Equivalent Exchange has to go.

[wolfsilver00]

[

I agree with everything you have said, however, when playing on a server if some dickhead covers my house in obsidian because he could make it using wood before I've even made a diamond pick I still have a problem hehe.

I did the extreme version when I played tekkit, I deleted ee2 from the pack because I felt it was too much. ee3 is only small atm but if it got to a point where I felt the same way as I did about ee2 I'd prefer being able to make some config changes than totally removing it.

If config changes were available I'd set obsidian, ender pearls and blaze rods to false as I like the natural gated progression that these three things give in minecraft (for everyone on the server); nether entry, access to the end, requirement for anether fortressfor ender chests/brewing stands etc. respectively

Im sorry, but i fail at finding the logic behind this, first: Almost every servers has a system of ownership, if you build somewhere without this system, (like in the wilds) you're and will be a target to grief. This is a common issue in any server (and in my opinion, its one of the best things, i do not grief but i do enjoy raiding and setting traps for griefers..) and it is NOT linked with ee3. First of all, How much obsidian you would need to cover a house? just dig down, dig forward, dig up, you're home. And now you even have a fortress because someone wasted his time making your house, better.

Besides, in servers, there will always be ppl more advanced than you, dont bitch about obsidian, once i had my whole base ate by a mffs. And i did what i had to... Just made another base... And this time, i protected it as soon as i could with mffs.. (i do not like city areas, i find limited space to be a nuisance and as i said, kill griefers is just too fun )

Ee3 can make obsidian from wood, yeah, but you can use Ee3 to make some iron and dig diamonds, then mine the obsidian, then: Profit!

And as a side note, you could get griefed with mffs, warded shit, or bedrock if there is a stupid admin. Don't like it? Play in cities, don't like cities? Play in wild and dont bitch about being griefed. Don't like Ee3? Dont play in a server which has Ee3.. Every one can play how they want, and your opinion about a mod being removed from a mod pack which has tons of users, just because your house got trapped in obsidian, may not be taken for the developers because: Thats how minecraft is, every system will be OP if you know how to use it.

 

[Moezso]

[

Im sorry, but i fail at finding the logic behind this, first: Almost every servers has a system of ownership, if you build somewhere without this system, (like in the wilds) you're and will be a target to grief. This is a common issue in any server (and in my opinion, its one of the best things, i do not grief but i do enjoy raiding and setting traps for griefers..) and it is NOT linked with ee3. First of all, How much obsidian you would need to cover a house? just dig down, dig forward, dig up, you're home. And now you even have a fortress because someone wasted his time making your house, better.

Besides, in servers, there will always be ppl more advanced than you, dont bitch about obsidian, once i had my whole base ate by a mffs. And i did what i had to... Just made another base... And this time, i protected it as soon as i could with mffs.. (i do not like city areas, i find limited space to be a nuisance and as i said, kill griefers is just too fun )

Ee3 can make obsidian from wood, yeah, but you can use Ee3 to make some iron and dig diamonds, then mine the obsidian, then: Profit!

And as a side note, you could get griefed with mffs, warded shit, or bedrock if there is a stupid admin. Don't like it? Play in cities, don't like cities? Play in wild and dont bitch about being griefed. Don't like Ee3? Dont play in a server which has Ee3.. Every one can play how they want, and your opinion about a mod being removed from a mod pack which has tons of users, just because your house got trapped in obsidian, may not be taken for the developers because: Thats how minecraft is, every system will be OP if you know how to use it.

I agree, blaming obsidian griefing on EE3 is asinine, obsidian is available in vanilla. Without any mods at all you can go from punching wood to mining obsidian in minutes. How many youtube vids are there of people finding diamonds in 2 minutes? Punch a few trees, make wooden pick. Dig shaft straight down to Y<16, grabbing a few iron and coal on the way down. Make a furnace, smelt iron, make some stone picks, pick a direction, start mining till you find diamonds. Go back and grab your iron from furnace, make iron pick, harvest diamonds you just found, mine obsidian. Imo, it would take about as long to farm enough wood, then minium shards, then craft it all up to obsidian.

The real answer to obsidian griefing (or any griefing) is to play on a server with friends. Then way even when that griefer infiltrates your server, and encases your house in obsidian, your buddies can loan you a laser or some diamonds, and even help you clean up. Then form a posse and retaliate. There should be a new trophy - Griefer head.

 

[NJM1564]

I agree with everything you have said, however, when playing on a server if some dickhead covers my house in obsidian because he could make it using wood before I've even made a diamond pick I still have a problem hehe.

That's called grief. Like shit it happens. If you are playing on a decent server the admen can deal with it. And if you want perfect security. Build in a mystcraft age and keep the book to your self.

 

[Moezso]

Build in a mystcraft age and keep the book to your self.

Now that's a great idea.

P.S. I'm not terribly experienced with Mystcraft, but I was under the impression you left the book behind when you teleported to an age. Is there a way to take it with you?

 

[Hoff]

Now that's a great idea.

P.S. I'm not terribly experienced with Mystcraft, but I was under the impression you left the book behind when you teleported to an age. Is there a way to take it with you?

There is but it's fairly expensive. At least there used to be with the link modifier.

 

[NJM1564]

There is but it's fairly expensive. At least there used to be with the link modifier.

Intra linking is something that he's going to be putting back in in some fashion. I asked about that.

 

[NJM1564]

Now that's a great idea.

P.S. I'm not terribly experienced with Mystcraft, but I was under the impression you left the book behind when you teleported to an age. Is there a way to take it with you?

No that's a good idea. It still would take a while to set up. A great idea would be a server with a spawner at the spawn point that gives all players a normal age so they can go there immediately. Though it would take a rather beefy system to prevent generating all the ages from making lag.

 

[ryanjh5521]

Not as OP as EE3 now is it?

Oops. Gotta correct my self on that one. I meant EE2 not EE3. Please excuse my ignorance.

 

[Belleend97]

If you don't want to use EE3 then don't use it. Some people struggle to find diamonds and gold so it gives the players an advantage to aqquire these ores. Same with other blocks. Removing the mod just for you or others that see it as a cheat way of gaining materials and ores is just stupid. Personally when the mod is updated and offers more to the players i would like to keep it.

 

[wolfsilver00]

Though i do think the mystcraft ages are a good idea, i must question: Why you would make a mystcraft age to play by yourself in a server? Play singleplayer and you're done :s whats the point of playing alone in a server? :S

And.. If i could post an idea too... 4x4 coal ore and inside, pedestal with book. Age protected against x-ray

And, as Belleend97 said, and ppl usually fail to understand: Ee3 is in development (as thaumcraft is), it's just nowhere near what pahimar wants it to be.. And you may ask how do i know / why do i think this? Well, i like to watch anime, and Ee3 is based in Full Metal Alchemist. Simple as that. I know it because there's redwater, and other kind of stuff highly related to FMA.. If my logic is correct, Ee3 will be harder than it is now, but at the same time, it will give some more OP transmutations when the red water is implemented.

Little explaining of FMA:

World of alchemist, they use the "equivalent exchange" to transmute materials, usually, transmuting into valuables is forbidden (like making gold) and transmuting live materia is forbidden and has a death penalty. The red water is something toxic, highly toxic.. Which is used to make copies of the philosophers stone, which is a legendary object supposedly able to help in transmuting things ignoring the equivalent exchange rule.

What we see as the minium stone, is this kind of copy.
To make the philosophers stone SPOILER ALERT, if you want to see the anime, don't read this :

Spoiler

A human transmutation circle must be draw, and a lot of humans lives are needed to make it, in FMA there's an organization which basically, draws a human transmutation circle in the whole main city, and sometimes they say that maybe that, isn't enough... in minecraft it could mean a villagers massacre or an epic mob hunt.

So, please, wait until the mod is fully developed to complain/admire.. By now, limit to play with it, if you don't like it, disable it in Ssp and just don't use it in servers.
You don't have to be "unfair" with your game, so OP mods doesn't exist, as long as you have power on your own will. In servers, if someother uses it, it doesn't mean you have to, there's a lot of dirt houses in servers, that means you build your house with dirt? What others do, is their problem, play how YOU want, and let other plays how they want.

 

[Dravarden]

I find it amusing that people complain about GregTech ruining FTB for adding more grinding an generally slowing the game down, whereas people complain about EE3 for being too fast

the ones that complain that gregtech is slow are NOT the ones that complain that EE3 is fast.

 

[KirinDave]

I think it should either be removed from the ultimate pack, or be nerfed in such a way that it actually works with ftb. Like, disabling EnderPearl/Clay/Obsidian --> Iron exchange.

Wow, you think the downconversion FROM pearls to iron is op? You are offended by the opposite thing of almost everyone else on the forums.

As it stands, this mod is incredibly op

It has ONE broken recipe in MC 1.4.7, and that's the blaze rod exploit. Everything else is you making what I think are weird complaints. Let's look at your breakdown again:

Cobble Generator --> Grind to Gravel --> Minium into Clay --> Autocraft into Clay Blocks --> Minium into Iron, then Gold, then Diamonds. And Minium stones are cheap to make.

Or you could turn coal into infinite diamonds. Build a 64x64 quarry, power it with lots of coal, get a ton of diamonds just from the output, then use IC2 and buildcraft to automatically compress about half the coal you find and turn it into diamonds, and use the rest to keep the system going. And that has fewer steps. And it is not significantly harder.

While we're on the subject your path to gold is crazy long and inefficient. Why not just make a zombie pigman spawner and use that to farm infinite gold? You will farm a LOT of gold even if you don't use soul shards and just use a vanilla piston farm in the nether. Since you have chunkloaders and tesseracts and computercraft turtles and minefactory reloaded conveyors, you can do this even more easily.

And you're in Ultimate. Did you know that once you have sustainable power you have infinite copper, tin, silver AND gold if you pipe lava into GT centrifuges? No cells required, even. And thermal expansion can turn buildcraft energy into infinite lava! So all you need is a lot of energy. Good thing there aren't ways to make infinite power or Gregtech would be OP!

Wait... you're in Ultimate, did you know that if you use BC energy to make lava, then use powerconverters to loop back EU energy generated from thermal generators to buildcraft to make more lava, then you have a positive power loop? And did you know that steam->EU via powerconverters is crazy cheap, and that ONE 1-chunk Steve's Carts 2 treefarm will power at least 2 solid fuel boilers and maybe even 3 liquid boilers in perpetuity with no maintenance if you do it right? Oh shucks, we do have infinite power.

Q.E.D., folks. Gregtech: OP.

invalidates a number of unique and cool features from other mods

Not only is this wrong, but it's pretty clear you don't even know all the features of the mods to suggest which one should be invalidated. I think you dislike it because it's popular to dislike "Equivalent Exchange".

And if you want to feel that way? Fine. Go for it. But it feels weird for you to tell us the mod is OP in the modpack when your evidence is that it is easy to make a lot of stuff. But EE3 is getting nerfed a bit in 1.5.1 (the way a LOT of mods are, actually!). The minium shard drop rate has plummeted.

 

[NJM1564]

And you're in Ultimate. Did you know that once you have sustainable power you have infinite copper, tin, silver AND gold if you pipe lava into GT centrifuges? No cells required, even. And thermal expansion can turn buildcraft energy into infinite lava! So all you need is a lot of energy. Good thing there aren't ways to make infinite power or Gregtech would be OP!

Wait... you're in Ultimate, did you know that if you use BC energy to make lava, then use powerconverters to loop back EU energy generated from thermal generators to buildcraft to make more lava, then you have a positive power loop? And did you know that steam->EU via powerconverters is crazy cheap, and that ONE 1-chunk Steve's Carts 2 treefarm will power at least 2 solid fuel boilers and maybe even 3 liquid boilers in perpetuity with no maintenance if you do it right? Oh shucks, we do have infinite power.

Pisst you forgot solar power.

 

[Azzanine]

I find it amusing that people complain about GregTech ruining FTB for adding more grinding an generally slowing the game down, whereas people complain about EE3 for being too fast

Balance is a hard concept to grasp isn't it.

A scale has two arms. Too slow is as unbalanced as too fast.

People want that Goldylocks zone of Juuuuust right. People want to work for their stuff but at the same time they don't want it to be a cake walk either, they want a middle ground.

 

[Bagman817]

Wow, you think the downconversion FROM pearls to iron is op? You are offended by the opposite thing of almost everyone else on the forums.



It has ONE broken recipe in MC 1.4.7, and that's the blaze rod exploit. Everything else is you making what I think are weird complaints. Let's look at your breakdown again:



Or you could turn coal into infinite diamonds. Build a 64x64 quarry, power it with lots of coal, get a ton of diamonds just from the output, then use IC2 and buildcraft to automatically compress about half the coal you find and turn it into diamonds, and use the rest to keep the system going. And that has fewer steps. And it is not significantly harder.

While we're on the subject your path to gold is crazy long and inefficient. Why not just make a zombie pigman spawner and use that to farm infinite gold? You will farm a LOT of gold even if you don't use soul shards and just use a vanilla piston farm in the nether. Since you have chunkloaders and tesseracts and computercraft turtles and minefactory reloaded conveyors, you can do this even more easily.

And you're in Ultimate. Did you know that once you have sustainable power you have infinite copper, tin, silver AND gold if you pipe lava into GT centrifuges? No cells required, even. And thermal expansion can turn buildcraft energy into infinite lava! So all you need is a lot of energy. Good thing there aren't ways to make infinite power or Gregtech would be OP!

Wait... you're in Ultimate, did you know that if you use BC energy to make lava, then use powerconverters to loop back EU energy generated from thermal generators to buildcraft to make more lava, then you have a positive power loop? And did you know that steam->EU via powerconverters is crazy cheap, and that ONE 1-chunk Steve's Carts 2 treefarm will power at least 2 solid fuel boilers and maybe even 3 liquid boilers in perpetuity with no maintenance if you do it right? Oh shucks, we do have infinite power.

Q.E.D., folks. Gregtech: OP.



Not only is this wrong, but it's pretty clear you don't even know all the features of the mods to suggest which one should be invalidated. I think you dislike it because it's popular to dislike "Equivalent Exchange".

And if you want to feel that way? Fine. Go for it. But it feels weird for you to tell us the mod is OP in the modpack when your evidence is that it is easy to make a lot of stuff. But EE3 is getting nerfed a bit in 1.5.1 (the way a LOT of mods are, actually!). The minium shard drop rate has plummeted.

You're absolutely correct in all points (and I can certainly confirm the minium shard nerf), with the small point that the blaze rod 'exploit' is the IC2 recipe; the EE3 one is, well, equivalent.

 

[CrisstheNightbringer]

The issue I see here is the OP is complaining that everyone gets massive amounts of materials, and it can be through ee3 or by any other means. How about you, like, build stuff with it all? If an over abundance of materials is the problem then spending those materials will remove the problem. When I played tekkit I set myself up with infinite diamonds through cobblestone generators and an energy condenser. Frankly I never finished anything I planned for that world because evenw ith infinite materials, I didn't have the time to build the cool stuff i wanted to. But In my FTB ultimate lets play, I've already set myself up with triple ore output and twilight forest mound quarries and I'm still running out of resources. Thats because I'm actually building awesome stuff instead of just sitting in my house with a chest full of diamonds thinking I've accomplished something. I understand that the post is more about how cheap ee3 is, but still, using your infinite source of diamonds won't not mean so much once you have to spend time to build something with it because time is finite and honestly it's more rewarding to play that way IMO.

In case you were wondering I am building an actual steel mill based off real life ones, you know, with actual life-sized blast furnaces, not the dinky 3x3x4 block ones. It will be all functional too. Entire project should encompass somewhere between 1-3 square kilometers or more.

 

[Redweevil]

Balance is a hard concept to grasp isn't it.

A scale has two arms. Too slow is as unbalanced as too fast.

People want that Goldylocks zone of Juuuuust right. People want to work for their stuff but at the same time they don't want it to be a cake walk either, they want a middle ground.

Balance is essentially impossible in any game, as its based on level of skill. In a sandbox game like Minecraft or more specifically FTB it becomes even harder. Some people hate GregTech some people hate EE3, and thus won't use them. People will always complain, no matter what. SC2 Tree farms are often considered the best way to generate biomass, so they could be considered over powered. And now they're gonna get nerfed, and people will complain. Forestry now requires fertiliser and people hate multiblock farms, other than those who enjoy replenishing apatite. Balance can never be achieved because, as you say, there is a scale, and that balance is subjective.

 

[ICountFrom0]

And the most upsetting part of the balance argument...

On a server, it means something completely different, then solo.

 

[whizzball1]

Well, if you think EE is overpowered, listen to this.
One Fully Heated 36HP Liquid FIred Boiler will make ~872000 MJ. One only requires 600k MJ to create a bucket of oil in an Oil Fabricator. The steam can be directly made into MJ using Power Converters, eliminating time need. Refine the Oil into Fuel and pump it back into your boilers. EE is nothing compared to PowerCrystals mods.

 

[KirinDave]

If you think EE is overpowered, wait until we have Ars. Seriously. You will laugh.

DoctorOr has a perpetual motion machine that generates any vanilla resource, infinitely, without human supervision. And you know what's even more crazy? He could do it entirely with vanilla mechanics if he wanted to.