of spending your time on grinding for a macerator?

It doesnt take many hours to get a macerator. I don't like pseudocreative after a week because I dont like the ability just to plot down 20 boilers so that I dont need to worry about power issues. You actually need to think how to optimise ore processing or machine crafting (like using the assembler machine). You need to plan the cabling but not just like "AE, craft me 1000 glass fiber cable"
Anyway, it is only about how much tedium we enjoy, if you want to design some very awsome system/ base you can always go into creative mode so you dont need to grind resources at all. There is no wrong with it. In vanilla my contraptions are usually small and not overkill. I would never do Etho's potion system or dig a 64 diameter hole to bedrock.
Btw, I enjoy playing easier modpack on servers, because I just want to have some relaxing time. But when it is my world, I enjoy the tedium brought by Gregtech.

Well, yes. But what would we get if we remove all that "I know how your mod should work better" and "These are definitely need to be made out of tungsten" crap via config? A couple of very hungry machines, a lot of insanely expensive end-game stuff that's not very interesting and a rock cutter. Not very impressive in my opinion.

But much harder than you usually get them. The main issue is that it makes the same stuff require much more grinding to get. Like with quarry - you have to build his bloody machines, and supply them with MV just to make that freakin' titanium and get... the same old quarry that's needed to be moved each time it finishes mining and that leaves holes in the ground.

Hey, I'm not telling you how to play. The things I say is just my opinion. I just want that "Y NO LIKE GT - USE CREATIVE THEN" crap to stop.
And for me the main issue with vanilla IC2 is not the ease of progress but the fact that there are three options for power generation:
1) Solar/Windmill spam
2) Pumping Nether dry
3) crappy ones.

They may not have balanced it well enough but it is the same in vanilla Buildcraft.

 

[PonyKuu]

Putting down 20 boilers is not simple, since you need to use something to actually produce power (ISEs, yep) and something to make fuel for them. That requires a lot of resources and building and setting the infraustructure and interesting stuff. Greg doesn't help me with that. Greg has some multiblock machines that are not really multiblocks. Greg is "hard" if you say so, but not in an interesting way. Adding more crafting steps and bumping the costs doesn't make thing more interesting. As well as making a ridiculously slow machine with huge power requirements and making that the only way to obtain some stuff.

 

[RedBoss]

Tedium is not bad for the game. It's just that everyone has their own idea on how much they want to deal with.

QFT from you. Most people disagree with the GT portion of tedium. They feel the reward is not equal to the effort. Nuff said.

OT. Yes.

 

[zorn]

QFT from you. Most people disagree with the GT portion of tedium. They feel the reward is not equal to the effort. Nuff said.

OT. Yes.

yes but this isnt what people usually say, they say tedium is NOT fun. Ive argued this same point in 10 different gregtech discussions, Ive never been able to get people to agree that tedium IS fun in measured doses, because it makes the end goal more satisfying. They just feel greg added too much.

I wouldn't say 'most' people dont like gregtech. I think you cited Unleashed as being more popular as proof of gregtech not being popular, but ive read a lot of people playing 'Unleashed plus Gregtech'. Unhinged is a entirely new level of challenge, from what ive seen, compared to Ultimate. As ive said before, i think a lot of it has to do with how much time people have to play. Ill probably play unhinged, but i have kids so i might cheat a bit and just go Unleashed plus Gregtech.

Unleashed without gregtech? Too easy for me IMO. But 'easy' is defined differently by each person of course.

 

[Siro]

Pretty sure Osmium is not from GregTech.
Go blame whoever added it for making the ore, that is super mega rare in real life (IT IS THE LEAST COMMON METAL ON THE PLANET) so common. In Real life, the majority of the osmium found is actually in a Compound that is heavily Iridium based. This recipe makes complete sense, it is just whoever adds osmium ore that doesn't.

The answer is both. Gregtech, the last time I checked, did not generate Osmium in the world. It does add a recipe for uu matter to tiny piles of osmium dust (which can then be smelted into ingots, made into blocks or bent into plates to use as covers). Nether ores does add osmium generation in the nether as a nether ore, but is not available for 1.6.*. So it must be some other mod that is adding ore generation or Greg or IC2 very recently added it.

Unrelated to the above, and explained many times now, steel is not needed to light a nether portal. It's also a config option on whether flint & steel actually requires steel. Search "namefix" in the dynamic config. If someone wants me to post a config file for an easy Gregtech, I will. I've been testing one in my latest world where the general idea was to modify the speed of the various machines to significantly reward their construction and use. One might also look at additional mods to reward the construction of the harder recipe versions of things. For example: Install Quarries Plus to be the reward for building a quarry using the Gregtech recipe.

 

[zorn]

Putting down 20 boilers is not simple, since you need to use something to actually produce power (ISEs, yep) and something to make fuel for them. That requires a lot of resources and building and setting the infraustructure and interesting stuff.

Id don't understand how putting down 20 boilers is fun, but gregtech is not. 'resources and building and infrastructure? This is the point of an industrial grinder taking more energy to run. It forces you to build more infrastructure, and slows down game progression. Faster game progression means things move towards creative mode style of player more quickly, and getting there too fast is not fun, otherwise people would just play creative. HOW fast is up for debate though.

Greg doesn't help me with that. Greg has some multiblock machines that are not really multiblocks.

This is kind of silly, it just looks cool to have a big machine, how is a 'true' multiblock better than how greg did it?

Greg is "hard" if you say so, but not in an interesting way.

If you say so. It's interesting to me to figure out how to make sodium persulfate, vs making my 20th boiler.

Adding more crafting steps and bumping the costs doesn't make thing more interesting. As well as making a ridiculously slow machine with huge power requirements and making that the only way to obtain some stuff.

it's not supposed to really be more interesting, its supposed to slow down game progression. So if a person is playing SSP or has little time to devote to the game, then gregtech is annoying. If i couldnt use chunk loaders, id probably go nuts with clogging up my blast furnace with aluminum from all the clay i get. id need like 5 of them at least. As it is, i built a second one and run it all day on aluminum, basically.

The slow machine and high power is just another way of looking at the game. Some people want to get to End Game in a week, others want it to take months. It's not wrong, just different.