Equivalent Exchange has to go.

[Zafum]

Title pretty much sums it up. (Crap I always forget that Edit: ) Equivalent Exchange 3 is so far pretty balanced on its own as a mod, but think of all the automatic farms for wood, obsidian, ender pearls, clay, etcetera, that ftb adds. EE3 takes those and makes it easy to get literally infinite diamonds, iron, and gold without having to work for stuff like UU matter, or dig for them with turtles, etc. It's just a dull, un-fun way to get as many materials as possible in the easiest way possible. That was the problem with EE2, and it's still the problem now.

Like, you can turn cobble into diamonds. Cobble Generator --> Grind to Gravel --> Minium into Clay --> Autocraft into Clay Blocks --> Minium into Iron, then Gold, then Diamonds. And Minium stones are cheap to make.

I think it should either be removed from the ultimate pack, or be nerfed in such a way that it actually works with ftb. Like, disabling EnderPearl/Clay/Obsidian --> Iron exchange. As it stands, this mod is incredibly op, invalidates a number of unique and cool features from other mods, and detracts from the entire ftb experience.

 

[Silent_007]

EDIT: Ah, I see you fixed it.

 

[NosePicker5555]

Why post the same thing? It's not solving anything. (Don't use the mod)

 

[steelblueskies]

edit mod pack>ee3>disable>> done.

thank you. have a nice life.

 

[Zafum]

It's not a problem of whether I'm going to use the mod or not. I'm not planning to. But it seems the only point EE3 currently serves on ftb and any server I visit is to get the most OP infinite recourses in the most unimaginative way possible.

If two goals of FTB are to be balanced and fun, this mod detracts from both of those.

 

[Silent_007]

The problem with making a claim that "the only point of EE3" is whatever, is that the mod isn't even CLOSE to being complete yet.

 

[Zafum]

That's why I said currently. It needs to add something more interesting or positive first, before it's added as a part of ftb.

 

[steelblueskies]

yeah thats like saying well, i'm done with playing with this toy/mod so lets remove it because if i'm done noone else could possibly get anything out of it.

the point of a good spread with care to interaction, block/item ids and configuration is to present a good gamut of options that are generally interoperable out of the box. you could do the same without ftb, tekkit, blah blah blah. more options even if redundant not less. otherwise you'd be in vanilla right now.

you don't walk into mcdonalds and tell em they should pull the cheeseburger off the menu because they have big macs do you? no. the inclusions are intended to present a wide range of options, just like mcdonalds menu. its extraordinarily simple to disable a mod, or distribute the changes necessary to do so. to remove things for everyone, everywhere, because you dislike or disagree with some element is the pinnacle of self centered self serving malice aforethought or the blissful absence of forethought at all. choice is fun compared to total lack thereof.

grinding through configs to try to get an army of mods to play nice together is definitively anti-fun. remove mods, especially those that have been fundamental staples, or that descended from same, since nearly alpha, and engender both anti-fun elements. balance is in the eye of the beholder and subjective to the individual, it is also debatably an ideal not a literal thing outside of its use as a technical term in some sciences.

 

[Zafum]

But what if you walk into mcdonalds, and cheeseburgers are 10$, but big macs are free? Would you bother to buy the incredibly overpriced cheeseburger?

I'm not trying to malicious or self-centered. I'm just saying what I think is a problem, and people can use that in whatever way they like :/

 

[burnedbacon]

You do realize you can get infinite everything extremely easy through a frame quarry right?

Edit: Also, why if getting diamonds broken? I have a few stacks of them that I well never use and its growing by the minute. Somehow I am extremely low on iron, and making diamonds from iron seems a bit daft.

I do feel sad that people hate on EE so much for no reason other than to whine on forums constantly.

 

[steelblueskies]

people have paid hundreds of thousands for an iphone app that does nothing but display an animated graphic of a gemstone. so yes, even if it is less for a greater cost, people, at least some of them, decisively will prefer the seemingly less utilitarian choice, because their valuations and resources differ. that is the point. personal valuations as to balance fun etc, are individual perspectives not absolutes.

to elucidate this principle, consider rank utilitarianism in the economics sense.

a single cheeseburger is 1$. twenty thousand cheeseburgers are also 1$. which is the more utilitarian choice to the single individual with his single dollar? at some point the overabundance CAN and WILL be a burden fully aside its seemingly simple numerical cost effectiveness, both in waiting time on production, and simple bulk. can one readily dispose of the excess? can it's delivery be spread out over larger sums of time? if not than 20,000 for 1$ is not only the poorer choice, but a blatant hazard. thus it's utility can readily be found to be far less.

furthermore as it is easy to disable but not so easy to add in, and you are not doing the work..
the argument that it is not complete enough for you(opinion #1 which is subjective), and that it is imbalanced(opinion #2 which is subjective) and thus should be removed, which subsequently increases work to later add it externally( opinion based conclusion) is entirely centered on the valuation of your own opinions over the potential desires, benefits, perspectives and utility of and to others.

 

[Revemohl]

Yeah, because diamond is the ultimate material and the final goal in any Minecraft map, for everyone, in all mods.

 

[PonyKuu]

I guess the most "OPness" of EE is not getting diamonds from cobble, but making iron from diamods at the stage you don't have a quarry ^_^
I made almost the whole 36HP boiler + 18 engines setup out of iron converted from diamonds I've got with my Fortune III pick. But now my quarry is running and I have tons of iron. I don't even know what to do with it ._.[DOUBLEPOST=1366357222][/DOUBLEPOST]Oh, and also Ender Pearl recipe is pretty "OP" too, since it is much easier to get pearls with Minium Stone than hunting thouse black tall nonsences.

 

[TangentialThreat]

Yeah, because diamond is the ultimate material and the final goal in any Minecraft map, for everyone, in all mods.

I can craft the holy planks of Sengir over and over without leaving the fort.

I am okay with this.

If you want to start a fire with two sticks then there's Terrafirmacraft. There's also this thing called "real life" where you can build stuff and dig holes in the ground too. Find something that suits your OCD and your level of masochism and stick with it.

 

[Abdiel]

It's not a problem of whether I'm going to use the mod or not. I'm not planning to. But it seems the only point EE3 currently serves on ftb and any server I visit is to get the most OP infinite recourses in the most unimaginative way possible.

If two goals of FTB are to be balanced and fun, this mod detracts from both of those.

Find a server which doesn't have it then. I can recommend one if you PM me, our admin really cares about balance and disabled all the "E"E nonsense and many other cross-mod exploits.

 

[Stairmasternem]

This thread really should be geared towards your server admin, not the FTB team. EE3 should stay because it's a mod that players enjoy and like using along with other magic mods and tech mods. It also works well with other mods. If you don't like it in single player, disable it. If you don't like it in multiplayer, then you need to speak with someone else.

 

[Zafum]

You guys are probably right. Now, I don't think that EE3 was ever meant to be used this way. But I really can't complain, particularly not here.

 

[quantumllama]

EE3 is very convenient in 3 important ways for me:

1-Dyes: No, I don't really want to go around searching for deserts so I can make pipe waterproof. That's just a huge waste of time.

2-Obsidian from wood: Yeah well, the problem with obsidian is mining it is so slow. I mean, it is not a particularly rare ( or useful for that matter ) resource anyway.

3-Ender Pearls: I just hate fighting the tall black bastards. Not because they are difficult to destroy, they are rare and when I'm fighting one in the overworld they always seem to teleport into water or something and
disappear. By the time you need massive amounts of these for tesseracts or chunk loaders and whatnot you'll have access to the End and by then Pearls become about as rare as dirt so there won't be any point in wasting iron for these. Then the other way around becomes feasible, but why not make quarries or mining machines then?

And there is the Blaze Rod abuse. Don't do it, people.

 

[Stairmasternem]

Converting saplings into one another is useful when it comes to jungle trees. I love the big ones for vanilla wood gathering. Trouble is, their sapling drop rate apparently isn't all that great.

 

[snooder]

You guys are probably right. Now, I don't think that EE3 was ever meant to be used this way. But I really can't complain, particularly not here.

Of course it was meant to be used that way. That's part of the appeal of EE3, converting a bunch of useless crap into small amounts of useful stuff. Keep in mind, you get a single diamond for every 4 stacks of wood. That's not a lot of diamonds, and it's actually one of the least efficient ways to get them.