Mystcraft is extremely OP to a game breaking degree.

[Froghandler]

This thread is not about whether FTB or Survival Mode should be balanced or not. Slowpoke has stated that he intends for FTB to have some measure of balance. If you post involves whether or not FTB should be balanced, your post will be reported as spam.


Here's the result of a single spelunking trip:

after fortune III:

665 diamonds, more than I would ever possibly need. Also shows all the gold I mined, and some gems I grabbed.

Here's the world settings if you want to replicate. It only takes a few tries to get a suitable world.

Hell biome (So that only rare ghasts spawn as enemies.)
Dense ores (where all the OPness really lies)
Single biome
Cave World (to get the waterline and base ground height low.)
Ravines (To expose large sections at diamond levels.)
Caves (More low access)
Bright (So as to not need torches/headlamps)

What you do is simply fly around looking for low-lying caves and ravines, and mine away. The solitary debuff I had was Mining Fatigue 3, which was offset by my Efficiency IV picks. The world also had relatively slow moving corruption (I've seen it a lot faster) that I could easily outfly after spelunking in ravines and caves. It also had useless meteors that hit the world top, and random explosions that weren't a worry.


This is a serious problem because it makes rare ores all but worthless. Price of entry is exceedingly low: cow, chicken, and sugarcane farms, and then simply spamming of ages. I haven't tested, but I imagine that even Iridium would be easy to amass on a server environment if a user uses a texture pack that makes the ore stand out. If you run a server and use Mystcraft, or don't want the temptation on single player, you will definitely want to set heavy_resources.enabled=false in Mystcraft config. I think this is pretty strong evidence that this tag should be set to false by default in the pack.

 

[sciguyryan]

It isn't broken or OP in any sense of the world.

1. You aren't forced to use it for mining, the fact that you do is your choice.
2. Getting that many diamonds in game with a set of turtles and mining carts is also not really very difficult.

As with 99% of things people complain about OP, it really isn't. Any system when correctly manipulated becomes "OP".

 

[Aalandriel]

In order to have made this age, I'm thinking you either have been quite lucky in your Mystcraft exploration, spent a long time jumping through ages or you spawned in the notebook in creative.

• If notebook was spawned why complain about OP? You turned on cheat mode.
• If you went through a lot of ages, then you deserve the spoils of your perseverance.
• If you've just been Lucky, go buy a lottery ticket.

If you don't like it, you can just disable the denseore symbol in the config file. Problem solved

 

[Seilaerion]

Quarries are OP because you can leave them running and obtain tons of ore without even actually playing.
Fillers are OP because you can use them to fill in or empty areas(even working as a potentially faster quarry) without actually doing the work.
Turtles are OP because you can program them to do those things and more.
All automation systems are OP because of those same reasons.

At this rate we won't have any mods left in the pack!!

Using Mystcraft's features to one's advantage is a part of the strategy of the pack, just like the usage of every other mod is. If you don't like it, then you're free to disable it, but it's not a "bug". I wouldn't be against more aggressive decay, though. Dense Ores is designated to always make the world unstable as a deterrent, but with the current speed of decay it's almost laughable. I've yet to have an Age genuinely seem dangerous.

Also I would have recommended a Mushroom Island biome so that there are no enemies at all, rather than a Hell biome. Also really useful for grabbing leather for books.

 

[Mageleon]

Mystcraft isn't overpowered unless you make it overpowered, what im saying is don't use dense ores but i do agree with you a little bit and i suggest it should be removed or changed.

 

[Wall]

Just turn off the mod if its OP problem fixed

 

[Celestialphoenix]

Normally the instability balances it out a little more. But you went to the effort of making an OP age for the purpose of being OP- so you broke your game.

Most servers usually set limits for age types, so this is rarely a problem in SMP (if staff know what their doing)

As for SSP- its your call. You chose to break your game. There are other ways to get crazy resources (solar factory-> mass fab, a frame bore at diamond level will outstrip your mining trip and its fully automated)

 

[Froghandler]

So far there's two type of arguments in this thread:

1) The power of Mystcraft dense ores is comparable to other mining methods from other mod packs.

Rebuttal: Show me a method that can net 665 diamonds in 20 minutes. This is categorically different than other mining methods.

2) "you don't have to use it"

The stated opinion of the FtB team is to have game balance. This is why they don't have Timber! or a similar mod that automatically chops down trees if the bottom block is broken, as well as other mods that are unbalanced. If you are arguing that FtB shouldn't be balanced, take it up with the FtB team, who you are arguing against. I enjoy this mod pack a great deal, and made this post to point out what I see as a huge exploit to try to help.

 

[Bibble]

So far there's two type of arguments in this thread:

1) The power of Mystcraft dense ores is comparable to other mining methods from other mod packs.

Rebuttal: Show me a method that can net 665 diamonds in 20 minutes. This is categorically different than other mining methods.

No, you need to look at actual time and effort spend, and methods used. As has been said before:

Either, you discovered the dens ores symbol legitimately, by luck or perseverance. The symbol is very rare, and take a lot of time, and wasted ages to aquire. Once you have it, you need to either write your age around instability, or work around it while mining. The actual effort put in here, is quite great, and the reason that I don't bother with mystcraft dense ores when mining in SSP.

Or, you creative'd a notebook in for the symbols. The appropriate thing here is that there is nothing stopping you creative'ing the diamonds, or the products of the diamonds. Mystcraft is a tool, and should be used as such. Using it in ways not intended (cheating in the notebook), and expecting the same level of balance is a false assertion.

The creative notebook is intended for server admins to be able to create custom ages without going through the hassle of finding the symbols individually, the same way that they can go into creative and build an awesome spawn home out of diamond and gold blocks without actually digging it all up.


The second point you were rebuffing was valid. Mods should be included in the pack with the intention that they will all work together, or there is no point in having separate modpacks to begin with.

 

[Aalandriel]

As far as I understand it, Timber is not in the pack because it's not balanced with the other mods in the pack. As in, it's too cheap to accomplish what the mod does in comparison to other mods that offers the same functionality.

Mystcraft is OP when pushed to it, but it's not OP at the cost of the functionality of other mods. And that I think is one of the factors of determining if a mod is OP. Resource cost vs. compatibility/interference with other mods.

 

[Celestialphoenix]

So far there's two type of arguments in this thread:

Rebuttal: Show me a method that can net 665 diamonds in 20 minutes. This is categorically different than other mining methods.

Build a frame bore in your dense ores world. *Trollface*

 

[siriusblack9999]

Quarries are OP because you can leave them running and obtain tons of ore without even actually playing.
Fillers are OP because you can use them to fill in or empty areas(even working as a potentially faster quarry) without actually doing the work.
Turtles are OP because you can program them to do those things and more.
All automation systems are OP because of those same reasons.

At this rate we won't have any mods left in the pack!!

Using Mystcraft's features to one's advantage is a part of the strategy of the pack, just like the usage of every other mod is. If you don't like it, then you're free to disable it, but it's not a "bug". I wouldn't be against more aggressive decay, though. Dense Ores is designated to always make the world unstable as a deterrent, but with the current speed of decay it's almost laughable. I've yet to have an Age genuinely seem dangerous.

Also I would have recommended a Mushroom Island biome so that there are no enemies at all, rather than a Hell biome. Also really useful for grabbing leather for books.

i've actually had a mystcraft age be so unstable i dug about 20 blocks down in a stairwell, and ran into some instability, and by the time i got back the instability had already eaten my entire landing platform, along with my linkbook back home(granted, i did have about 20 dense ores symbols in at that point)

i have found 1 bug, however, instability eating a world anchor doesn't disable the chunk loading.

i set up a quarry on a seemingly innocent world, on my landing platform, along with a world anchor and left, when i got back there was a column of purple corruption in a 5*5 chunk spanning from bedrock(i think) up to max world height

 

[Aalandriel]

i have found 1 bug, however, instability eating a world anchor doesn't disable the chunk loading.

i set up a quarry on a seemingly innocent world, on my landing platform, along with a world anchor and left, when i got back there was a column of purple corruption in a 5*5 chunk spanning from bedrock(i think) up to max world height

Maybe due to quarries now have the chunk loading ability? You don't need to place a world anchor with a quarry any more

 

[FMan_0000]

In order to have made this age, I'm thinking you either have been quite lucky in your Mystcraft exploration, spent a long time jumping through ages or you spawned in the notebook in creative.

• If notebook was spawned why complain about OP? You turned on cheat mode.
• If you went through a lot of ages, then you deserve the spoils of your perseverance.
• If you've just been Lucky, go buy a lottery ticket.

If you don't like it, you can just disable the denseore symbol in the config file. Problem solved

I agree. If you were lucky or you went through a lot of ages, you deserve it. If you cheated, you're breaking your own game.

 

[ICountFrom0]

it takes, on average, 500 worlds to get a dense ore world.
The odds of getting only one corruption, VERY low. The odds of that corruption being something you could survive, very VERY low.

You gambled, and hit the jackpot, this does not mean that the entire lotto is broken.

 

[FMan_0000]

it takes, on average, 500 worlds to get a dense ore world.
The odds of getting only one corruption, VERY low. The odds of that corruption being something you could survive, very VERY low.

You gambled, and hit the jackpot, this does not mean that the entire lotto is broken.

Mystcraft were on my personal mod pack many, many time, and I never found a dense ores world without cheating.

 

[QueWhat]

I'm posting this under "bugs" because it truly breaks the game.

While I understand your point of view and believe that it has allowed others to bring up some very interesting points, I disagree with your statement above. The definition of a bug (per good 'ol Wikipedia) is:

A software bug is an error, flaw, mistake, failure, or fault in a computer program or system that produces an incorrect or unexpected result, or causes it to behave in unintended ways.

There is no computer program or system mistake here, the mod you describe is working as intended. As other users said, you simply either got lucky, used cheats, or worked hard to earn that world But that does not mean that the game is broken

 

[warfighter67]

I'm posting this under "bugs" because it truly breaks the game.



What you do is simply fly around looking for low-lying caves and ravines, and mine away. The solitary debuff I had was Mining Fatigue 3, which was offset by my Efficiency IV picks. The world also had relatively slow moving corruption (I've seen it a lot faster) that I could easily outfly after spelunking in ravines and caves. It also had useless meteors that hit the world top, and random explosions that weren't a worry.

You got very lucky to get such an insignificant instability in this dense ores age. Also, how were you flying in legit survival? Unless it's an IC2 jetpack, it would have been extremely expensive.

 

[Jugg3rV]

I consider mystcraft op, too. Compared to other mods and builds you don't need to do anything to get a new setup with lots of ores but 2 books. Mystcraft even strips you from the need to move to other places, after you took all ore. You just click a book and thats it. On the other hand it really gives players access to unlimited ressources, which a real sandbox needs. But i think this access is far to easy to acomplish. Discussing early and late game balance in this post will be a waste of time.

 

[arkangyl]

The mod author of Mystcraft has already addressed the potential "cheapness" of Mystcraft. The cost for the books is planned to increase in future updates, and he is working on planning out a research system a la Thaumcraft for obtaining symbols, with scaled difficulty of acquisition for each.

Also, as others have stated, Dense Ores can require traveling to hundreds of Ages to even find it, and once found, it requires dozens more Ages to find one that is stable enough to mine in and make it out alive. It's not OP. It's called a reward for time invested. If you Creatived in a Notebook, that's on you.