Regarding tesseracts: does anyone else think this is silly?

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Saice

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Jul 29, 2019
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Locks? I seem to have a hole in my knowledge.

Yes use a diamon on the lactch like you would the three numbs on top turns the endechest into a privte one.

Some cavets. Basicly it is a 'forth color' selection using your username as its setting. That said if someone was to get this chest it would allow access to your privete network since it does not check who opens the chest but who made the chest when linking to inventories.
 

King Lemming

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Jul 29, 2019
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Just to make sure everyone is on the same page before suggestions get out of hand:

We're not adding an Energy cost to Item and Liquid Tesseracts unless we end up adding some sort of improved functionality to them. Chunk loading, as an example.
 

Revemohl

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Jul 29, 2019
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Don't forget that Ender Tanks are already a thing as well. Maybe not in the current FTB packs, but they're already out.
 

Saice

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Just to make sure everyone is on the same page before suggestions get out of hand:

We're not adding an Energy cost to Item and Liquid Tesseracts unless we end up adding some sort of improved functionality to them. Chunk loading, as an example.

Don't worry just becuase we chat around about ideas or points of view does not mean anyone has an issue with the mod.

You just keep being awesome
 

KirinDave

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Jul 29, 2019
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I am sure everyone will feel really good about game balance when they make physical tesseracts less useful than Ender Chests (they're already more expensive and harder to make) and then everyone stops using them. We can all high-5 and go back to shying away from novelty.
 

Guswut

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Jul 29, 2019
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Going by e = mc^2, there's some truth to this. However, the simple fact is that liquid can be contained in a bottle, while energy (heat) will eventually leak out and equalize with the surroundings. Same principle applies here. Matter which is bound in a non-energy form will move through without issue. With energy, you are transmitting motion. It's not as tightly bound, and hence - you lose some.

Now, please don't forget but we are talking about MineCraft, a video game. I can store a fully charged RE-battery until I forget that I even have it stored, and when I find it four weeks later it will not have lost ANY charge at all.

I'm assuming, given the name, that your back story is that they are moving through a fourth spacial dimension, so while it is not exactly teleporting items/liquids/energy, it surely works just like a teleportation pipe.

And, of course, it is your mod, so you're free to do whatever you want to it. And you've done a damn good job, especially as you give us the config option to say "You know what, King Lemming, I disagree with you. Energy tesseracts should be free like birds, flowers, and bad advice about dating from your single friends." and change it.

Oh, question: You are checking for values between 0 and 100, right? If I have the time tonight, I'm going to change it to -100 and see if I can double my energy.


No, it is not. When you're talking about remote, compact builds - the Energy Tesseract affords you a HUGE convenience in space alone. That cannot be understated.

Sure it can, and it is actually because of another aspect to your mod that it can: Redstone energy cells can be moved by turtles. With some VERY basic LUA scripting, you can set up a turtle to grab a cell and put it in one ender chest, and then grab a new cell from another ender chest. If you have access to buildcraft gates, you can even get him to detect the state of the cell (empty energy store -> redstone signal, and then run a wire next to the turtle) instead of just timing it.

By doing so, which means three blocks, four if you count the redstone energy cell, and six if you count the redstone wire (RP2 jacketed wire works well) and buildcraft gate (on a pipe), and you beat your energy tax using a pre-existing system (again, thank you for those redstone energy cells. They are divine).

If a difference of a few spaces of blocks is really that important to you, or you are unable to do even basic LUA programming, then you get hit with the tesseract energy tax. After trying to convince people otherwise, and failing, I have come to accept that there are just going to be a lot of lazy people that don't mind being taxed for the slight (yes, slight. After the legwork, redstone energy cell moving turtles are not that much more complicated) bonus to space and ease of use you get with tesseracts.

At 100 MJ/t, and assuming you are using combustion engines, you are replacing nearly 50 blocks with a single block at a remote location. The extreme convenience of this warrants the penalty. Being able to centralize your power generation and then distribute it so easily is absurdly powerful, and 25% is probably even too low.

It's 25% too high for someone that has a better way. But yeah, it should be higher, maybe 75%, so people will be much more likely to give redstone energy cell moving turtles a chance. Getting people interesting in programming (even if it is LUA) is always a good thing.



I am sure everyone will feel really good about game balance when they make physical tesseracts less useful than Ender Chests (they're already more expensive and harder to make) and then everyone stops using them. We can all high-5 and go back to shying away from novelty.


Heck, that'd be horrible. I was wondering if anyone would say "Yeah, let's make item/liquid tesseracts require 25% off the top, too!" so I could turn around and yell at them. The balance should be removing the energy taxation (yes, I know this can be done in the config file), but King Lemming seems to believe otherwise. At least he has given us a way to change that ourselves if we want, and a way around that to those of us that can program.
 
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DoctorOr

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Jul 29, 2019
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But liquids are energy. I don't see why they wouldn't have a loss.

Not all liquids are energy. Perhaps tesseracts should randomly delete 25% of the items you pass through it as well.

It could even be a config option "B:transport.teleport.super_derp_mode=true"
 

Guswut

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Jul 29, 2019
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Not all liquids are energy. Perhaps tesseracts should randomly delete 25% of the items you pass through it as well.

It could even be a config option "B:transport.teleport.super_derp_mode=true"

Hahah, "super_derp_mode" would be a create mode to have enabled with hardcore bees, and hard mode GregTech. It should make redstone conduit explode randomly, and cobblestone generators require one water and one lava bucket per cobblestone.
 

Antice

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Jul 29, 2019
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Hahah, "super_derp_mode" would be a create mode to have enabled with hardcore bees, and hard mode GregTech. It should make redstone conduit explode randomly, and cobblestone generators require one water and one lava bucket per cobblestone.


hmm... as one of those players that are masochistic enough to actually play with TE turned all the way to insane i kinda resent that remark, but then again not. I don't use cobble-gens for my cobble either. Real men rape entire worlds for their cobble instead.
Not using a convenience like cobblegen makes the whole storage management thing a bit more challenging, since you now have to deal with actually feeding all your factory lines with low value stuff from storage rather than just make sand/cobble/stone on demand by just adding a machine or 2 to your factory line.

I also use redpower as much as possible for item management. making things space efficient is not a primary concern of mine tbh. I prefer making it look cool instead.
 

Guswut

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Jul 29, 2019
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hmm... as one of those players that are masochistic enough to actually play with TE turned all the way to insane i kinda resent represent that remark, but then again not.

Fix'd! Hahah. And wait, TE has an insane difficulty level? How the heck do you enable that? I'd love to increase the difficulty of most of the mods that MindCrack decided to not increase (likely through ignorance).

I don't use cobble-gens for my cobble either. Real men rape entire worlds for their cobble instead.
Not using a convenience like cobblegen makes the whole storage management thing a bit more challenging, since you now have to deal with actually feeding all your factory lines with low value stuff from storage rather than just make sand/cobble/stone on demand by just adding a machine or 2 to your factory line.

I'd say cobblestone generation, be it through TE's dedicated machine, or a RP blockbreaker and piston-based version, is a technological upgrade and shunning it because of some sort of absurdity is, well, absurd. That said, I don't have any cobblestone generators set up, either, as I quarry enough that I usually have more cobblestone inbound than I'd often like. I just scrap the vast majority of it now that I have 2048 stacks in my system. At least, until I decide I want sixteen full extradimensional barrels in my system, "just in case I ever want to be able to use a million cobble, you know?".

I also use redpower as much as possible for item management. making things space efficient is not a primary concern of mine tbh. I prefer making it look cool instead.

Agreed, space efficiency is not normally a concern of mine as I've got MystCraft installed, so I've offloaded my space requirements through a few ages. Even sans mystcraft, though, I normally just build large spaces to work with as trying to compact things can be fun, and look awesome, but it is really an optimizationists game then.
 

noskk

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Jul 29, 2019
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hmm... as one of those players that are masochistic enough to actually play with TE turned all the way to insane i kinda resent that remark, but then again not. I don't use cobble-gens for my cobble either. Real men rape entire worlds for their cobble instead.

Do you mean the steel for machine frame, gear instead of ingot and 2 additional diamonds for pulverizer and induction smelter? or do you increase the energy loss of energy conduit and tesseract?
 

Antice

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Jul 29, 2019
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Do you mean the steel for machine frame, gear instead of ingot and 2 additional diamonds for pulverizer and induction smelter? or do you increase the energy loss of energy conduit and tesseract?
25% energy loss is irrelevant for me. I don't use energy teleportation at all. I just like the look of engines next to my quarries.
Railcraft takes care of item transport between facilities... I just want the cool way of doing it rather than the "efficient" one. (it's not a rule i play by strictly speaking, but a style preference. I don't consider it cheaty or OP. just boring.

So yeah. Steal for machineframes and that kind of thing to make TE a bit harder.
Ironically this makes IC2 easier than TE again. I'l still use the pulverizer in some builds tho. for making sand and other slow but steady block conversion setups. also it can make cracked stone bricks. got to have that.

other aspects of the TE mod i love. Like the liqueducts and accumulator.
 

noskk

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Jul 29, 2019
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Yep, but steel for machine frame makes it more balance in a way since TE machines are very powerful.
 

whythisname

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Jul 29, 2019
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The problem with transporting liquids is (like DoctorOr said) not all liquids are energy (water for example, which you could tesseract for use in the Nether for example). But also, if it costs more energy to tesseract a fuel than it can produce on site it's not viable either (ie, it costs 10MJ to transport 5MJ worth of fuel...).

You could of course put an energy tesseract next to your liquid ones to provide power, but doing that would only make sense if you need to transport the liquid for anything except power (ie, you transport Seed oil not for burning as fuel, but to create Apiaries/frames/Alveries/etc.). If you transport liquid for power and you need an energy tesseract to do it you might as well just use the energy tesseract and lose the liquid one.

The same thing applies to items and solid fuels, though there are of course a lot more items that you can/want to transport that aren't fuel. For example all the stuff that comes out of a quarry is well worth "paying" energy for to get it to your base.

Just to make sure everyone is on the same page before suggestions get out of hand:

We're not adding an Energy cost to Item and Liquid Tesseracts unless we end up adding some sort of improved functionality to them. Chunk loading, as an example.

Glad to hear that :)
 

Golrith

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If Tesseracts gain chunkloading, I'd suggest that they are a MkII version that is crafted using the normal Tesseract with 8 other materials/components. Definately Shiny Ingots, Blaze Rods and Ender Pearls (or Eye's of Enders for extra cost) at least.
 

Greevir

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Jul 29, 2019
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I seriously hope tesseracts don't get chunkloading.... it'll just be another item that I'd have to ban from the server... and I like my tesseracts... Unless of course you add an option to disable the chunkloading.
 

Lambert2191

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Jul 29, 2019
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I seriously hope tesseracts don't get chunkloading.... it'll just be another item that I'd have to ban from the server... and I like my tesseracts... Unless of course you add an option to disable the chunkloading.
Or upgrading them to be chunkloading. So tesseracts as they are stay the same, and there is a more expensive chunkloading tesseract also.
 
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MrZwij

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Jul 29, 2019
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The original implementation of tesseracts is better than any of the suggestions I've seen here. Just leave it alone, please. :)
 
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