Power Converters complaining thread

[Succubism]

Perhaps I should be clearer.

I believe that people are indeed entitled to the opinions. What I don't believe is that someone's preferential opinion should dictate a decision that impacts the entirety of the populous that's involved with it whether it's in the majority or not. The choice should always be there to accommodate both parties which it currently, already does with the use of the edit modpack feature.

OP is correct in assuming his opinion matters, however he is also correct in saying that the opinion is redundant for the reasons I've just stated and therefore this discussion, as previously stated, is irrelevant.[DOUBLEPOST=1369235298][/DOUBLEPOST]

Do you really think just one person's opinion is going to influence anything?

Yes.
In our world's history and indeed with FTB and the use of GregTech in which in it's initial announcement of inclusion to FTB was controversial to the majority however this is no longer the case.

 

[Hydra]

Yes.

So if one person's opinion can influence what is in and what is not in a pack you want them to shut up if you disagree with them?

We don't need self appointed forum police deciding what we can and cannot discuss. The OP is fully in his right to dislike a certain mod and 'bitch' about it. That you can disable mods is, aside from that most servers use default pack settings, not relevant to a discussion about the core qualities of mods in the pack. That argument works the other way around too; you're free to add whatever mod you want if it's not in the pack.

 

[Succubism]

So if one person's opinion can influence what is in and what is not in a pack you want them to shut up if you disagree with them?

Not at all. In the case of this particular subject, if he wants to complain about it he's in his rights to, but acknowledge that you can't expect anything to happen as a result of it.

We don't need self appointed forum police deciding what we can and cannot discuss.

I don't think of myself as forum police, I think of myself as a realist and a fan of the modpack and a believer that the mod in question is doing more harm than good, however you've become so absorbed in my disagreement with the way this is handled that you didn't even know that because we've derailed so far from the already redundant point it's rediculous.

The OP is fully in his right to dislike a certain mod and 'bitch' about it. That you can disable mods is, aside from that most servers use default pack settings, not relevant to a discussion about the core qualities of mods in the pack. That argument works the other way around too; you're free to add whatever mod you want if it's not in the pack.

I think there's been some justified misunderstanding. I apologize, I'm not too good at arguing my point in English.
As I said, I agree with you, he's perfectly able to do as he pleases, I have no quarrel with that. What I have issue with is if he expects something to change based on his preference.
You do have a point however in saying it works both ways and if this was any other mod what people wanted in the pack but people didn't, I'd be saying if you want it, add it yourself, however the fact of the matter is this mod already exists in this pack and the point of discussion OP had in mind is that he didn't like it, therefore the best thing to say is, and OP himself has recognized this, if you don't like it, disable it.

And I would tell this to people who didn't like GregTech either, because believe me, I know a few people who don't and I'm personally not too into it either.


The thing is, I've introduced three people to FTB since I started playing it. My girlfriend and two good friends and they think, and I agree, that GregTech makes things way too complicated for a beginner. Power Converters, however, makes things a little simpler. Especially for Tekkit transistors (If that's the right word.)[DOUBLEPOST=1369236799][/DOUBLEPOST]I'm going to end my discussion about that here as OP has. I think this is becoming dangerously close to a derailment and really that's nobody's fault, however Hydra, if you want to continue talking about this, send me a pm okay? Just keeps us both out of trouble.

 

[Deleted member 38496]

I haven't read most of the thread yet, so I'm not sure if this has been adressed yet, but at least one person complained that converting between different forms of energy doesn't make any sense. IC2, UE, Factorization, and RP2 all use AC electrical current. Buildcraft produces energy through mechanical conversions from a lot of different energy sources, but conduits and conductive pipe seem to convey energy in some form of electric current or magnetic flux. XyCraft will use electromagnetic radiation. All of these energy forms are closely related so why not have a way to change between them?

I do agree though that there should definitely be some amount of energy loss when converting energy. Producing steam directly from electricity makes no sense at all; at the very least it should require a water input. Overall, I think this mod mostly needs to be fleshed out a little further beyond placing a couple blocks for an electrical adapter.

 

[Succubism]

I do agree though that there should definitely be some amount of energy loss when converting energy. Producing steam directly from electricity makes no sense at all; at the very least it should require a water input. Overall, I think this mod mostly needs to be fleshed out a little further beyond placing a couple blocks for an electrical adapter.

I've not touched steam yet. Could you summarize it's uses to me?

 

[Hydra]

I've not touched steam yet. Could you summarize it's uses to me?

http://railcraft.wikispaces.com/

Steam drives steam engines that produce MJ. Why it can be a product of a power convertor beats me. Why you'd want to go for (for example) EU > steam > engines instead of EU > MJ I don't understand either. It really doesn't make any sense.

 

[RedBoss]

You know what makes no sense? Being able to carry 2,304 logs, which even if they were balsa would weight 391,680kg, yet you are limited to only 36 bottles of water in the same inventory slots. Its a game, play it any way you like and leave people alone about their play styles.

 

[Loufmier]

i wonder how many ppl, that are against steam conversion into other power, do not use solars?

 

[Deleted member 38496]

I've not touched steam yet. Could you summarize it's uses to me?

Steam is produced by Railcraft boilers, which require a water source and fuel to maintain their temperature. Steam is usually used for production of MJ and EU through Railcraft steam engines (commercial and industrial) and steam turbines respectively, although it can also be used to power Railcraft's steam oven multiblock which smelts multiple items at a time. There's also an option for IC2 Nuclear Reactors to produce steam instead of producing EU directly. (Hobbyist steam engines and Railcraft locomotives use steam power as well, but produce the steam internally from fuel and water and cannot accept steam produced externally.)

I have absolutely no idea why PowerConverters even has a way to convert other energy forms into steam, seeing as it is almost always used solely for producing those other energy forms. Using a single block to convert unlimited quantities of steam to other energy forms also seems incredibly overpowered compared to the multitudes of industrial steam engines or the steam turbines that require frequent replacing of steel-intensive turbine blades. Some multiblock construct or more complicated method for converting steam into power for an energy bridge would be a lot more interesting to work with in my opinion.

 

[PhilHibbs]

I don't mind conversion of steam to EU or MJ or whatever, but does it convert the other way around? That would be silly, turning energy directly into steam without water being involved.

 

[Lambert2191]

When you don't have constructive argument, you can always pick out spelling errors and typos.

In fairness thats a very light hearted way of picking out a typo. I haven't had too much experience with PC, so I couldn't argue either way. I'd say quite a few of the more heated argumentors here have the same or less experience then me too .

 

[hotblack desiato]

I don't mind conversion of steam to EU or MJ or whatever, but does it convert the other way around? That would be silly, turning energy directly into steam without water being involved.

that would be an idea, if there is a finite water mod involved. but with infinite water, it's just irrelevant. aqueous accumulator + steam generator... done.

 

[Zjarek_S]

the steam turbines that require frequent replacing of steel-intensive turbine blades..

It is not often replacing, now it is repairing every 63 hours (454 mln EU) using 24 steel.

 

[PhilHibbs]

that would be an idea, if there is a finite water mod involved. but with infinite water, it's just irrelevant. aqueous accumulator + steam generator... done.

I don't see how that is relevant. I think it's cool that you need a big boiler and water and fuel to make steam. One block that turns electricity into steam? Just seems silly to me. A bit like EE. It devalues everything by introducing artificial and arbitrary equivalence.

 

[hotblack desiato]

it is. it makes the boiler much more efficient than the standard combustion engine. with finite water, you need to think which machine consumes more or less water. even the igneous extruder isn't a good option anymore (no free stone, suddenly it costs 1 waterbucket).

on the other hand, people need to start draining oceans or set up large cactus farms and squeeze cactus...

 

[Runo]

I have absolutely no idea why PowerConverters even has a way to convert other energy forms into steam, seeing as it is almost always used solely for producing those other energy forms. Using a single block to convert unlimited quantities of steam to other energy forms also seems incredibly overpowered compared to the multitudes of industrial steam engines or the steam turbines that require frequent replacing of steel-intensive turbine blades. Some multiblock construct or more complicated method for converting steam into power for an energy bridge would be a lot more interesting to work with in my opinion.

I think its important to note that Power converters have bandwidth caps on both input and output, which become something you have to plan around when you have massive power setup. Steam Consumers only allow for 1000 steam a piece, and the maximum amount of energy you can output from a energy bridge is 2048eu/t per side. For steam, the optimal energy bridge configuration is 5 steam consumers and 1 ic2 EV producer, which will consume 5.7 HP steam boilers worth of steam and send out 2048eu/t. For someone like me who has 16 boilers, that means using 3 bridges and merging their output, then converting that amount to the desired format via another bridge or transformers. It actually starts getting expensive and forces you to have what amounts to a "transformer room" for all the conversions and power switching. For those who decry my EU power generation as cheap, I ask them to propose the idea of 260 thermal generators and all the crucibles they'd require to their server admin.

Oh, and along these lines, also propose the idea of banning boilers since its the ubiquitous go-to power source for anyone who doesn't want to spend all day moving pumps or manning a reactor. It boggles my mind that the people complaining about the easiest power conversion methods are the ones who use the lowest maintenance and most efficient form of energy generation. I started on thermals, and at 88 I was moving my nether pumps twice a day. I then burned through my entire uu and iridium supply from half a week making 256eu/t worth of solar panels. Everyone uses boilers because they're the easiest and the best. Power converters are like its twin sister.

And now, I must make my exit. I think there's a mob of boiler-biomass users with pitchforks at my door.

 

[Siro]

http://railcraft.wikispaces.com/

Steam drives steam engines that produce MJ. Why it can be a product of a power convertor beats me. Why you'd want to go for (for example) EU > steam > engines instead of EU > MJ I don't understand either. It really doesn't make any sense.

steam>liquid tesseract>power converter mj or eu. Basically I use it in order to have a remote power supply without having to have large arrays of engines at the destination. I could probably use the IDSU, or energy tesseracts but the IDSU is bandwidth limited and energy tesseracts suck up power. Liquid tesseracts have no such drawbacks and you can have as much bandwidth as you have channels on liquid tesseracts. I could and have done the same thing with lava, but magmatics and thermal generators don't produce enough per block to be feasible for that on a server. Once I get the fusion reactor up and running, steam will be replaced with plasma and plasma generators. I'm not sure why steam is a producer or consumer in power converters when there are a lot of liquids that could also fill that role (lava, methane, biofuel, biomass, oil, fuel, plasma, etc). But it is damn convenient that a liquid IS power convertable, otherwise I'd be losing a lot of energy through energy tesseracts.

 

[Daemonblue]

Which was my main point against steam conversion when this was initially added into FTB. You can easily use liquid tesseracts to move the steam around and not have any power loss for doing so and then use the converters as replacement engines. Also, the converters can be used to replace a massive amount of engines by having as high of a throughput as it does.

 

[Greyed]

And now, I must make my exit. I think there's a mob of boiler-biomass users with pitchforks at my door.

Does it help that I don't have Forestry installed so my past 3 boilers have been, in order, 12LP solid fueled, 12LP solid fueled, 36HP liquid fueled. I'll leave it as an exercise to the reader (or looking at my posting history) as to how each was fueled if not with Forestry.

Well, that and the fact that if people want to use PC, go for it. I did way back before I just kicked IC2 to the curb.

 

[hotblack desiato]

@Siro:

the high end solution for that (if you have the ressources to creade IDSUs, you have the ressources for that too): set up a fusion reactor and supply it constantly with deuterium and tritium aswell as energy. take the plasma and feed it into a liquid tesseract (optional: extra tanks like railcraft tanks or the quantum tank).

and there you go, wireless high end energy. the setup on the receiver side is just another tesseract plus the plasma generator and a few transformers to get the voltage down. a nice and quite space saving setup.