Assistance with an Automated Boiler.

[arkangyl]

On my world I play with my girlfriend, we have just built a HP 12 Steam Boiler for easy MJ. Up until now we have relied on IC2 power and machinery exclusively, but we want to branch out a little bit into Forestry, BC, and TE.

After shoving a stack of coal in the Boiler, and being astounded by the speed it ate through it for little to no benefit, I decided to build a SC tree farm, and connect it into our RP Tubes/Barrels sorting system for easy Wood. I want to keep a barrel of Oak Wood and a barrel of Oak Saplings full for storage purposes, and any excess beyond that will go to Barrels over by the Boiler, where a Sawmill will shred the Logs into planks and feed them into the Boiler. The Saplings will go to the Boiler directly.

The main thing I'm having trouble wrapping my head around right now is keeping at least one Oak Log/Sapling in the correct Barrel at all times, so I don't end up with something random in them. I'm guessing RP has a machine for this, but I'm fairly new to that mod, so I am unsure. Any suggestions?

 

[Rakankrad]

Someone else posted this album before. I have been using a similar setup for mine: http://imgur.com/a/B8rTN#0

 

[lolpierandom]

You could just put a filter inline to the top of each barrel to make sure only the item you want goes into it (top-left corner decides the filter)

 

[arkangyl]

Someone else posted this album before. I have been using a similar setup for mine: http://imgur.com/a/B8rTN#0

This looks like it'll work so far.

You could just put a filter inline to the top of each barrel to make sure only the item you want goes into it (top-left corner decides the filter)

Hmm. I might be able to cut out a timer that way. Always good to reduce lag.

I am having an additional problem now, however. I have a Transposer hooked to the top of my Sawmill, and the Sawmill set with the Red side (output) on top. Nothing comes out of the sawmill, however. If I set the top to Grey (anything), or Blue (input) it pulls it out fine, but neither are useful for what I need. Is there something I'm missing with the outputs?

 

[budge]

Thermal Expansion machines will automatically output to an inventory on a side configured as an output. Tubes and transposers/filters/etc. are not inventories, so your best bet is to use a relay.

 

[abculatter_2]

You can also always use pipes, those work more or less perfectly with TE machines, without the need for a bunch of timers.
Alternatively, using relays is also an option.

Also, sorry for the self-plug, but this is also an option: http://www.computercraft.info/forum...um-replacement-and-rp2-automated-flax-farmer/
The wood yield is insane, I once managed to power around 10-12 IC2 generators on the charcoal produced by one of these, and that was using the somewhat inefficient torch/sapling design in the thread and only a single 2 MJ/t electric engine going into the logger. Using better designs, especially if you just plop down a single wrathlamp with saplings everywhere else, and bumping up the MJ/t, you should get enough charcoal (or planks) to power a few High-pressure steam boilers.
Which, obviously, should be more then sufficient to keep the system going indefinitely.

However, do NOT use oak or any 2x2 trees with this set-up.

 

[Omicron]

If you're unhappy about the fuel hunger of the 12 HP boiler, consider building two 12 LP boilers instead. Same MJ output, notably improved fuel efficiency. And it makes it semi modular, in that you can shut down one of the two when you won't need it, whereas you can't run a HP boiler at half output.

 

[abculatter_2]

If you're unhappy about the fuel hunger of the 12 HP boiler, consider building two 12 LP boilers instead. Same MJ output, notably improved fuel efficiency. And it makes it semi modular, in that you can shut down one of the two when you won't need it, whereas you can't run a HP boiler at half output.

High pressure and low pressure boilers both have the same fuel -> MJ efficiency once they hit 100% heat. Low pressure would only be better if you wanted to only run the boiler for a limited amount of time, which steam boilers aren't really meant for that, anyway.

 

[Omicron]

The keyword is "once they hit 100% heat". Most people grossly underestimate the impact of that heatup phase. I'm currently working on a project to visualize boiler efficiency properly, and I can give you some preliminary numbers.

- The 12 HP boiler needs four times as much fuel to reach 100% as the 12 LP boiler. The result is that even with two 12 LP boilers, you are spending only half as much fuel bringing them to full fuel efficiency.
- The two LP boilers will also reach 100% heat in less than half the time, making you worry even less about keeping enough fuel stocked in those crucial first moments.
- At the moment the 12 HP boiler finishes heating up, its average efficiency is 2.75 MJ per HU. At that point in time, the 12 LP boilers are already sitting at roughly 3.2 MJ/HU.
- The 12 HP boiler hits an average of 5 MJ/HU after roughly 72,000 seconds, that is, 20 hours of operation. It uses 14.5 million HU to get there. The 12 LP boilers will do it in 10 hours of operation, again using half as much fuel together.
- At no point in time, the HP boiler can ever catch up to the LP boiler's efficiency score, regardless of how long you run them alongside each other. Although maybe after 200 hours or so, the differences could start becoming negligible.

 

[Yusunoha]

I guess the point of the HP boiler is if you have a tonload of resources and don't know what to do with it you could use the HP boiler.
but I do have to say I find the LP and HP boiler science still a bit confusing, with result that I haven't made one yet.

 

[arkangyl]

The keyword is "once they hit 100% heat". Most people grossly underestimate the impact of that heatup phase. I'm currently working on a project to visualize boiler efficiency properly, and I can give you some preliminary numbers.

- The 12 HP boiler needs four times as much fuel to reach 100% as the 12 LP boiler. The result is that even with two 12 LP boilers, you are spending only half as much fuel bringing them to full fuel efficiency.
- The two LP boilers will also reach 100% heat in less than half the time, making you worry even less about keeping enough fuel stocked in those crucial first moments.
- At the moment the 12 HP boiler finishes heating up, its average efficiency is 2.75 MJ per HU. At that point in time, the 12 LP boilers are already sitting at roughly 3.2 MJ/HU.
- The 12 HP boiler hits an average of 5 MJ/HU after roughly 72,000 seconds, that is, 20 hours of operation. It uses 14.5 million HU to get there. The 12 LP boilers will do it in 10 hours of operation, again using half as much fuel together.
- At no point in time, the HP boiler can ever catch up to the LP boiler's efficiency score, regardless of how long you run them alongside each other. Although maybe after 200 hours or so, the differences could start becoming negligible.

Interesting info. I couldn't find much out about the practical differences between them, and didn't think to test in creative mode. Oh well, I already have the 12 HP built, and around 95% of the infrastructure needed to fuel it constantly by now. Next build I'll keep this stuff in mind though.

 

[abculatter_2]

I guess the point of the HP boiler is if you have a tonload of resources and don't know what to do with it you could use the HP boiler.
but I do have to say I find the LP and HP boiler science still a bit confusing, with result that I haven't made one yet.

High-pressure and Low-pressure boilers both cost the exact same amount of resources, with the exception of the charcoal or coal required to convert 1 1/2 stacks of iron ingots into 1 1/2 stacks of steel. (Well, twice as many engines to use the steam) And that's why I prefer High-pressure; you get twice as much energy for the amount of iron (and a few other resources) you put in, in addition to requiring half as much space.

The keyword is "once they hit 100% heat". Most people grossly underestimate the impact of that heatup phase. I'm currently working on a project to visualize boiler efficiency properly, and I can give you some preliminary numbers.

You seem to grossly underestimate the concept of infinite stuff generation.
Though, yeah, you will need to build-up a very large amount of fuel to heat up either boiler, and you will need FOUR TIMES!!! as much fuel (emphasis for everyone else who's reading this and didn't know that before) to heat a HP-boiler as a LP one. Which is, indeed, non-trivial, and people who are new to steam boilers should definitely acknowledge and recognize that fact.

Probably, however, why it's not mentioned during discussions is because it's taken as implied that the person already knows this, or they forgot to think about it, or they don't know it themselves.

 

[Omicron]

Infinite stuff generation, how boring! I like limited resource worlds, and alter my configs appropriately.

And thus, I like to know how things work. When this is done, I expect to have a chart where a person can see with one glance which boiler will generate the most MJ out of a given amount of fuel. And probably a second one that maps efficiency over time.

 

[MilConDoin]

Someone else posted this album before. I have been using a similar setup for mine: http://imgur.com/a/B8rTN#0

Ah, my old setup. After different stages of change I can now heat 3 36HP boilers with my cart farm (which has since changed from a 16x14 to a 16x16 track layout) via the wood alone, while the saplings and apples heat another 5 36HP boilers. If anyone is interested, I can post an updated album.
Products:
- 8*144 MJ/t - 56 MJ/t = 1088 MJ/t
- marginal charcoal plus (very unstable)
- little bit oak log plus
- marginal biofuel plus
- bit fertilizer plus
- mulch plus (almost significant... from all those squeezed apples)

 

[Rakankrad]

I'd like to see it myself. Mostly interested in the surplus saplings/apples part of it.. With your older setup, I have a few fermenters that take the saplings then turn it into biofuel, which feeds into a PetroGen for some extra EU..

 

[Minosha]

Ah, my old setup. After different stages of change I can now heat 3 36HP boilers with my cart farm (which has since changed from a 16x14 to a 16x16 track layout) via the wood alone, while the saplings and apples heat another 5 36HP boilers. If anyone is interested, I can post an updated album.
Products:
- 8*144 MJ/t - 56 MJ/t = 1088 MJ/t
- marginal charcoal plus (very unstable)
- little bit oak log plus
- marginal biofuel plus
- bit fertilizer plus
- mulch plus (almost significant... from all those squeezed apples)

I'd love to see an updated album - I'm in the planning stages of mine now, and all info is welcome

 

[Dark0_0firE]

I have a question that maybe might find an answer here.. with a SC treefarm, would it be more efficient to burn my wood into charcoal to feed a boiler, or run it through a sawmill for planks?

 

[Minosha]

I have a question that maybe might find an answer here.. with a SC treefarm, would it be more efficient to burn my wood into charcoal to feed a boiler, or run it through a sawmill for planks?

I believe 6 planks is better by 200 heat. Right now my hang-up is how to power the sawmill, since in Minkcrack v8 you get the stupid gregtech sawdust which can't be turned into coal. Was thinking of possible having a fermenter supply a biogas engine for the system's power needs, but not sure if a fermenter can supply an engine and still. I need to look into how much the biogas engine burns.

 

[Dark0_0firE]

I know the treefarm will pump out a heck of alot of sapplings.. far more than enought to power a boiler in its own right. So you should have more than enough for a biogas engine or two while still feeding a still.. If I recall correctly you can feed up to 4-5 stills with one fermenter. Of course you could just run the sawmill, fermenter and still off of energy conduits connected to steam engines right on the boiler. But that might be a bit later on.

 

[Minosha]

I'd like to not rely on the boiler for powering the system - Does anyone know if a 16x16 SC tree farm will yield enough saplings to feed two fermenters? Then I could dedicate 1 fermentor to a couple biogas engines, and have the other feed 4 stills. My end goal was to power two 36HP boilers, one on biofuel and one on planks for both MJ and EU production. From MilConDoin's numbers, I should be able to do more, it is just getting the layout down right I guess.