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Pro tip: Don't force wrench Mystcraft desks.
- Thread starter Lohengrin
- Start date
SpitefulFox
New Member
Yes, pretty much. It more or less works on anything with a TileEntity. Since blocks aren't generally written with the Force Wrench in mind, this can lead to some spectacularly destructive glitches if you Force Wrench the wrong thing.
The problem being that certain "gatekeepers" are ruined by automation, right? What do you think would be a good alternative or fix? Or do you think placeable spawners should be abolished entirely?
Zenthon_127
New Member
Honestly, there isn't much about Dartcraft that is actually OP. A lot of it, like the tools, look OP until you realize you can probably get stupidly decked-out TiC tools faster than you can get a decent Force Pick. The only true OPness is Force Wrenchs on spawners, Loot Bags and worst of all Force Engines.
The armor by about T6 is actually quite a nice alternative to MPS.
Get 5 skelly spawners in one area set up in a fall damage configuration (the fall damaging them to 5% HP) and EXP becomes incredibly trivialized. Even more then it is already.
And that's before adding mods too. Factor in things like MFR Mob grinders and EXP catalizers form LXP and player placeable spawners start to look broken. You can also double dip if you have both MFR and LXP (Grinder kills mob, Catalizer counts that as a kill and the collecter takes the EXP while the Grinder makes mob essence, mob essence can then be converted in to LxP by Transposeing a bottle o enchanting created from the MFR auto enchant table, can be fully automated too trick is keeping the spawners working which is remedied by afking and doing something else).
Also if you use Infernal mobs you can end up with several diamond chests full of enchanted chain/iron/diamond gear you can reduce in to handy materials and also enchant books with the LxP isolator and that MFR one.
Infernal mobs is supposed to provide a rewarding challenge, but mobs from a spawner can become infernal and farmed like any other mob in a many mob spawners.
There is also that Magic generator you can pump exp in to but as you said there are better methods of power generation so that's a moot point.
The first one is major, the second not so much. By the 64th, you'll have more than you'd ever use on a server even if it stayed up for a year without wipes. Unless you use it directly as fuel in a IC2 generator/BC sterling engine (It's utterly nerfed in boilers). Which means it's pretty much the same as charcoal.
Which means a vanilla blaze spawner is a tree. That only grows when a player is within 16 blocks
...also, co-change is Dartcraft crafting spawners
...also^2: Gravity Gun, Portalgun, Portaspawner, MFFS
That's an awful lot of work (and afking within 16 blocks).
In general, modded minecraft balances out as "work required to design is profitable"
On a server, the 16 block player distance effectively makes any system relying on the output of such Broken as Designed, as it will quickly run out of product when the player logs off and thus have overall output far below any alternative. Also, the double dipping from MFR & LXP is fixed (except in a couple edge cases I won't disclose)
Even if you exclude the obvious usage of soul shard spawners, you can generate endless mob essence by using an auto spawner spawning slimes, leading to a drop trap to split it, and then the output of the drop to a grinder. As far as I'm aware this is Working As Intended because of the design effort involved.
(Auto grinder in normal mode (cost 150) with a single drop trap: Large becomes 4 medium, or medium becomes 4 small, generating 400 essence (small dies with no essence generation). Or grinder in exact mode (cost 500) making large slimes, leading to a double trap large->4 medium->16 small, grinding for 1600 essence. The second design is faster, the first smaller.)
Sounds like a problem inherent in any spawning ability brought about due to that specific mod.
And only relevant to this topic if you have both Dartcraft and Gregtech. Thus, not relevant in FTB.
ShneekeyTheLost
Too Much Free Time
Have you tried setting the Item ID of the Force Wrench to 0?
That removes the item...
Kirin may want the utility of the wrench for chests and machines but at the same time limit it's use on spawners.
Also Grav gun like block removal has not really been properly accounted for with protection plugins. And if I'm wrong and there is one I'd like to know.
ShneekeyTheLost
Too Much Free Time
The firs sentence in the quoted post was "I may be removing the Force Wrench, if possible".
In 1.5.2, Dartcraft has the best tools, bar none, and as-invulnerable-as powersuits, all available in an hour or so of server up.
In 1.6.2, leveling a tome up has been extended (perhaps too much) making it less of a "get early, and use forever" type mod.
And, in 1.5.2, for the cost of some leather and little else.[DOUBLEPOST=1378356642][/DOUBLEPOST]
Most mods crash on this, I don't know where the rumor this is the proper way to handle things started.
casilleroatr
New Member
I think Railcraft is designed specifically to have at least the invisible aura tracking (and maybe everything else in the mod) be disabled if you set the id to zero. There is a comment in the config about disabling tracking aura. Its the only place I have seen it from an "official" source.
Infallible83
New Member
Am I missing something in ther way I play the game? Why would you want that much EXP and why would having it be a problem?
I should point out that I do believe moving spawners to be OP - just curious why having EXP would be a benefit.
Infallible
Poppycocks
New Member
A drown trap would work better designing one that will drown any size slimes into the smallest ones is fairly trivial, considering they don't swim.
I'm with you on "not as op as", vanilla spawners are a joke in the face of SS or MFR, although improper stacking can leave you with a full stack of blaze spawners in a timely manner. Still a laugh, but I'd like if this was fixed. By forge, preferably.
When paired with mods like LxP and to a lesser extent MFR you can create a set of really tricked out tools.
Then again, I suppose enchanted tools have nothing on a fully decked out MPS so I guess it's a bit of a moot point.
That still doesn't come close to the XP a farm using bees can give, with the added benefit that you can leech XP when AFK. Also in the packs we already have Soulshard and MFR spawners that work much faster / more convenient than regular spawners. Combined together they really solve the issue of any mobdrop in-game.
The problem with the wrench isn't really a game balance one, it's a technical one. THe method it uses is incredibly dangerous, it's not something other modders should have to take into account when creating their mod, and it's very prone to actually breaking your world.
OmegaJasam
New Member
Honestly, at this point between MFR, bees, soul shards, dart craft, some natural gen added by other mods e.t.c. e.t.c. I think we would be better off trying to find better ways of gating/balancing then presuming you can't move spawners.
Though that wrench needs some tweaking. ^^
Though that wrench needs some tweaking. ^^