Changing two liquids of the same type into one another.

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abculatter_2

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Can I just be RIDICULOUSLY pedantic and point out that i'm old/lazy and still automatically parse "RC" as Railcraft. This, combined with there now being a parent and child mod that could both be initialised to "RC" doesn't help my laziness-induced fail any :p
This is true. RoC and ReC would probably be better, if we could get those popularized...
 

Reika

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This is interesting, is this for the up-coming 1.7 release of Gregtech?
I am definitely excited about the idea of my two favorite mods adding cross-mod compatibility with eachother...
This was added months ago.

EDIT: Oh, and while we're on the subject of Greg adding his own HSLA steel, do your recipes use the oredict for HSLA steel ingots?
No. Also, are you sure it is his HSLA and not mine?

This is true. RoC and ReC would probably be better, if we could get those popularized...
I am still using RC because all the posts and documentation are using it.
 

YX33A

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This was added months ago.


No. Also, are you sure it is his HSLA and not mine?


I am still using RC because all the posts and documentation are using it
.
I guess if you're gonna use RoC or ReC instead of RC, you're gonna have to change a decent amount of things. Which more then anything sounds like you don't care to change it since that's what's stopping you.
No offense intended.
 

Reika

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I guess if you're gonna use RoC or ReC instead of RC, you're gonna have to change a decent amount of things. Which more then anything sounds like you don't care to change it since that's what's stopping you.
No offense intended.
Arguably true, but that wording makes it sound worse than it really is. I do not find it reasonable to expect me to go back and rewrite a lot of posts, wiki pages, and maybe even mod data to satisfy abbreviation preferences.
 
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YX33A

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Arguably true, but that wording makes it sound worse than it really is. I do not find it reasonable to expect me to go back and rewrite a lot of posts, wiki pages, and maybe even mod data to satisfy abbreviation preferences.
I'm aware it is a large amount of things to change. Internal mod data isn't something that has to be changed in this case, previous posts are beyond the scope of this, but wiki pages and in game documentation would be the ones I would say would have to change. It doesn't even have to be done all at once.

Plus, Notepad++, and you've just edited 5000+ lines that said RC into your new acronym with a few keystrokes.
 

abculatter_2

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No. Also, are you sure it is his HSLA and not mine?
Yes, he does add his own HSLA steel. I am very sure about it, mainly because it shows up even without Rotarycraft installed, and also NEI says it comes from Gregtech.

Also, it would be nice if you could add oredict support, though I know that it may be non-trivial to and, if so, it's really not a big deal at all.
 

wolfsilver00

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Im just trying to put my little piece of sand here..

First of all.. @Reika I really like your mods, and they do have RELATIVE realism in comparison to other mods, but using the flag of realism for everything is not really a good idea, im telling you this in a friendly way, try to be a little less defensive, you are doing a great work with your mods and if you check in some of my posts, I tend to give it credit quite a lot, but your attitude may be a little.. counter productive. People will have their own opinions and you can't take everything as a direct attack to you or your mod.

Now.. Something to keep in mind, no one here is a nuclear scientist, so discussing about this as if we had absolute knowledge only because we spent some time on wikipedia, is nonsense. That goes for everyone. This is minecraft, not real life, and as such, it has its limitations (as reika said, you cant just make a 1 thousand blocks long structure as would be needed on real life, because no one would use the mod, absolutely NO ONE) but yet again, saying that a mod in minecraft is completely realistic, is a bit too much.

So, for reika, please, it is your mod, and as such, you are allowed to do whatever the hell you want to do with it, and im pretty sure everyone knows that, and if they don't accept it, then you shouldn't even reply, because thats called a waste of time. But also, when someone strikes down with an idea, for example, the interchangeability of 2 liquids, remember that you are dealing with a mod pack, and that stuff happens.. So just fix it when it comes out and say simply "Balance" because "Reality" is a word that shouldn't be mentioned in a game that has zombies, a game where you travel to another dimension with a dragon to get pitchblende, a game where you can make a fussion reactor out of some little blocks that float in the middle of nothing.

If we want IRL realism in minecraft, it would be impossible because of the engine limitation, if we want minecraft realism, then mechanical power would be a joke, because as we can see, the air in the atmosphere is so dense that blocks cannot fall, so having a machine rotating would be a ridiculous effort. Also, gravity in minecraft is different, almost everything in minecraft is different. So please, stop the realism banner, stop attacking the players because you think they are attacking you, I understand some of them are kind of aggresive, but a little more kindness from your part to the ones that actually respect you wouldn't be a bad thing. Please, don't take it in a bad way, you are a great mod developer and, as far as i know, the way you are always here, trying to improve things, is great! But you really need to work on your attitude, I may be wrong, and I hope I am, I really do.. But almost everytime I see your posts I feel like you reply from up the pony, if you know what I mean.. Come down with us, be kind with the community, its a nice shield you got there but you have a lot of supporters in the FTB community, so please, don't worry, even if some people want to take your mod out or whatever, there are a lot of people here who support you.

And some users i think may understand me: @Bruigaar and @midi_sec and @Furious1964 I've seen you guys are pretty good people, so this goes for you and I hope you dont take it bad.

And for the ones that start with the calculations and stuff, please.. Stop using wikipedia and remember this is MINECRAFT, and a mod made for minecraft may have its own balance ideals, you are always free to not use it if you dont like it, but making wikipedia excuses or talking about size is just nonsense, don't try to correct reactor craft reality with your own reality, because there is no reality at all, this is a GAME and reality parameters are not well established, no matter how you look or what you study, unless you have a nuclear whatever degree and plan to mod the whole game to make it behave like the normal world, then dont talk about realism and let the mod be what it is and what reika feels it is correct for it to be, if you don't like how he uses the word realism, then try to do what i do, imagine hes talking about minecraft realism or mod balance, pick your poison, but at the end of the day, the developer has the upper hand on what happens in the mod.

I hope no one gets offended, but all this conflict around a simple fact like this is getting boring and also it may cause some damage to the mod reputation itself, so lets give both parties a little bit of ourselves and try to look for a better way to communicate or debate about a mod, without walking over the other party opinion.

And btw, sorry for the wall of text. Also, if a moderator finds something in this post that thinks should be edited, please, tell me and I will.
 

Reika

RotaryCraft Dev
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Now.. Something to keep in mind, no one here is a nuclear scientist, so discussing about this as if we had absolute knowledge only because we spent some time on wikipedia, is nonsense. That goes for everyone. This is minecraft, not real life, and as such, it has its limitations (as reika said, you cant just make a 1 thousand blocks long structure as would be needed on real life, because no one would use the mod, absolutely NO ONE) but yet again, saying that a mod in minecraft is completely realistic, is a bit too much.
I never said it was completely, 100% realistic. Just "as realistic as is reasonably possible", which is the phrase I tend to use a lot. Some liberties need to be taken for various reasons, be it gameplay, code cleanliness, CPU performance, et cetera. However, such liberties are generally minor - such as rounding the power output from an engine from 58 to 65 kW - and not on the scale of "bees make jet fuel".

So, for reika, please, it is your mod, and as such, you are allowed to do whatever the hell you want to do with it, and im pretty sure everyone knows that, and if they don't accept it, then you shouldn't even reply, because thats called a waste of time.
I reply because the other person deserves to know why I do not wish to incorporate their idea. To simply ignore them or say "I don't like it" would be far more rude and derisive. Also, from experience, simply not responding would likely be interpreted as not seeing the suggestion and then they would repost it.

But also, when someone strikes down with an idea, for example, the interchangeability of 2 liquids, remember that you are dealing with a mod pack, and that stuff happens.. So just fix it when it comes out and say simply "Balance"
I did use the balance argument as well. It was simultaneously ineffective and upsetting to several people.

because "Reality" is a word that shouldn't be mentioned in a game that has zombies, a game where you travel to another dimension with a dragon to get pitchblende...blocks that float in the middle of nothing.
If we want IRL realism in minecraft, it would be impossible because of the engine limitation, if we want minecraft realism, then mechanical power would be a joke, because as we can see, the air in the atmosphere is so dense that blocks cannot fall, so having a machine rotating would be a ridiculous effort. Also, gravity in minecraft is different, almost everything in minecraft is different. So please, stop the realism banner.
... unless you ...plan to mod the whole game to make it behave like the normal world, then dont talk about realism and let the mod be what it is...
I never said I am making the vanilla game realistic, and I do not concern myself with its design. There is nothing wrong with a realistic mod inside an unrealistic game.
Also, the "blocks do not fall because of dense air" interpretation is an interesting one, though one that does not agree with some other behaviors in game.

...you can make a fussion reactor out of some little blocks...
The design of my fusion reactor is in fact very similar to those in real life, with the biggest differences being things I could not reproduce, like the vacuum chamber for the plasma.

But you really need to work on your attitude, I may be wrong, and I hope I am, I really do.. But almost everytime I see your posts I feel like you reply from up the pony, if you know what I mean..
No, I have no idea what you mean.

And for the ones that start with the calculations and stuff, please.. Stop using wikipedia and remember this is MINECRAFT, and a mod made for minecraft may have its own balance ideals, you are always free to not use it if you dont like it, but making wikipedia excuses or talking about size is just nonsense, don't try to correct reactor craft reality with your own reality, because there is no reality at all, this is a GAME and reality parameters are not well established
You are in fact completely incorrect here. All of the behavior in RotaryCraft and ReactorCraft is governed by real-world physical laws. If you wish, you can look at the code, and see formulae everywhere. Machines lose or gain heat according to the laws of heat conduction and convection. The hydrokinetic spins based on the kinetic energy of the falling water, calculated from its start point. Shafts fail due to real material strength limits. No to mention the fundmental "Power is the product of torque and speed" equation.
Math is everywhere in these two mods, so people using formulae to predict behavior are in fact doing it more right than 90% of the other players, and this is something I wish to encourage, not discourage.

As a final point, it seems that your main point is that you object to the idea of a realistic mod at all. You are of course entitled to whatever opinion you wish - and you would certainly not be alone on this one - but to complain when a mod tries to be realistic is rather strongly unappealing. It is akin to disliking the "research" side of existing magic mods and then going to the ThaumCraft page and complain that "people play MC to build, not look through GUIs". Or to complain to the BoP and BxL devs that "some of these biomes are trying to look like the real world, and that's silly for MC". Or to complain about the various electricity-based mods and how "minecraft does not have electricity".
 

Albin_Xavier

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Now I would rather not get in to this debate, but I no longer use rotarycraft because I have not found any practical uses for it that I don't use other mods for.
 

Wagon153

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Now I would rather not get in to this debate, but I no longer use rotarycraft because I have not found any practical uses for it that I don't use other mods for.
Steam engine+friction heater+vanilla furnace=free and fast furnace.
 

Reika

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Because I have an automated sieve, coal is practically free for me.
It is not the coal costs, but the ability to smelt a stack in a second.

And that is where RC is unequaled. With enough power, RC can be used to outperform most or all other mods in terms of throughput. Want 700 ore a second? Try 16-67MW into a borer. Want to multiply it by an average of 7x? Pump that through an extractor also receiving 67MW geared appropriately. 67MW into a friction heater and you complete the loop, producing over ten stacks of ingots a second.
And that is just resource acquisition; you can do the same with fluid transport, item transport, farming mobs, farming crops, cutting trees...

Plus, there are a lot of machines RC has that have no equivalents, things like the cave scanner.
 
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Pyure

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Now I would rather not get in to this debate, but I no longer use rotarycraft because I have not found any practical uses for it that I don't use other mods for.
How did we get so far off topic?

I still resurrect Reactor/Rotary mods every couple versions or so on my SSP; it has no place on my server however until optimization configs are added. Which will likely be never :\

To get your new steam liquid, any modder can create a block that can read, say, Reika's steam pipe, and output liquid steam of whatever ID. While I disagree with some of Reika's game design decisions (and deprecating attitude toward those who play his mods: o_O) the sole onus isn't on him to provide compatibility (his converters for RF/MJ/etc were a pleasant surprise)
 

YX33A

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Now I would rather not get in to this debate, but I no longer use rotarycraft because I have not found any practical uses for it that I don't use other mods for.
I hadn't thought about this beyond the early game applications, honestly. And looking deeper...
Yeah, hate to say it, but in RoC itself, I agree. Aside from the Shaft Power, and some of the serveying stuff.
Steam engine+friction heater+vanilla furnace=free and fast furnace.
Factorization did it first.
 
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Reika

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I still resurrect Reactor/Rotary mods every couple versions or so on my SSP; it has no place on my server however until optimization configs are added. Which will likely be never :\
What are "optimization configs"?

To get your new steam liquid, any modder can create a block that can read, say, Reika's steam pipe, and output liquid steam of whatever ID.
No, it is not that simple. Not to mention the extreme potential for balance problems that I would get blamed for. This is especially true since as soon as RC->Forge steam conversion exists, people are going to be demanding the other direction as well, and then you get 950MW (170k RF/t) out of a few railcraft boilers. And again, I will be the one blamed.

(and deprecating attitude toward those who play his mods: o_O)
???

the sole onus isn't on him to provide compatibility (his converters for RF/MJ/etc were a pleasant surprise)
I go out of my way to make it so that it is, because of the balance reason above.

Factorization did it first.
Not this fast.
Also, since when did one need to be the "first" to do anything? This actually reminds me of some things said on reddit last year when RC was first released, with people saying "parts of this mod has been done before, the modder is an idiot/thief". There seems to be a widespread - and very damaging - opinion that if you are not the first to do something, you should never try.
 
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Pyure

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What are "optimization configs"?
Ability to disable features that impair visual realism to free up resources. In many cases it requires a lot of extra code, and not as simple as "disabling" something, obviously.

Joke list because its Friday:
* remove_visual_things_that_save_merely_1%_resources_even_though_I_personally_hate_it: true
* version_of_reactors_without_30000_flying_steam_blocks_even_though_I_personally_hate_it: true

???
 

YX33A

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Not this fast.
Also, since when did one need to be the "first" to do anything? This actually reminds me of some things said on reddit last year when RC was first released, with people saying "parts of this mod has been done before, the modder is an idiot/thief". There seems to be a widespread - and very damaging - opinion that if you are not the first to do something, you should never try.
Not implying that you shouldn't bother adding things that others have done before; nor do I care how fast it runs in the end. Just was replying to @Wagon153 who was replying to @MarkusT about how MarkusT has no use for RoC since he has pretty much everything he needs or would use from RoC already from other mods. Including the Friction Heater giving us "free furnace fuel".
 

Reika

RotaryCraft Dev
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Ability to disable features that impair visual realism to free up resources. In many cases it requires a lot of extra code, and not as simple as "disabling" something, obviously.
Joke list because its Friday:
* remove_visual_things_that_save_merely_1%_resources_even_though_I_personally_hate_it: true
* version_of_reactors_without_30000_flying_steam_blocks_even_though_I_personally_hate_it: true
Those are fundamental rewrites, hardly something that could be done based on a config.
Also, have you tried v20? I cleaned up a lot of the power transfer code, improving framerates significantly.

You said I have a "deprecating" attitude towards players. I do not see why you feel that way.
If you think I have been rude or hostile here - that applies for anyone else, too - that is definitely not the intention.
 

YX33A

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You said I have a "deprecating" attitude towards players. I do not see why you feel that way.
If you think I have been rude or hostile here - that applies for anyone else, too - that is definitely not the intention.
And if you feel I'm being rude or hostile here, Reika, that is not my intent. But then again, to be fair, you see very defensive. Like, that last reply I got from you speaks volumes about how defensive you are; jumping into a conversation that didn't really involve you so much as your mod and accusing me of slander*.

*To me limited understanding of the term, anyway
 
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