Adblock vs Pay2Sub - Your thoughts?

  • The FTB Forum is now read-only, and is here as an archive. To participate in our community discussions, please join our Discord! https://ftb.team/discord

Succubism

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
2,181
0
0
So I've been watching a lot of rant videos about how adblock users have reduced Youtube, or rather, Google to initiate a system of paying to subscribe to channels who utilize this system.

The general consensus seems to be that Google is money grubbing and trying to squeeze every last penny out of one of their biggest cashcows and they're using a legit, yet contraversial system, to blame this decision on. People seem to think that Adblock isn't to blame at all and that people on youtube are just greedy. Google is greedy and they reep what they sew by trying to cram advertisements in our face at every point they get and that they stopped watching television to use the internet as an escape from advertisements getting worse and worse.

I disagree. I disagree strongly.

I'm going to admit it, guys. I'm going to admit with my hand on heart that I use Adblock and I've used adblock on youtube. Advertisements are an inconvenience most of the time, especially when they're obnoxious or they're frequent in a space of time and this is the case in most if not all types of advertised medium. Television, Internet, Billboards, Magazines - Hell, a local paper I read dedicates every right side of their fold to advertisements! Sometimes I wish there was an adblock for life.

But is it really to blame for this "crisis" of youtube's pay to subscribe feature? Well yes. I think it is. And I'm probbaly going to receive a lot of flak for this.

Youtube generates their money, all if not a vast majority of their money through ad revenue. They recieve a portion of revnue generated from their Partners, the popular channels of youtube, who make content that's seen by millions at a time and the advertisements make money for both the content makers and youtube who hosts this feature.

With that said, youtube can't make money from advertisements that aren't seen. Youtube cannot rightfully claim income if people don't see the advertisements they expect revenue from and adblock takes away the ability to view advertisements for the sake of convenience to the user. Is this a bad thing? For Google, yes it is.

I've heard both sides of the story of Google being an evil, money shovelling cororation to Google just trying to make a living doing what any other company in it's shoes would be doing in the face of similar adversity and I believe in the latter half.
Don't get me wrong, Google is still evil, but I don't judge their actions here. In fact it was expected.

Youtube was bought by google for near 2 billion dollars. Google expects to make more money off Youtube because that is why they bought it and in this day and age, more and more people are using adblock and they're no longer making as much money. This is a problem for them. This is a problem for youtube and thus it is a problem for us.

Now - Let me make something clear, before I conclude with my thoughts. I don't believe that this is reason for someone to stop using Adblock. I think there's a lot of reason to use Adblock and I respect that advertisement pushing is wrong. I believe in the right to stand up and say "I'm sick of advertisements on a daily basis." However, that is not to say that I believe adblock users are within their right to judge someone for trying to make up for money that they themselves are stopping them from making.

They can't come to you like a girl scout selling cookies and say "Hey, buy my cookies, or I'll lose money" because that's not true. They won't lose money, they just won't make money off you. No-one physically reaches into their pockets and takes money from them if they don't make a sale, they simply just won't make money from that potential transaction. There is a difference.

So when I see someone whining about how google is trying to hover money from their users, I say "Well what did you expect? When more and more people are stopping them from making money? God forbid you be inconvinienced by spending thirty seconds of your life to allow someone else to make money. God forbid you allow someone to make a living because we all know if you were in their shoes you'd be a bloody angel in comparison."

That's my two cents. As of right now, I won't be removing adblock from my computers. However I'll be disabling it's use from youtube. I believe in the right to make a living off popularity when the content is worthy, even if it's medium is something as sporadic as the Internet.
I'll also be disabling it's use on other sites that deserve it.

I learned something from all of this, folks. I hope you do too. Feel free to give your opinions.
 

Chrissy

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
460
0
0
Look, The only reason i block ads is because advertisers don't get the picture:

You can have non intrusive advertisements, But for fucks sake, I already HAVE a car, Why should i have to watch a thirty seccond advertisement for some shit i'm not going to buy?, Static (Non animated) non popup advertisements are just FINE, When i'm on katbox.net (Comics site) I turn it off for project wonderfull (Site's revenue source) because their ads dont move, They dont make me wait and watch adverts for ages before accessing content. Ads are fine, Ads that are directly in the way are a a bad thing and that's what these chucklefucks need to learn

I was fine with how it was, There were a couple ads in the sidebar and such and it was fine, But then they started grubbing, And google is pretty insidious about their advertising, Between how they track to closely and all that stuff i could rant for hours about


If youtube goes as far as Pay2Watch they can go fuck themselves, There are other video sharing sites
 
  • Like
Reactions: goreae and Cirom

Succubism

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
2,181
0
0

I agree, some advertisements are unnecessary for you to watch considering you probably already have or are satisfied with something relating to the advert which is why, 9 times out of 10, you can choose to opt out of an advertisement on sites such as blip or youtube after only 5 seconds. Putting that into perspective, whether you opt out of it or not you still provide support for the maker of the video who generates revenue from the advertisement regardless and for the sake of 5 seconds out of the time it takes you to watch a video in itself, I think it's worth the hassle of clicking the skip button or even watching a 15 second advertisement on the rare occasion you can't opt out on it. That's the beauty of the internet over television.

Furthermore, google didn't exactly generate the in-video advertisements for the sake of grubbing money, they did it for two reasons.
1. It's just business and with all things considered they could have done a lot worse.
2. Google Adsense provides a majority cut of revenue to the channel who partners with Youtube to allow them to be paid for their content. Now, in some cases, this is a good thing. But when you have the top tier, sellout money whores such as RWJ, iJustine or whatever, then yes, this is just pandering and money grubbing, but then ad revenue only comes from advertisements watched. No-one forces you to watch videos you don't want to watch and in so doing you're not giving support to the wrong people by sticking to those who deserve it. I can't speak for blip, but apparantly it uses the same if not similar process.

I can certainly respect your reasoning for using adblock and I definitely don't blame you. I still use it. But when it comes to youtube and other sites who benefit from advertisements but don't want to pound them into your brain, I flick the adblock switch off for them so I can give them my support in the best way I can and for the most part, youtube is one of those sites, given the channels I watch being few in the first place.

Finally, as far as using "other sites", if a kingpin like youtube chooses a path and it turns out to work, een if the majority doesn't like it, others can and will follow their lead for the sake of the all-mighty dollar. So a pilgrimage to an alternative site will be counter productive. I don't think it'll catch on regardless. Youtube cannot and will not force channels to sell their content. Channels will only adapt this feature if they so choose which will in turn seriously impact their subscriber and view count. They won't make money by selling themselves like that and if they try, they will loose credibility and popularity from an unwelcoming audience. It won't stand.
 

PeggleFrank

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
928
0
0
I don't use adblock so I don't really care (although I do have it installed on chrome (along with some other things) so that I can listen to music without advertisements in-between), but paying to subscribe to people is... what? I have to pay so I can get my Hotmail spammed with alerts? Is it so good, that I have to pay for it?


Subscriptions are so meaningless... The only thing that could come from this is a blank subscription box for a lot of people. If Google wants money, they need to advertise/monetize something else, not unnecessarily chop off parts of their site for little to no gain.




I also find it quite ironic that an extension for chrome is causing Google to overreact and monetize subscriptions. You could, y'know, just take it off of your store... but why do that, when we can monetize even more?! Obviously the solution is to monetize HD.
 

Dex Luther

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
294
2
1
The youtubers I usually watch are either too small or are against this sort of thing. I'd really like to see Google's books. We all know Google isn't exactly hurting when it comes to money. They money they lose from adblock on youtube, they make up somewhere else in tripple.

I was fine when they had the little ad on the right of their videos. Then they started having the ad AND that little pop-up in the videos, which was annoying, but I let it slide. Then they started with ads before the videos, and that's when I adblocked them.

It's the same thing with other websites. They start out with a small ad and maybe some text ad here and there, then they started having more pictures all over the place. Then it was the ads that yelled shit at you, and then pop-up and pop-unders. There were sites where even the pop-ups had ads and other pop-ups, and then they wonder why things like pop-up blockers and adblock were invented.

The thing is, a while ago Adblock was updated, and I remember having a message come up after the update saying that people were complaining about ads being blocked and making it harder to keep their websites up and running. According to the message (it could have been an article or something I don't remember) adblock was working to whitelist ads that are not intrusive, which is something I don't mind.

EDIT: This is what I was talking about: https://adblockplus.org/en/acceptable-ads#criteria

And here's an interesting artictle
http://www.digitaltrends.com/web/adblock-plus-accused-of-shaking-down-websites/
 

Freakscar

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
575
0
1
According to the message (it could have been an article or something I don't remember) adblock was working to whitelist ads that are not intrusive, which is something I don't mind.
The "Allow non-intrusive advertising" and the filter list behind it was found out to be filled up with ads and sites that are belonging to the Adblock network - there's quite a bunch of articles about how nearly 99% of all ads that are considered "non-intrusive" by said filter in one way or another belong to members of the team in or around Adblock Plus.

On topic: If there were actual "non intrusive" ads to the side, I probably would not mind. But I rage-RIP (RemoveItPermanently) everything on any website I frequent, that blinks, moves or (worst of all) has sound. Hence the "First watch 30 seconds of shtuff before your video will play" is a nogo for me. So, until this changes, YT won't get my 30 seconds. I do understand that some people make a living out of ads. Honestly? I don't care. I got a nine to five job. If it was certain money they were after, they would've taken on a different way to earn it. I use YT for fun and relaxing. If any of my subscribtions ever go "pay2sub", I will simply shrug them off and forget about them. As Chrissy said, there are more fish in the sea. YT overdoing ads would give them a chance for the spotlight and do things better. The same holds true for ads on TV, by the way. I don't sit there and endure those (nowwadays) 10 minutes of stupid commercials. I switch to another channel, having my tv box record the program in the meantime. When/If I go back, I can fast forward the commercials and continue watching the show.
Heck, even if YT itself would turn into some pay2watch video website, I would shrug that off and find me another video site. Yeah, I'm that evil of a leecher. ;)

Basically, the more intrusive, inyaface and annoying ads get, the more adblockers and elementremovers I will load into my Firefox. If you try to make money with ads, you're fighting a lost cause. Because there always will be folks that find ways to prevent them, just cause. And as long as that's possible..
 

Tzukasa

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
33
0
0
The ads only play for 4 secs then you can click skip... If that is such an aweful inconvenience for you that you are purposefully screwing YouTube broadcasters out of their income; just so you can watch, for free, the vids they are working hard to produce (many as a living) without having to watch an ad for 4 secs then You Are a HORRIBLE Human Being and Should Be Ashamed of yourself.
 

NosePicker5555

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
529
0
0
The ads only play for 4 secs then you can click skip... If that is such an aweful inconvenience for you that you are purposefully screwing YouTube broadcasters out of their income; just so you can watch, for free, the vids they are working hard to produce (many as a living) without having to watch an ad for 4 secs then You Are a HORRIBLE Human Being and Should Be Ashamed of yourself.

I think i should killmyself cause i use adblock. I am such a bad person. I am so guilty. ;-;
 
  • Like
Reactions: PeggleFrank

PeggleFrank

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
928
0
0
The ads only play for 4 secs then you can click skip... If that is such an aweful inconvenience for you that you are purposefully screwing YouTube broadcasters out of their income; just so you can watch, for free, the vids they are working hard to produce (many as a living) without having to watch an ad for 4 secs then You Are a HORRIBLE Human Being and Should Be Ashamed of yourself.

Except for the ads that are 29.99 seconds long, which you can't skip.
 

VikeStep

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
1,117
0
0
Its not really 4 seconds Tzukasa, sometimes it is up to 30 seconds :/

I'm going to be honest, I use AdBlock, I never disable it (except for twitch streamers when they have ad breaks). I am a teenager and I have never ever payed attention to ads, they get in the way and I have never bought anything or thought that I should try it out. As Chrissy said before, Ads are a nuisance if they block content until you have viewed them. I also hate those ads that look like download buttons on download websites, I have had to remove viruses from my brothers computer a few times because he that was the actual program (he even went through install process without realising).

I like YouTube's videos, I don't like their ad policy, it doesn't mean I have to support it. Do you think that a YouTuber will go into the monetization business without knowing that they will lose like 4 cents a view for viewers with AdBlock? hell yeah! Its a risk they are willing to take if they decide to get all their revenue from youtube videos.
 
  • Like
Reactions: PeggleFrank

NosePicker5555

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
529
0
0
Its not really 4 seconds Tzukasa, sometimes it is up to 30 seconds :/

I'm going to be honest, I use AdBlock, I never disable it (except for twitch streamers when they have ad breaks). I am a teenager and I have never ever payed attention to ads, they get in the way and I have never bought anything or thought that I should try it out. As Chrissy said before, Ads are a nuisance if they block content until you have viewed them. I also hate those ads that look like download buttons on download websites, I have had to remove viruses from my brothers computer a few times because he that was the actual program (he even went through install process without realising).

I like YouTube's videos, I don't like their ad policy, it doesn't mean I have to support it. Do you think that a YouTuber will go into the monetization business without knowing that they will lose like 4 cents a view for viewers with AdBlock? hell yeah! Its a risk they are willing to take if they decide to get all their revenue from youtube videos.

u shuld bi ashamd. u r ruinin ytbrs lyves.
 

Succubism

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
2,181
0
0
I wouldn't say you'd ruining their lives and really anyone with any sort of common sense could see that. Note: This isn't a jab at NosePicker. I realize it's ironic.
I don't believe that even if adverts are 30 seconds and unskippable that it's a big deal. I highly doubt anyone on here has time that is too valuable to waste 30 seconds out of their lives to show support for someone they watch and enjoy. Most youtubers don't care if you use adblock or not. Sure, they'd rather you don't, but either way they make a living out of something. Most top tier youtubers have third party sponsors that give them money regardless if you watch the adsense adverts or not. Others have jobs away from youtube itself.
You'd be pretty silly to make youtube your living unless you had the subscriber base to actually get away with it and they, at least for the most part, know it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: PeggleFrank

Quesenek

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
396
0
0
I started using a Adblocker when they made the an ad play at the beginning of every video for some reason youtube can load its ad at the speed of light but my video buffer loads extremely slow and/or wont play at all. With an Adblocker I have zero buffer issues. Sure its selfish but really I don't have all day to see if a video will load.
 

PageFair

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
2
0
0
I agree that ads are intrusive, but ad blocking is the not the simple solution that it seems. Advertising is the backbone of the internet. You can shut down the ads, but we as consumers will still have to "pay", one way or another. It's literally my job to research this topic, you can check out my latest post on Adblock's campaign (which is NOT the same as the more popular Adblock Plus or "ABP", btw) here. I'd love any feedback from those of you who struggle with annoying ads or that frequently use adblock.
 

Siro

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
638
0
0
I've been blocking ads on the internet for almost as long as they've existed. They're a common virus/trojan vector and everyone should be blocking them anyway for the simple reason that someone out there is a dumbass and is surfing the internet lolrandomly without concern for what's getting downloaded onto their machine and spread to other networks. I'm much more comfortable with the idea of paying a subscription for quality content that isn't broken up by advertising. This was generally the idea behind paying for cable over broadcast television prior to cable shitting it up with super loud ads and actually cutting into content with more ads. Basically, I haven't watched TV/Cable since video cds came into being near the end of the VHS era. The exception being the rare occasion when I'm in a hotel/traveling.
 

Idgarad

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
18
0
0
Anyone remember books that didn't have ads? Now I read about how "Hollister grabbed his Pepsi-One from his Kenmore Fridge and threw on his Galco holster with his newly assigned Beretta 92A1. It didn't fit his hand as well as his Glock 19 but standard issue was standard issue. He bolted out of the kitchen with a Jimmy Dean breakfast sausage and hopped into the Subaru Forester. If only those racist Republicans hadn't selfishly blocked the recent mass transit bill he could have taken a bus but Big Oil's greed again outweighted common sense. He sighed and took another drink from his thermos. "Ahh Trader Joe's Organic Green Tea... nothing better to start your day." If those filthy capitalists would only stop raping Mother Earth we could progress to a more human socialist driven economy and he would no longer need to carry a vile death machine to work as a EPA investigator...." I shit you not, that is what is on the screen of my wife's Kindle this very second!
 

Celestialphoenix

Too Much Free Time
Nov 9, 2012
3,741
3,204
333
Tartarus.. I mean at work. Same thing really.
I started adblocking when the adverts became a little TOO creepy for my liking
Seriously- I browsed baby toys on amazon and ebay (little bro's first birthday :D), for the next week or so my facebook, youtube ect all show ads for baby toys. the EXACT same toys too.​
Coincidence? too unlikely. (same story for flowers [mum's birthday], and whenever I pick something up for myself)​
Creepy?- definitely​
So much for 'anonymous' data collected for advertising.
 

Dex Luther

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
294
2
1
I started adblocking when the adverts became a little TOO creepy for my liking
Seriously- I browsed baby toys on amazon and ebay (little bro's first birthday :D), for the next week or so my facebook, youtube ect all show ads for baby toys. the EXACT same toys too.​
Coincidence? too unlikely. (same story for flowers [mum's birthday], and whenever I pick something up for myself)​
Creepy?- definitely​
So much for 'anonymous' data collected for advertising.
It's not really creepy when you know how it works.

Also, I don't feel bad about blocking ads. Especially on YouTube. People go to the Internet to escape shit they find on tv. If YouTube stuck to still ads to the side of the page people wouldn't mind it as much. But they insist on having shit pop up in you video and interrupting you to show full length ads. Sorry but that shit is the exact crap people come to YouTube to escape.

When a website has more ads than content is another reason they get blocked. I find it funny that these companies are whining that people don't want to let them spam their computer screens with advertising. As if we don't get enough of that crap everywhere else.

I'm guessing you wouldn't mind if your minecraft would freeze every 20 minutes for 10 minutes worth of ads. It's getting to that point. Commercial interruptions in your video games and in DVD/blurays you've bought.
 

PeggleFrank

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
928
0
0
I'm guessing you wouldn't mind if your minecraft would freeze every 20 minutes for 10 minutes worth of ads. It's getting to that point. Commercial interruptions in your video games and in DVD/blurays you've bought.

Last time I checked, they were doing that to make it so that some games could be released for free.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Darth Sith