Keeping mods updated

[Unit88]

WUT?

Ummm... no. Attempting to rely on a USER to do something intelligent is the antithesis of good programming. Furthermore, it is the pack dev's job to do this, not the end user. The whole point of a mod pack is to let someone ELSE take care of these incompatibilities so you don't HAVE to. Half the time, the reason a pack has decided to not update is specifically to AVOID these complications because he knows there will be a problem. Why bother pestering you with a mod update that will crash you?

I think you're misunderstood. I'm talking about keeping up with individual mods. In modpacks it's of course the devs' job to figure out incompatibilities, but if someone wants to do what I do, namely, grab random mods off the net and install them, then the user is the one who has to deal with it.

Why notify the user of an update that can crash him? That is a Bad Idea, from the mod dev's position, from the pack dev's position, and from the poor sucker of an end-user's perspective who suddenly got himself crashed with no notion of how or why. This causes a flurry of ill-defined bug reports to angrily swarm around the dev who is probably either already aware of the problem or needs something like an actual log post to figure out what is going on, which helps nobody and frustrates the people actually creating the stuff the end user enjoys. This has caused more than one dev to quit, and probably will continue to be a major source of headaches sufficient to cause other devs to walk away from it.

Obviously if something were to update mods it would be beneficial to ask the user if they actually want to update.

So wait... a full-up searchable real-time database of every single one of the hundreds of mods out there and what version they are on and the ability to tell you when one of your mods is outdated compared to its list is simple Really?

Ummm... I'm not really sure how to respond to that. All I can say is that my experience would disagree with you in the most profound and fundamental way.

Just keeping the versions up to date and keeping those two variables (name of mod and version of mod) current and searchable would be non-trivial. Trying to make some kind of cross-mod compatibility checker is just... flat impossible. Seriously.

I'm wondering how exactly it is complicated for each mod to keep a variable for the version one for the name and a list of mods it's not compatible with. You say it's non-trivial, and that your experience disagrees, but that says nothing. I'm barely a beginner in coding and databases (using Access from Microsoft Office), but it doesn't seem anything difficult, so please elaborate, so I can see why.

I use the Curse Client right now.. it notifies me when mods update.. I click the mod click the changelog tab read it.. install and run. If it works I move onto the next mod in the list. Super easy if you use CurseForge mods only.

I actually downloaded it yesterday, because I remembered that there was some kind of curse launcher, but I only saw modpacks, just like in FTB. Can you tell me where can I find the individual mods. Or is it through the CurseForge site?

 

[Hambeau]

You don't even have to go to the EnderIO Mek8 issues - going from Mek 7 to Mek 8 alone is a whole nest full of wasps.

And this is why it's not been done, probably never will be done and why mod pack makers (myself inc) would never use an automated update system like the one you are suggesting.

I'm going out on a limb here and predicting that MCPE, with the introduction of "MineCraft for Win10" next week will eventually include a version manager of some type, for the following reasons:

1). MCPE is currently multi-platform (Xbox, Playstation, Android, etc. and soon to include PC) all based on the same C++ code although there is no cross platform interaction yet. Microsoft said in their announcement that "MCW10" will be multiplayer connecting up to 7 PC/XBox systems, with connecting tothe other consoles to follow soon(tm). To me this implies at least a networking API to allow different development houses to write compatible code.

2). MCPE for XBox is supposed to be being updated at the same time as the MCW10 release, adding features to make the versions identical. This makes sense, since Microsoft controls both codebases and are most likely written in Visual C++, which has built-in version control if you opt to use it. I'm guessing the changes will propagate to the other development houses soon.

3). Once all the existing MCPE versions are identical across the platforms the codebase will be much easier to manage and update. The Team tools in VS will be able to make sure all the developers are using the same versions of libraries to keep things working. After the versions match I can see Apple and Linux versions coming as VS2015 will be available on Mac and Linux/Android.

4). There are already mods for MCPE, although I've not been moved to look any up. Microsoft has said that one of their main goals is to keep the modding community alive and there has been talk of an API... LexManos mentioned he was being "followed around by Microsoft engineers" during a MineCon panel. Another of MS' main goals is to interest kids in programming via Minecraft, and to do so using Visual Studio. When modding becomes "real" for MCPE I think a suggested environment will be Visual Studio Community, which includes most of the features of the Enterprise version, except it's a free download (need to create a free MSDN account) for individuals, Students and small companies. They could maintain a version control server accessible by the public. Voila, version documentation and control.

 

[Hambeau]

I think you're misunderstood. I'm talking about keeping up with individual mods. In modpacks it's of course the devs' job to figure out incompatibilities, but if someone wants to do what I do, namely, grab random mods off the net and install them, then the user is the one who has to deal with it.

Agreed.

Obviously if something were to update mods it would be beneficial to ask the user if they actually want to update.

Agreed.

I'm wondering how exactly it is complicated for each mod to keep a variable for the version one for the name and a list of mods it's not compatible with. You say it's non-trivial, and that your experience disagrees, but that says nothing. I'm barely a beginner in coding and databases (using Access from Microsoft Office), but it doesn't seem anything difficult, so please elaborate, so I can see why.

Having known many professional programmers in my 40 year career. I can say that maybe 5% actually document their code well, another 10% or so think you should figure it out reading their code and the rest "get by". In the last part of the 80's I worked for a Kodak subsidiary in the R&D lab. In addition to the electronic prototyping and testing I was hired to do I also became the in-house PC support/Novell Admin and the Sun troubleshooter/Net Admin.

One of our duties in the lab was version control. The second quickest way for a technician to irritate an engineer is to ask questions to get the new file(s) properly documented for the Archival System. The first is to point out their mistakes and prove them to the boss, but that's another story

The programmers I have known were paid professionals. While some Mods fit that description, the majority are hobbyists and maybe don't fully understand the background purposes of version control, beyond "I made a change, it's a new version!". Now you want them to spend more of their free time making sure their mod works with all the others out there? That's what FtB is for

I actually downloaded it yesterday, because I remembered that there was some kind of curse launcher, but I only saw modpacks, just like in FTB. Can you tell me where can I find the individual mods. Or is it through the CurseForge site?

It's simple... Hold your mouse over the "Install Modpack" icon. Click the "Custom Profile" highlight.

Name your Profile, select the Vanilla MC version to use and then the Forge version. (I created a Vanilla profile selecting just a name, MC version and "none" in the Forge dropbox).

This will download the desired MC instance and Forge loader, then change to the screen that shows installed mods. in the upper middle of the window is a button labelled "Get More Content". Click this.

There is now a screen showing available content. By default it shows "Resource Packs" first. There are tabs just above this, with the second being "Maps", followed by "Mods". Select "Mods" and start browsing. When you see a mod you want move your mouse over it's Icon on the left. An "Install" button appears. Click it. Rinse and repeat.

 

[Unit88]

Having known many professional programmers in my 40 year career. I can say that maybe 5% actually document their code well, another 10% or so think you should figure it out reading their code and the rest "get by". In the last part of the 80's I worked for a Kodak subsidiary in the R&D lab. In addition to the electronic prototyping and testing I was hired to do I also became the in-house PC support/Novell Admin and the Sun troubleshooter/Net Admin.

One of our duties in the lab was version control. The second quickest way for a technician to irritate an engineer is to ask questions to get the new file(s) properly documented for the Archival System. The first is to point out their mistakes and prove them to the boss, but that's another story

The programmers I have known were paid professionals. While some Mods fit that description, the majority are hobbyists and maybe don't fully understand the background purposes of version control, beyond "I made a change, it's a new version!". Now you want them to spend more of their free time making sure their mod works with all the others out there? That's what FtB is for

The only documentation I was interested in is basically the version number, that's why it seems to me like it'd be simple. The devs don't have to make sure their mods work with others, it's just that a lot of times they're aware that there are incompatibilities and they do mention it wherever it's posted, that's what I thought could be included in the database thing.

It's simple... Hold your mouse over the "Install Modpack" icon. Click the "Custom Profile" highlight.

Name your Profile, select the Vanilla MC version to use and then the Forge version. (I created a Vanilla profile selecting just a name, MC version and "none" in the Forge dropbox).

This will download the desired MC instance and Forge loader, then change to the screen that shows installed mods. in the upper middle of the window is a button labelled "Get More Content". Click this.

There is now a screen showing available content. By default it shows "Resource Packs" first. There are tabs just above this, with the second being "Maps", followed by "Mods". Select "Mods" and start browsing. When you see a mod you want move your mouse over it's Icon on the left. An "Install" button appears. Click it. Rinse and repeat.

Thanks, this made it clear. I thought custom profile meant the same thing as in the vanilla MC launcher I guess this is as close as I can get to what I want currently. It may even be exactly what I want, but I need to get to playing to figure that out