Taking it elsewhere; a request for some NON-TiC based packs

keybounce

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
1,925
0
0
I do not like TiC, nor IgT.

I do not feel that TiC is balanced; it allows making significantly stronger / more powerful tools. mDiyo does claim that it is balanced, and says that there is a mathemetical curve/progression that he keeps things in balance to, and says that the large tools reach/touch this limit, without breaking it. So I appreciate that there is an effort to keep the TiC tools balanced with regard to each other, and to have some sense of tradeoff.

But it ultimately feels like running around with TiC tools, or TiC weapons, makes you significantly more powerful than you would be with just vanilla tools/weapons, resulting in less effort/challenge in an already low-challenge environment.

Ideally, TiC tools/weapons would be a choice alongside vanilla ones. Maybe you'd use one, or the other; neither would be completely outclassed. But that's not the case -- except for the very top-of-the-line vanilla enchanted stuff, TiC stuff does better, and even then there are some specialized TiC items that cannot be matched (a tool with 100% unbreaking, or 1 durability left, stonebound, and powered by energy).

IgT seems to be even worse. Yes, it starts by nerfing/weaking TiC stuff, until that stuff improves; but instead of making it so that TiC stuff is comparible to vanilla, so you can be reasonably expected to use both, it usually (by default, and in most modpacks) disables all (or almost all) vanilla stuff. And worse, in the default settings, it turns TiC into a 7-layer grind.

Simply put: Can we please see an FTB pack that is NOT designed around either "artificial difficulty" of full-out IgT, nor "You're going be a super-demigod with TiC, so lets make the rest harder to compensate", but is based around vanilla tools/weapons instead? And yes, given the current state of mods/packs, I'm expecting this as a 1.7 or 1.8 pack.
 
  • Like
Reactions: abculatter_2

abculatter_2

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
599
0
0
Well, while I agree with and support your sentiment here, making your own modpack is now at easy as downloading the mods you want and dragging the files into the mods folder. It's what I've been doing, anyway, and I find I personally have quite a bit more fun in a self-made modpack then any of the FTB ones.
 

KurShedir

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
78
0
0
Tinker's construct tools are not designed to give the balance feel that a lot of players usually look for (probably due to a balance concept born before 1.5 packs). And modded minecraft is not supposed to be an alternative to vanilla, but to improve it.

However, in the official 1.6 packs you can use project red tools if you don't like TiC. And redstone arsenal tools, and Thaumcraft tools, and ars magica spells, and bedrock tools. Plenty of options.
Magic Farm and Agrarian Skies are different because they're designed around a specific concept.

1.7... Metallurgy 4 is already out.
 

AlCapella

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
709
0
0
I do not like TiC, nor IgT.
What's with this ^^ trend in the last two days? Is it a case of too much outing in the midday sun? :p

While I agree with the idea of non-TiC-based packs, I disagree with the dislike of Ti C ;)

^^ That was running through my mind too. :)

TiCo finds massive appeal because vanilla enchanting is worse than the odds at Las Vegas casinos. Remove it or ignore it. The third option is to make your own pack and see if you gain an audience.

You, my good man, win the internet today for that similie metaphor. (*) :)

EDIT: I want to catch the guy that came up with the probability percentage of adding "Bane of arthropods" in plain vanilla, and throw him in a locked room full of said arthropod spawners!


My sentiment on this whole "I hate TiCo" thing.....


[goes away whistling elephant march song]

(*) thanks @SatanicSanta
 
Last edited:

Skyqula

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
568
-1
0
Lets be honest here, TiC improves the vanilla tool concept and adds some much needed area clearing tools with its t2 tools. Clearing a large piece of land with a pickaxe? Takes actual days... Its not fun, its one of the reasons I look to mods. Chopping down trees? Done it, its boring, long live the lumberaxe. But most importantly, vanilla enchanting is terrible when starting out, boring once you got your named tools. Glad 1.8 will fix it, wich is still like a year off for us modders probably...

Now you talk about things like 1 durability stonebound with a electric/flux modifier. Thats cross mod interaction, ofcourse balance is going to break/get more insane.
 

Captain_Oats

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
116
0
0
I completely agree. Being able to get a fortune 3 pick after a couple of deep mining trips isn't very balanced or progressive if you ask me. Add in the fact that it is nearly free to give any tool repair (moss) or a battery/flux capacitor and it means you never need to repair an item again.

Some (probably most modded minecraft players) may not like the old enchantment system, but it was incredibly rewarding to get a good tool with it. My biggest problem was the cost of repairing the tool once you finally obtained this great item.

Both issues are fixed with the new enchantment system.

I had similar issues with Redstone Arsenal tools (which are awesome but similarly have a short term sense of accomplishment followed by boredom). Honestly the only tool I feel is really balanced for modded minecraft is IC2's drills. I know I'll get flack for that because IC2 is apparently the devil now, but that's how I feel. I should also note that I'm going off of Gregtech's recipes so that also probably makes you hate me more for some reason. At least with the GT or IC2 approach there's some incentive to use vanilla tools, which still have a great deal of nostalgia associated with them personally.

Some ways around problems like these are to set limits for yourself. Force yourself to repair your items, no battery/moss, maybe limit your upgrades slots or w/e they're called. I'm also not sure how configurable the mod is with regards to the upgrades, you'll have to check the configs if you go that route.
 

Captain_Oats

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
116
0
0
TiCo finds massive appeal because vanilla enchanting is worse than the odds at Las Vegas casinos. Remove it or ignore it. The third option is to make your own pack and see if you gain an audience.

Speaking of which, using MFR's autoenchanter I just got Bane of Arthopods V. I then removed the enchant and re-enchanted to get 2 Bane of Arthropods IV. Yay.
 
  • Like
Reactions: RedBoss

Padfoote

Brick Thrower
Forum Moderator
Dec 11, 2013
5,140
5,898
563
Simply put: Can we please see an FTB pack that is NOT designed around either "artificial difficulty" of full-out IgT, nor "You're going be a super-demigod with TiC, so lets make the rest harder to compensate", but is based around vanilla tools/weapons instead? And yes, given the current state of mods/packs, I'm expecting this as a 1.7 or 1.8 pack.

I would be extremely surprised if there's currently a single pack balanced solely around TiCo as it currently stands, so your wish more than likely already exists. Yes, Agrarian Skies and MF2 rely on it, but I'm pretty sure they technically aren't FTB packs, and that TiCo isn't the sole balancing point.
 

ThorinNL

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
82
0
0
TiCo finds massive appeal because vanilla enchanting is worse than the odds at Las Vegas casinos. Remove it or ignore it. The third option is to make your own pack and see if you gain an audience.

The fourth option is to install Enchanment plus, now you can pick whatever enchantment you want and level ;).
 

Revemohl

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
595
0
0
You could also try Dartcraft! And then cry yourself to death when you make a Fortune IV pickaxe in less than a few hours.
Personally, I feel that if anything is wrong here, it's the RNG roulette called the vanilla enchanting system (which will only get worse in 1.8 because results are locked until you enchant something). TCon lets you customize your tools and put what you need in them instead of grinding 30 levels, getting Unbreaking II, grinding 30 more levels, getting Efficiency III and going back to the grind (which does not equal difficulty, don't forget that), even if that "what you need" is an absurd amount of damage that pierces (most?) armor. I don't find it perfect, though, as I feel that more modifiers would get more useful if they leveled up with usage, like the lapis one -- more often than not, you end up maximizing a modifier at the same time as you add it to your tool in first place. Still, the mod has been a staple in every pack since 1.5 because it is amazingly good at what it does, and I guess there is something it doesn't do better than everything else: remember, there is nothing like a "multi-tool" in that mod. Even the simple mining drill from IC2 beats it at that.

Anyway, at least there's Thaumcraft for some kind of progression with enchantments. Infusion enchanting may be a bit slow, but it also lets you put what you want in whatever you want for a decent and progressive cost.
 

Pyure

Not Totally Useless
Aug 14, 2013
8,334
7,191
383
Waterloo, Ontario
I like TiC tools enough that I fully support this thread just to help cut the umbilical. It kinda bugs me that I value my mining hammer-of-doom way, way more than a freaking mining laser.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DriftinFool

Mevansuto

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
1,739
1
0
I would be extremely surprised if there's currently a single pack balanced solely around TiCo as it currently stands, so your wish more than likely already exists. Yes, Agrarian Skies and MF2 rely on it, but I'm pretty sure they technically aren't FTB packs, and that TiCo isn't the sole balancing point.

According to the FTB Changelog Page, MF2 is, AG & BnB aren't.