In your next Direwolf20 build, will you bother with IC2?

[KirinDave]

Firstly, let's please not devolve into a macerator vs. pulverizer argument again. Please. That said, onward:

Direwolf20's pack seems to be slowly but surely drifting away from needing IC2. The big benefit of that tech tree used to be that it had flat out superior armor, tools and energy storagr. But now MFFS works on MJ, Thermal Expansion has given us lots more ways to generate, store, and move power. We also have Modular Powersuits which on the next DW20 pack update will not only have flight equal to a gravity suit (it's already nearly as good, it just needs the Flight Control) but a MJ-compatible power system and TE-based recipes.

It seems like in DW20 once that update gets pushed, IC2 will be firmly an odd-man out in the pack:

1. Thaumcraft gives great tools, weapons and armor that work well with enchants. Its ore detector is different from IC2's but arguably a lot more useful, the mining laser is closely matched by the Wand of Excavation and Wand of Equal Trade, and investing in that tree also gives you really powerful automation tools.
2. Modular Powersuits gives a Gravity Suit competitor (that also has early-game options similar to or superior to the jetpacks) that takes less extreme resources (but a lot more mundane resources) and a pretty amazing tool. Please note, these can be book enchanted, and the author knows about this and doesn't seem to mind. If you can get haste onto your MPS boots they are incredibly good.
3. Steves Carts and Buildcraft give really amazing auto-mining options. Thaumcraft has one that is unique and powerful (though very, very expensive) as well. The mining well and OD/OV Detector seem somewhat anemic by comparison.
4. TE and Railcraft give amazing power generation and storage options.

Am I missing something? At this point it seems like the only really neat thing IC2 offers is cheap, explosion resistant building materials and very convenient tools for making complex structures. Its autominer is nice, but not super necessary. The IC2 machines can be faster but they're obviously not "necessary". What's left for it in the DW20 pack?

 

[nethervvoid]

I'll probably still use it for the tools since it's much easier to recharge a tool than to recreate it (e.g. thaum tools). The armor was never that important to me since even vanilla armor with enchants is OP. I'll still also use it for the macerator and induction furnace due to their speed vs the thermal expansion equivalents. If TE introduced a second tier of processor with options to increase speed I'd probably convert. For most other things I don't use IC2.

 

[hergy7]

That is because IC2 is outdated as a mod in general. The reason GreTeche exists at all is because IC2 is outdated and imbalanced, when was the last meaningful content patch for IC2? It was before most people starting with IC2.

 

[nethervvoid]

BTW why would someone want to get rid of a mod entirely? Did the dev piss some people off?

 

[Guswut]

BTW why would someone want to get rid of a mod entirely? Did the dev piss some people off?

If there are mods that do things better than everything that this mod does, it only makes sense to "trim the fat" as it were. It is also an extremely zealotish topic regarding MJ versus EU.

I use MindCrack, so I don't have any consideration to this topic at all. Besides that, though, if I did not need IC2 because of GregTech, I'd likely still keep it as I like the electric jetpack as it is fairly cheap to get at the start. I've yet to really play around with Modular Powersuits, but I will likely add that to my server when FTB next updates MindCrack (and assuming they don't add it themselves).

 

[Hydra]

BTW why would someone want to get rid of a mod entirely? Did the dev piss some people off?

Well their arrogance on their forums annoy me but I currently only use IC2 for the gravichest, quantumsuit and vajra. All the rest of my sorting / production systems are BC/RC/Forestry/TE based.

For me the problem is that the power system IC2 uses is cumbersome and doesn't really make much sense. Add to that that there is no clear progression in power usage / generation. Your startup method of power generation (geothermals fed with nether lava) is actually the 'best' solution. Unless you want to go full-cheese and go for a 512eu/t solar.

 

[KirinDave]

I'll probably still use it for the tools since it's much easier to recharge a tool than to recreate it (e.g. thaum tools).

The MPS multitool is as good as any drill out there, although a tiny bit more expensive. The Thaum tools can get repair, which actually makes them lower maintenance than any of the existing tools. They also are much easier to enchant (books still work, but they can get multiples on the table).

The armor was never that important to me since even vanilla armor with enchants is OP.

Yeah, but the mobility options paire with the armor are what bring IC2 over the top. A quantum suit lets you leap and run around like a superhero. A gravity suit lets you fly like creative (and faster). The right combination of MPS modules lets you actually exceed the speed of both, or trade speed for 0 power consumption. When we get the next mps update it'll also have GS-style hovering.

I'll still also use it for the macerator and induction furnace due to their speed vs the thermal expansion equivalents.

I've watched some of your videos so I'm curious where the speed actually matters to you? Like when you're in a workshop craftin' something up? Because short of working over coal or refined iron I realized I actually seldom have this need, except for the rare batch of electrum.

 

[BlackFire]

For the shear speed of it. The pulverizer, the only other way to double ore output, can't keep up with fast quarries or frame quarries. Half of the speed is due to the advanced machines addon, but still, faster is better.

 

[KirinDave]

If there are mods that do things better than everything that this mod does, it only makes sense to "trim the fat" as it were. It is also an extremely zealotish topic regarding MJ versus EU.

I definitely don't want to talk about that here. It's more an observation that IC2 is increasingly becoming a very specialized niche in the modpack.

I've yet to really play around with Modular Powersuits, but I will likely add that to my server when FTB next updates MindCrack (and assuming they don't add it themselves).

I wonder if MPS capabilities and features would make a good thread on its own. I definitely found some interesting combinations. I sort of want to start a from-scratch world with the newest version of it to see what the very early progression is like, because if you can get an emerald early on it seems like a very clever path.

 

[zilvarwolf]

Given the choice, no, I remove IC2 and everything related.

I tried it, I played it, I liked it. I like TE better. I like the machines, I like the power system, and I very, very, very much like the output mechanics and customization. If modular powersuits are coming along that well, an IC-less game something I really look forward to.

 

[KirinDave]

For the shear speed of it. The pulverizer, the only other way to double ore output, can't keep up with fast quarries or frame quarries. Half of the speed is due to the advanced machines addon, but still, faster is better.

This is not the conversation. There is a whole thread for that topic.

 

[BlackFire]

This is not the conversation. There is a whole thread for that topic.

This isn't about the debate between the two. This is about ore processing.

Edit: if there was another mod that is in the game that can process the ore, please let me know.

 

[Guswut]

I definitely don't want to talk about that here. It's more an observation that IC2 is increasingly becoming a very specialized niche in the modpack.

Agreed on the first point, and in that regard I'm not touching the second point, heh heh.

I wonder if MPS capabilities and features would make a good thread on its own. I definitely found some interesting combinations. I sort of want to start a from-scratch world with the newest version of it to see what the very early progression is like, because if you can get an emerald early on it seems like a very clever path.

Yeah, I may actually do that, or at least watch someone's Let's Play (hint hint?) that does that, as it would be really interesting to see. And MPS should be EXTREMELY powerful, and (if they haven't already) if they add an API it should be easy enough to add addons for it to make custom modules. For example, a barrel upgrade that could allow you to store sixty-four stacks of items in a special barrel slot, a portal gun upgrade that would give you a portal gun socket where you put a portal gun, and can then use it without needing to keep it on your hotbar, and any number of other cross-mod upgrades.

 

[raiju]

If there are mods that do things better than everything that this mod does, it only makes sense to "trim the fat" as it were. It is also an extremely zealotish topic regarding MJ versus EU.

I use MindCrack, so I don't have any consideration to this topic at all. Besides that, though, if I did not need IC2 because of GregTech, I'd likely still keep it as I like the electric jetpack as it is fairly cheap to get at the start. I've yet to really play around with Modular Powersuits, but I will likely add that to my server when FTB next updates MindCrack (and assuming they don't add it themselves).

I'm also a mindcrack player so wasn't planning on commenting (next pack I change to will be ultimate most likely), but IC2 offers some things really. Modular Powersuits look to be a semi-replacement for quantum (I haven't played with it first hand either so I am not sure on how well it measures up to quantum legs/helmet/gravichest), but jetpacks and mining lasers never really get replaced for me.

 

[DoctorOr]

Edit: if there was another mod that is in the game that can process the ore, please let me know.

Factorization gives the best non-GT output, but then again anybody staring and watching machines as they work isn't going to like it.

 

[KirinDave]

Modular Powersuits look to be a semi-replacement for quantum (I haven't played with it first hand either so I am not sure on how well it measures up to quantum legs/helmet/gravichest)

Let me do the qsuit breakdown:

1. Helmet: Currently nothing replaces the most powerful feature of the quantum: 0 status effects. Evidently some people feel that's OP. It does have underwater breathing and some superior utility options (thaumcraft hud, newest version has night vision).
2. Body: With the current version in DW20, the body is better in every way to a jetpack and can become something with the armor of a q-suit and powered and unpowered flight. It's gravity suit good when paired with boot jets. It costs more "common" (non-iridium) resources to make the full replacement.
3. Legs: Comparable with quantum. Can give more bonuses (and store power), but max jump assist height is 5 blocks (the Qboots give this effect). The sprint assist is just as good and can ignore your food level. It does offer the step assist which is like the Boots of the Traveller effect.
4. Boots: The fall damage negation is just as good, but costs less energy. The boot jets give a full suit great flight.

I actually think modular power boots with fall negation and jetboots might be only slightly more expensive than an electric jetpack. It also depends what the TE recipe is; I've yet to see it.

 

[Yusunoha]

the problem with IC2 is that they are not coming out with new things at all, they are mostly just updating their stuff and that's it.
they did overhaul the reactor part of the mod, but be honest, who nowadays still uses reactors? especially after how complicated it has become?

in my opinion the only reason why IC2 is still on the mainstream side is because of the submods for it, but how it is looking now, they are losing ground fast and really need to come with more stuff.

 

[netmc]

hmm. I normally play mindcrack, but if I were playing dw20 pack, I would still use IC2. I love the nuclear reactors, tools, and the ic2 miners. they are my favorite way to automate mining. The miners may be slow, but they don't leave big gaping holes in the terrain. Without GT in the mix, one of the first things I do is build myself a drill. I also love the speed of the induction furnace and other advanced machines. Until the other mods add a way to generate items from nothing (or energy), I will still use the mass fabricator.

So IC2 is not going anywhere for me, it has only been pushed back a bit from 2nd day tech to after getting established.

 

[Hydra]

For the shear speed of it. The pulverizer

Sheep in a pulverizer? You maniac!

 

[KirinDave]

Yeah, I may actually do that, or at least watch someone's Let's Play (hint hint?) that does that, as it would be really interesting to see.

Ugh. I don't have an external mic and I'm not sure I want one. It'd be a grim audio scene.