I'm kind of a fan of ASP, but mainly due to the fact that making them is more interesting. IMO, CS is harder to progress in, and more balanced due to them not producing at night. On the plus side, CS production can be automated a lot easier.
Advanced Solar Panels vs Compact Solars
- Thread starter Aetherr_
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I'm not a big fan of solars, rarely ever use them. But if I could only go with one of those for EU, Advanced. They work in the night, and look way cooler.
Compact does not exist for the sake of players, though we do enjoy it.
It exists to remove the lag that 512 solar panels produces to a server.
Take a look at advanced solars.
Lowest recipe, for just advanced (equal to 8 solar) takes 2 uum. Anybody want to do the math on how long it takes for the UUM to be payed for, 8 EU at a time?
Next step up, hybrid. Takes iridium. Lets just call it 50. If this is equal to 8 advanced, it still costs more then 8 times. Payback is going to be longer.
Ultimate? ... 20 days of non stop running.
If the time to return is longer then the total amount of time a person will play, and enough people know it, these are not going to be used.
This means a return to people using hundreds of the classic solar.
This means a return to massive system lag.
This will not end the discussion of such things, arguments will continue until the heat death of the mine-verse.
I just felt I had to try logic in this situation.
It exists to remove the lag that 512 solar panels produces to a server.
Take a look at advanced solars.
Lowest recipe, for just advanced (equal to 8 solar) takes 2 uum. Anybody want to do the math on how long it takes for the UUM to be payed for, 8 EU at a time?
Next step up, hybrid. Takes iridium. Lets just call it 50. If this is equal to 8 advanced, it still costs more then 8 times. Payback is going to be longer.
Ultimate? ... 20 days of non stop running.
If the time to return is longer then the total amount of time a person will play, and enough people know it, these are not going to be used.
This means a return to people using hundreds of the classic solar.
This means a return to massive system lag.
This will not end the discussion of such things, arguments will continue until the heat death of the mine-verse.
I just felt I had to try logic in this situation.
Which is why folks want multiblock solar structures, so they have have the space-usification without the lag, I think.
You both undermined your own point of view and described the balancing component of solar panels.
They are expensive for what they do, but eventually they can provide a significant amount of maintenance free power.
Instead of other power methods that get you started for cheap but extract their cost over time in fuel, solar panels extract their cost up front and then give you the goods. You end up paying one way or the other. Like most things in life, if you can discipline yourself to pay up front and collect the rewards at a later date, you'll end up a little ahead of the guy who chose to pay/collect the whole way through.
As for which is 'best', Advanced Solar Panels provide reduced power generation at night/during storms and have an internal storage buffer. Compact Solar Panels are very easy to make with automated production which eliminates the tedious factor of their mechanics. It's just a function of which you prefer.[DOUBLEPOST=1366175514][/DOUBLEPOST]
It makes no real sense to me to volunteer to have more space taken up to achieve the same end. It's Minecraft, with a functionally limitless world. Requiring more space is not a balancing component.
I have to disagree. I've already posted a picture of a REAL 512Eu/t solar array. It takes two chuncks and it is not as portable as 512 Eu/t solar from any mod. I used a turtle in semi-manual mode to build it even in creative. It's not the thing you can easily plop down and get infinite power. Those arrays more like creative-generators. They are easy to move. Easy to set up The only disadvantage they have - is the requirement of open space and daytime. There's no any system or build behind them. They're just magic blocks that produce insane amounts of power.
Here is the link to my thoughts about this as well as the picture: Advanced Solar Panel Crafting!!
I don't know why people find the thought of superior materials creating superior machines so absurd.
Do I think that a solar panel could realistically generate 512 times as much power even through technological increases? Probably not. That one seems a little absurd.
However, solar panels have the potential to generate more energy with the same amount of space simply by upgrading the materials used in its creation, or the interior design of the panel itself. You could use panels that absorbed more light and reflected less, thus generating more energy, and you could also improve how the light that was absorbed was turned into electricity. Any of these would improve the amount of energy produced without requiring any additional space; thus, the idea behind ASP. Admittedly there have been very few technological improvements to solar panels since solar cells were invented... but, a lot of what we do in FTB is speculative to begin with.
Sure, solar panels would require regular maintenance. So would Steam Boilers, Thermal generators, engines, etc. Especially engines, actually. The likeliness of one engine out of 40+ breaking down at any given point is extremely high. Maintenance wasn't required of them in the game because this isn't Life 2.0.
Do I think that a solar panel could realistically generate 512 times as much power even through technological increases? Probably not. That one seems a little absurd.
However, solar panels have the potential to generate more energy with the same amount of space simply by upgrading the materials used in its creation, or the interior design of the panel itself. You could use panels that absorbed more light and reflected less, thus generating more energy, and you could also improve how the light that was absorbed was turned into electricity. Any of these would improve the amount of energy produced without requiring any additional space; thus, the idea behind ASP. Admittedly there have been very few technological improvements to solar panels since solar cells were invented... but, a lot of what we do in FTB is speculative to begin with.
Sure, solar panels would require regular maintenance. So would Steam Boilers, Thermal generators, engines, etc. Especially engines, actually. The likeliness of one engine out of 40+ breaking down at any given point is extremely high. Maintenance wasn't required of them in the game because this isn't Life 2.0.
I like the idea of solars that are a bit more efficient but made of more expensive materials. But doesn't that Ultimate Hybrid Solar come with Advanced solars as well? And I doubt that 64 Eu/t solar is also a good Idea.
Yes, the hybrid and ultimate hybrid panels are both with ASP.
And yeah, maybe even the 64 eu/t is a little realistically unsound. At the same time, though... I don't mind. It allows me to trade my time and effort from getting new items for an improved, no-maintenance power source. Personally, I need a power source like that. I consider a power generating system that puts out less than 1000~ eu/t to be impractical for running a GT base. That's my view on it, anyways.
I love whonky power generating alternatives, but most of them are wildly impractical for generating large amounts of power. In fact, most power systems in general are wildly impractical for the amount of power I like to have in my base. Advanced Solar Panels and Fusion Reactors are really all I have for that.
Well now that I'm making EU at a rapid pace (thanks, steamboiler and endereyedust) I might try out Advanced Solars...
Who cares if they're portable? That's not even a concern. You're doing some wonky things in your world if it matters that a solar panel is portable. With all the mods and machines and blocks that let us transmit energy anywhere we want it, portable solar panels is fully irrelevant to the discussion. You're conveniently overlooking the disadvantage of up-front material cost and time to produce. There are also a lot of things in MC today that are "magic" because the alternative is lag. Lagging the shit out of your sever in the name of "realism" is a pretty dumb way to do things. Multi-block structures aren't a solution. They're a cosmetic bandaid. People picked it as a cause back when packs like this were in their infancy and we didn't have so many mods working with one another to do what solar panels do or better. Need EU? I can think of faster and cheaper ways to set up abundant EU generation than solar panels, and the only 'maintenance' required is moving a quarry in the nether every few weeks. Need MJ? Identical setup, just magmatic engines instead of geothermal generators. Same maintenance, too. So why aren't you fixed on that as something that's 'magic'. Because it's not portable?
Solar panels are fine. It helps if people stay with developments in the genre and not use old arguments on new situations.
One cubic meter solar producing more than a MK1 nuclear reactor? MAN! I wish we had THAT technology IRL! I mean... our sun would have to be a super-nova to produce that much light and we'd probably be scorched to bits which would make the technological advancement moot, but damn, it'd still be nice.
But yeah, IC is missing mid tier power generaton, I keep saying that, but people are always like: but solars!
But yeah, IC is missing mid tier power generaton, I keep saying that, but people are always like: but solars!
Personally, I think that's backwards.
That Nuclear Reactor should be producing a LOT more energy than it currently is in my opinion. Solars shouldn't compete at all with it.
Of course, I think a big problem is that some people play with GT, and some don't. Those who don't play with GT will not need nearly as much power as those that do. Naturally, many power sources weren't made with GT in mind, so in light of things like the Matter Fabricator... they look kind of weak.
I'm of the opinion that ASP was at least partially developed with GT in mind, because I can see no other reason for the existence of the Ultimate Hybrid panel.
OK, portability is not that important, yes. But saying that one-block solar is exactly the same as the setup that takes two chunks of space is a bit unfair.
And are you saying that multiblocks don't reduce lag? I'm not sure about that, but I don't know technical details.
Also, I'm not "fixed" on anything I'm just explaining what I think about solars and solar plants
And I don't use lava method too. At least for now. This is the topic about solars. Am I not allowed to post my opinion here?
And are you saying that multiblocks don't reduce lag? I'm not sure about that, but I don't know technical details.
Also, I'm not "fixed" on anything I'm just explaining what I think about solars and solar plants
And I don't use lava method too. At least for now. This is the topic about solars. Am I not allowed to post my opinion here?