We don't approve of it, don't be silly. We have no power over what mod authors do. It is our role to provide balanced and tested packs, suited to the wants of the community. Sometimes, I think people forget that.
Greg Tech opinion discussions go here
- Thread starter Jadedcat
- Start date
-
The FTB Forum is now read-only, and is here as an archive. To participate in our community discussions, please join our Discord! https://ftb.team/discord
- Status
We don't approve of it, don't be silly. We have no power over what mod authors do. It is our role to provide balanced and tested packs, suited to the wants of the community. Sometimes, I think people forget that.
Well if you look at the new packs from how long it probably took in the back ground to set it up this has been in the planing for a while. Now if FTB decided to delay the GregTech pack then they would have to come out with a statement on this mater which what ever they say is going to piss off people it would also bring more spotlight to GT as then it would probbaly be released by itself which makes it look more important. Now by releasing it at the time they planed they avoid alot of the spotlight on it as the release was already planed before this incident and FTB team is somewhat large so in all reality they don't have the time to be dealing with this kind of BS.
As to my opinion of any mods is you don't change vanilla recipes unless you declare that it is a total conversion mod (kinda like TFC). The point of forge is to keep mods compatible between each other and you notice any mod that changes vanilla causes a warning in the log. As for what mDiyo did I do not see what he did was changing GT but change vanilla (even though it was back to what it was original) as unnecessary and going back to my first point about not changing vanilla.
Now for how I feel about GT: I love some aspects of the mod such as the fusion reactor's power system as it allows me to store power in a much less CPU intensive way and fast efficient transport. As for prolonging the game I like that as I don't burn out as fast. Also most of GT's changes people ignore if they have other mods installed such as Thermal Expansion which is why I agree with one of the first few posts that gregtech should state he is a total conversion mod and then I would not be bothered so much by him changing other mods, but him trying to keep stating he is just an IC2 addon is a lie if he touches any other mod besides IC2.
Also this thread has 45 pages now I read the first 6 then skiped to the end after I just kept seeing the same statements over and over.
As to my opinion of any mods is you don't change vanilla recipes unless you declare that it is a total conversion mod (kinda like TFC). The point of forge is to keep mods compatible between each other and you notice any mod that changes vanilla causes a warning in the log. As for what mDiyo did I do not see what he did was changing GT but change vanilla (even though it was back to what it was original) as unnecessary and going back to my first point about not changing vanilla.
Now for how I feel about GT: I love some aspects of the mod such as the fusion reactor's power system as it allows me to store power in a much less CPU intensive way and fast efficient transport. As for prolonging the game I like that as I don't burn out as fast. Also most of GT's changes people ignore if they have other mods installed such as Thermal Expansion which is why I agree with one of the first few posts that gregtech should state he is a total conversion mod and then I would not be bothered so much by him changing other mods, but him trying to keep stating he is just an IC2 addon is a lie if he touches any other mod besides IC2.
Also this thread has 45 pages now I read the first 6 then skiped to the end after I just kept seeing the same statements over and over.
Gregtech isn't worth a 10 page dissertation. I am mostly just bummed out that this will most likely end in my server admin doing a server restart, and I was in the middle of building the ultimate self sustaining boiler. Though if this results in them forcing the next version of buildcraft down the pipes I will be wholly satisfied with my new pipe plugs. I suppose I have Gregtech to thank for me building the boiler in the first place (I would have gone the IC2 route otherwiseI'm sorry, sir, that's MY throne you're so clumsily usurping -- honestly, I spend more time cutting my posts down from the ten-page dissertations they start out as, than I actually do writing them
)Hmm maybe I should have rambled a bit but my focus was wandering. What I ment was that both were in the wrong for how the situation was handled. To begin with the vanilla mechanic should never have been "nerfed" if anything it should have been used in a different manner while leaving the original alone. Now while Mdiyo did return the recipe to the original it was done in a fashion that could have been, and was taken as such due to resulting actions, as a slap in the face. This in no way gives the permission or the need of the resulting action but I will say again but authors let emotions take over and the fallout of such effected not so much the authors, but the user base that assemble their own mod packs and the FTB users and staff. So basically what I was trying to say was actions were taken both intentional and misinterpreted that effected everyone as a whole and should never have happened in the first place.
Also Bobert and Eunomic both of you should share the throne for the kingdom of walls o' text and while painful to read do contain very relevant information.
Well, as I mentioned in another thread Unhinged is also a "joke" set for MTG http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unhinged_(Magic:_The_Gathering) so yea. Fairly sure that wasn't intentional, but if it was that's kinda punishment in and of itself.
Why does sharing seats of any sort always make me think of the 10 hour car trips crammed between the luggage and my bro of yesteryear. Ugghh, Eunomic can have the throne, I'll sit on the ground, those car rides were horrible
.Also as I stated in the above referenced wall of text, I do not condone either of their behavior, they were both immature and lazy in their approach to a solution. But immature and lazy doesn't necessitate a call to action by the community, I'm immature and lazy most of the time if I can be. Malicious code does necessitate a call to action. I can't have bad programmers giving the rest of us a bad name ... at least not any worse than we already give ourselves.
I cringe at almost anyone else's code I have to read, everyone has their own system for comments, and white space, and variables, and modularity, and loops ... and yeah ... helping people find errors in their code in the lab ... worst thing ever ... why can't I say no to people? and second, why do I look like a lab TA to everyone? How does playing Minecraft in the University lab make me appear like the smart one? oh wait ... nm. Also ... stop making me relive collegeHow about I just buy you a new chair then Bobert. And you would probably cringe at any code i write then, I am self taught through trial and error but mostly error.
. Also self-taught is 100% better than going to school ... except that 99.9% of employers won't even look at you if you apply.I'm going to write a long, well-thought-out post on my opinion of this whole debate:
No eff that, malicious code = inexcusable. Full stop.
Seriously. My opinion on Gregtech or Tinker's Construct is completely irrelevant to the matter at hand, so I'm not even going to bother elaborating on it. The fact is, it is modder etiquette to never introduce code that will intentionally crash or stop a game from running. Full stop. There are no excuses for it. Debating on whether it is malicious or not, game-breaking, mod neutering, or taking the completely arrogant stance of "no one can tell me what to put in my mod, only I get to decide that" or who has the bigger e-peen is also completely pointless. That includes the platitudinous excuse of "there's a config for it" as well. This is pretty cut and dry - if you introduce code that intentionally makes the game halt, you lose. Full stop.
As an aside, if you do want something to chew on, most mods (not always the case, and with the growing popularity of FTB, even less so) are balanced against vanilla minecraft. That means that it is the assumption that any mod you use is balanced against vanilla recipes. If a mod changes vanilla recipes, then it is a total conversion mod and shouldn't ever be played with any other mod installed, because the balance will be off by nature. Put what happened into perspective given that is the case.
No eff that, malicious code = inexcusable. Full stop.
Seriously. My opinion on Gregtech or Tinker's Construct is completely irrelevant to the matter at hand, so I'm not even going to bother elaborating on it. The fact is, it is modder etiquette to never introduce code that will intentionally crash or stop a game from running. Full stop. There are no excuses for it. Debating on whether it is malicious or not, game-breaking, mod neutering, or taking the completely arrogant stance of "no one can tell me what to put in my mod, only I get to decide that" or who has the bigger e-peen is also completely pointless. That includes the platitudinous excuse of "there's a config for it" as well. This is pretty cut and dry - if you introduce code that intentionally makes the game halt, you lose. Full stop.
As an aside, if you do want something to chew on, most mods (not always the case, and with the growing popularity of FTB, even less so) are balanced against vanilla minecraft. That means that it is the assumption that any mod you use is balanced against vanilla recipes. If a mod changes vanilla recipes, then it is a total conversion mod and shouldn't ever be played with any other mod installed, because the balance will be off by nature. Put what happened into perspective given that is the case.
There's too many pages to go through at this point, but I think the situation is pretty clear, as are peoples' general opinions.
When someone decides to break my game because they have a personal grudge with someone else, then that's when it's time to throw their mod away. This goes beyond the whole Tekkit situation of yesteryear. He knew it would break personal installs and modpacks alike, with people having no idea what's going on, and it apparently didn't bother him. His personal grudge was more important than thousands of peoples' Minecraft games. And Minecraft games are why we're all here to begin with. Not drama. Completely unacceptable, and I'd go as far as to suggest its removal from FTB entirely, given the maturity level involved. If even one person, such as mDiyo, can't play a stock FTB pack with Gregtech installed without his helmet being fucked up, then it should go.
I always found its difficulty to be a bit pointless and grinding to begin with, so now I have even less problem with removing it from any modpack I personally play, regardless of FTB's decision.
When someone decides to break my game because they have a personal grudge with someone else, then that's when it's time to throw their mod away. This goes beyond the whole Tekkit situation of yesteryear. He knew it would break personal installs and modpacks alike, with people having no idea what's going on, and it apparently didn't bother him. His personal grudge was more important than thousands of peoples' Minecraft games. And Minecraft games are why we're all here to begin with. Not drama. Completely unacceptable, and I'd go as far as to suggest its removal from FTB entirely, given the maturity level involved. If even one person, such as mDiyo, can't play a stock FTB pack with Gregtech installed without his helmet being fucked up, then it should go.
I always found its difficulty to be a bit pointless and grinding to begin with, so now I have even less problem with removing it from any modpack I personally play, regardless of FTB's decision.
Are you GregoriousT? .. deceptive words aside ..sure sound like him, you know in that special way that dialect and perspective flows into words.
Personally, I've built with Gregtech since the launch day of the mindcrack pack. Built sprawling factories of non-solar, power generating beastliness and loved it.However; With each iteration of GT, one nerf after another stepping on toes had to happen. I applaud someone for standing up to GregoriusT. Anyone this egotistic should lose their place in any FTB pack, either a primary pack, dw20 or Mindcrack. There has to be a consequence.
I'm sure I speak for others when I reach out to you Gregorius, please show yourself here by name. I for one want to know why you should even be considered for inclusion in any pack. If you can't even do that, then clearly you don't care, have no place here and will fade into mod history. However there's a chance for you yet.... Show your self set the record straight.
Failing an appearance .. how about a user poll? not split into two (more) packs, but purely dump or keep egotariusG
~
I second a user poll. Would help give more defined results to what people want done with the illustrious GregoriousT
I second a user poll. Would help give more defined results to what people want done with the illustrious GregoriousT
In fairness, the FTB team already made their decision and has no reason to go back on it at present, so this isn't the time nor place for democracy.
Even if it were undecided, it's still not the right place for democracy. I really don't think any good will come from a mixture of angry fans and angry programmers going at it in an open poll where everyone loses regardless of outcome.
It is the principle of the matter, if <insert car company here> sold or gave people a self crashing car with full purpose of intent that car company would be shut down. As with any other company or person distributing malicious products intentionally. At least in cases like this where the malicious activity and intent is so glaringly obvious. It wouldn't matter if that car company had a bone to settle with some other car company and this somehow showed them ... or maybe a better example, two different car part manufacturers who sell car parts that interact with each other and one of them modifying their part so that when it interacted with the other part it caused the vehicle to crash, just to settle some vendetta, no sane person would condone the behavior, but somehow because it is just a game and no one was actually hurt (physically anyways) it is alright to do this kind of thing to a product? I realize that very few modders make any money from what they do, but just because it is free malware doesn't make the problem any less serious.
Those who vote, and are in the majority they don't lose, they get their wish. If a poll news article link was posted on the launcher, it would gather a fair representation of the community. It would be interesting to see a bigger picture of how the community feels as a whole vs a select few who bother to read and contribute to 46+ pages of rants. I would imagine there would be a clearer picture.
As for democracy. Hm. The pack direction is definitely at the sole discretion of the FTB team regardless of the community. However by presenting some facts to the community, specifically advertising the fact that the thread exists on the launcher news it's clear that the FTB team are interested in the community (modders, server maintainers and users) views. Therefore in my personal opinion Democracy is already on the table.
~
You should read Slow's thread on your term 'malware' link afaik the GT mod purposefully shuts down, makes forge shut down during initialisation and thus the client albeit with some log entries. It's absolutely bad behaviour on the part of the mod author, but definitely not malware. A term used to distinctly brand software that generally has implications to a users privacy and security.
I agree with Fakehate, I wouldn't have even known about this issue if they hadn't of posted it to the news feed, well maybe once the change to the packs occurred, but the FTB team could've easily posted a forum sticky warning people to only post in this thread about this topic and it would've been just as effective. Instead they posted it to the news feed where a lot of people who don't normally participate in forum discussions were suddenly exposed to the issue at hand ... the only reason they would've done that is to garner user input, or because they were lazy and didn't want to put a sticky in every forum room ... I prefer to think it is the first reason, but I'll let the forum mod declare his reasons for doing it this way, or not, either way.
News automatically routes to the FTB launcher so that you'll get a notification even if you don't normally frequent the forums. That was probably the reasoning behind the decision.
Oh I remember now why I went to Uni on a crash course /goran. A place where I learnt the 'joys' of, cobol when I already programmed in C and assembler for over a decade. That said, as someone who interviews people from time to time. A well worded application with verifiable proof and history of accomplishments means more to me than someone fresh out of unigarten. this doesn't disprove your comment in any way. Human resource morons may as well be robots.
- Status