Recent Events Discussion (RED) Thread

RavynousHunter

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1.7.10 is still the best era for the modded scene. I wish there was a "modded edition" that stays at the same version (with minor updates by the community), then the modding community could ensure it's as optimised as possible without fear of all their hard work going to waste with the next vanilla update featuring changes that no one really wants.
Can't agree more. Unless there were something that undoes the cockup that is modern Minecraft combat, along with certain favourites making the move, I can't see myself going past 1.7.10 anytime soon. There's no compelling vanilla content that'd make me want to move, either; anything 1.8+ has, I can all but guarantee is in some mod or other in 1.7.10.
 

McJty

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Can't agree more. Unless there were something that undoes the cockup that is modern Minecraft combat, along with certain favourites making the move, I can't see myself going past 1.7.10 anytime soon. There's no compelling vanilla content that'd make me want to move, either; anything 1.8+ has, I can all but guarantee is in some mod or other in 1.7.10.
Did you try to get used to vanilla combat? I like the new mechanics. In the beginning it is hard but after a while you get used to it and I wouldn't want to go back now
 
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RavynousHunter

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Aye, I did. It just doesn't match what I feel Minecraft should be in that area. I like MC for its simplicity; having to manage not only two active tool slots, but keep track of differences in weapon speed, arc, and damage just makes things far too complicated. "Busy" is a good word.
 

keybounce

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Did you try to get used to vanilla combat? I like the new mechanics. In the beginning it is hard but after a while you get used to it and I wouldn't want to go back now
I did try to get used to the new combat mechanics.

It penalizes the player for being a player, as opposed to being the actual character.

First: Forge actually reverts some of the changes. Forge restores some of the 1.7.10 combat behavior, so if you do not have TheOldOne's combat mod in 1.10+, then you are not actually using the vanilla combat mechanics.

https://mods.curse.com/mc-mods/minecraft/243089-armor-recalc

Second: An actual character doing a full swing, and then another full swing as fast as possible, would not have problems. It's one thing if you just activate "fight". Instead, you have to say "Fight once. Pause. Fight once. Pause. Fight once".

Just think about what that is like in reality, if you were actually in that position. "Ee-Yah!. hmm. hold on, I need to think about if it's time to swing again. OK, Ey-YA!"

Yea, silly. *THAT* is what the 1.8+ combat changes do. Break immersion by having you, the player, subject to a handicap that your character/avatar would never have to deal with.

Is there a benefit? Sure. An unusual thing. I can swing an axe, and then rapidly punch someone with my fists. If I can keep wacking someone, I can keep them unable to attack for some reason. And yes, I have done that to punch a witch to death by never letting it get a potion off.

Easy? No.

Is it worth it? No. Not for me. Combat has gone from a relatively simple "Just keep fighting, don't get overwhelmed, run away a bit if you need to and space them out around a corner" to "One level below Nintendo hard".

I've gone from "No mob traps, you might as well earn your drops" to "Just make a mob trap, the combat isn't worth it anymore".
 

McJty

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Yea, silly. *THAT* is what the 1.8+ combat changes do. Break immersion by having you, the player, subject to a handicap that your character/avatar would never have to deal with.
Well I don't play swords in real life but is this actually the case? I can't imagine that you can (in real life) hit with a sword as fast as you could in 1.7.10. Swords are heavy objects (I know that at least) and it takes time before you can get the momentum back to swing again. I think that's what the combat mechanics try to simulate.

In any case, for me it works perfect. I greatly enjoy the new system personally
 

Inaeo

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Second: An actual character doing a full swing, and then another full swing as fast as possible, would not have problems. It's one thing if you just activate "fight". Instead, you have to say "Fight once. Pause. Fight once. Pause. Fight once".

Just think about what that is like in reality, if you were actually in that position. "Ee-Yah!. hmm. hold on, I need to think about if it's time to swing again. OK, Ey-YA!"
I think the difference is pace and strategy. Before the combat update, I would charge forth button-mashing until I felt overwhelmed, then retreat to recover health and the charge again. Now, that pace has slowed. I use the full charge for the sword sweep attack, but I use the spam between to reposition the battlefield. Knockback has become a boon, whereas before it was almost considered an annoyance. The retreat and lick your wounds break has been spread out over the course of the fight. I've not fallen in love with shields, but it's an option. I've found traveling with a wolf to be quite useful as well, so props for new Vanilla making other parts of old Vanilla shine.

On the other hand, this is modded Minecraft, so slap in Tinker's Construct with it's materials that add status effects and DOTs. Opt for a Rapier for faster attack speed. Explore handguns from Reliquary or Immersive Engineering, then automate ammo production to support your slaying habits. Ars Magica or PSI can be nice changes of pace.

I know it's different, and everyone is entitled to their preference, but I think it's been a breath of fresh air in a previously point and spam-click mechanic.
 
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GamerwithnoGame

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Well I don't play swords in real life but is this actually the case? I can't imagine that you can (in real life) hit with a sword as fast as you could in 1.7.10. Swords are heavy objects (I know that at least) and it takes time before you can get the momentum back to swing again. I think that's what the combat mechanics try to simulate.

In any case, for me it works perfect. I greatly enjoy the new system personally
Having actually fought with a metal longsword, you're spot on - the pace is actually much more like it would be IRL. It would be nice though, if MC introduced things like daggers in vanilla, which had a much shorter cooldown, but did concurrently lower damage.
 
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keybounce

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But in real life, if you are readying your next swing, doesn't it come when it is ready?

In minecraft, if you mis-time your press, you've done minimal damage and wasted your time.

i.e. -- yes, the pace of 1.9+ combat is more realistic (fine, but note that even TiC had slower weapons, so this isn't the only way to do this), but at the cost of making you track something that only exists because of the computer interface -- the time you have to wait before you press again.

---

Put another way: Lets say you had a system where, instead of button spam, you just held down the attack button, and your sword swung at the "natural" rate. No faster than the new combat speed, so the "pace" is the same. But now, there's no guesswork for the timing.

At the same time, you could button spam if you wanted to do the quick jabs for "board control" instead.

Where would you put that? I probably would call that a huge improvement over the current "guess when you get to attack next" system.
 
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Inaeo

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If your proposed system were I'm place, I likely wouldn't notice any difference. I prefer the manual process of attacking, as sometimes the optimal attack doesn't come the instant it would be ready. I'm not opposed to it being an option (or even default, really), but I would choose not to have it autoattack for me. I don't consider it guesswork as to when my attack is charged, as there is a very simple icon that tells me when I'm ready. Maybe it's my history of playing games like MechWarrior, where timing and placement of your shots were more critical than just spamming damage at the enemy, but I prefer combat to be a bit more tactical. Being good at combat should be a developed skill - anyone can swing a sword, but a skilled swordsman will make it look natural and easy.
 

RavynousHunter

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I'll grant that its a little realistic, you can't swing-spam even my 2kg longsword without running out of strength easily. This is why games typically have a stamina meter: you can swing madly for a little while and get away with it, but proper swordsmanship is all about timing.

BUT, that isn't Minecraft, if you ask me. For shit's sake, I can punch through a meter thick log in a few seconds, carry over a thousand cubic meters of solid gold (which would likely destroy even a tank's suspension), and scoop up molten lava in a freaking iron bucket. For me, Minecraft isn't about being realistic, its about being able to kick back and relax. Too much realism detracts from that. Again, this is all my own perspective, but to me, the new combat system just don't make fighting worth it, anymore.
 
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NJM1564

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I'll grant that its a little realistic, you can't swing-spam even my 2kg longsword without running out of strength easily. This is why games typically have a stamina meter: you can swing madly for a little while and get away with it, but proper swordsmanship is all about timing.

BUT, that isn't Minecraft, if you ask me. For shit's sake, I can punch through a meter thick log in a few seconds, carry over a thousand cubic meters of solid gold (which would likely destroy even a tank's suspension), and scoop up molten lava in a freaking iron bucket. For me, Minecraft isn't about being realistic, its about being able to kick back and relax. Too much realism detracts from that. Again, this is all my own perspective, but to me, the new combat system just don't make fighting worth it, anymore.

Of coarse I can't swing my solid gold sword around at all. But my wooden one is easier. But If I'm surrounded by the undead I'm swinging anything as fast as I can until my arms fall off.
 

Celestialphoenix

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Tartarus.. I mean at work. Same thing really.
But If I'm surrounded by the undead I'm swinging anything as fast as I can until my arms fall off.
Don't look at me- I'd be too busy puking my guts up to even consider holding a sword. If you've ever had a dead rat ferment in the loft/under the shed, or had a roommate leave something too long in the fridge you'll know just how bad a little bit of rotten meat smells; let alone the stench from several human sized cadavers.... :p
 

NJM1564

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Don't look at me- I'd be too busy puking my guts up to even consider holding a sword. If you've ever had a dead rat ferment in the loft/under the shed, or had a roommate leave something too long in the fridge you'll know just how bad a little bit of rotten meat smells; let alone the stench from several human sized cadavers.... :p
They leave jerky behind so I think they are mostly desiccated by now.
 

SevenMass

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TeamCofH said:
-Strongboxes - yeah, you know what these do.
Wheeee, :D Actually one of my favorite features of the mod.

Now the only thing I'm still missing, and the one thing I'm missing way more than even strongboxes. are the satchels.

It is a shame that TE's strongboxes and satchels aren't their own mod. If they where, then they could be included in modpacks where TE wouldn't fit, such as magic themed packs, or IC2 based tech packs.

It is unfortunate also, that the TeamCofH mods are all still in 1.10, while things are moving towards 1.11 already.
 

sgbros1

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Wheeee, :D Actually one of my favorite features of the mod.

Now the only thing I'm still missing, and the one thing I'm missing way more than even strongboxes. are the satchels.

It is a shame that TE's strongboxes and satchels aren't their own mod. If they where, then they could be included in modpacks where TE wouldn't fit, such as magic themed packs, or IC2 based tech packs.

It is unfortunate also, that the TeamCofH mods are all still in 1.10, while things are moving towards 1.11 already.
3 points:
1) Strongboxes basically are satchels. IIRC, if you shift right click a strongbox with a crescent hammer the contents of that strongbox will be stored. A bit more finnicky, but still portable storage nonetheless. Etho uses them all the time
2) There's already several mods that implement features similar to the strongboxes and satchels. You can move chests (with the contents inside) using chest transporters, and there are backpacks from several mods, some of which are standalone mods (I.e. they only have backpacks in them)
3) Last I heard they are porting to 1.11 (and 1.12, once Forge is released for it). It just takes some time. Update: According to KL's Twitter, 1.11 release is planned for by the end of the month
 

SevenMass

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1) Strongboxes basically are satchels. IIRC, if you shift right click a strongbox with a crescent hammer the contents of that strongbox will be stored. A bit more finnicky, but still portable storage nonetheless. Etho uses them all the time
I Know that, I use that to move project materials around. For example; I want to build a mob farm somewhere, so i collect building materials and redstone supplies into a strongbox, and then move the strongbox(es) to the building site and set up a building shack.

The satchels I use to keep tools with me, I switch them in and out of empty slots in my quickbar with shift click. I've tried doing the same thing with bagginses in the regrowth modpack, but shift-clicking on items in bagginses bags cause them to move to empty slots in the player inventory rather than the quickbar.

2) There's already several mods that implement features similar to the strongboxes and satchels. You can move chests (with the contents inside) using chest transporters, and there are backpacks from several mods, some of which are standalone mods (I.e. they only have backpacks in them)
In addition to the fact that not all bags favor empty quickbar slots over empty inventory slots. A lot of these bag mods are filled with lots of extra features and items and other kind of bloat. The TE satchels are just 4 tiers, or 4 items that take up item ID's computer memory and space in NEI/JEI. And in the latest version of TE this would even be reduced to 1 item. The bags from the Enderchest mod requires nether materials. [fill in a long list of things I don't like about other mods]

Or perhaps I can just rephrase this argument as: I just really like the way TE works, the way it implements things. Simple yet elegant, easy to get yet not OP.

3) Last I heard they are porting to 1.11 (and 1.12, once Forge is released for it). It just takes some time. Update: According to KL's Twitter, 1.11 release is planned for by the end of the month
That is good to hear, I kind of was expecting that already. I don't follow anyone's twitter.
 

Golrith

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new day, new update, and today it's @jaredlll08 with Visualize
Now if only there was a way to have a central location for Resource Packs, instead of having to copy resource packs to every instance of MC. I've got so many different copies of the same resource/texture pack taking up disk space scattered across numerous installations.
 

SevenMass

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new day, new update, and today it's @bdew with Leaf Decay Accelerator
So now there are 3 mods that do the exact same thing, down to the mod description. There is:
Fast Leaf Decay
Quick Leaf Decay
Leaf Decay Accelerator

Granted, FLD isn't updated to 1.12, however, QLD is! So, what gives?

Not that I'm complaining. I'd miss this mod if there isn't any.



On an unrelated note, I've noticed that the CoFH mods are all basically completed, they now have strongboxes and satchels, and they are updated to 1.12. :)

Now I'm still waiting for buildcraft, railcraft, ProdjectRED circuits, mystcraft, binnies-mods, a continuation of thaumcraft and a port of Witchery. *GASPS* And THEN I can finally recreate my modded environment from 1.7.10. :p (after CoFHWorld configs are documented)

EDIT: A mod that adds sleeping bags to 1.12 would be nice to have to.