Wrong again, Fenn. We play games because we hate them, not for fun.
Disappointed
- Thread starter Strill
- Start date
-
The FTB Forum is now read-only, and is here as an archive. To participate in our community discussions, please join our Discord! https://ftb.team/discord
- Status
Wrong again, Fenn. We play games because we hate them, not for fun.
MFR is one of those mods that really wrecks the experience of people who want a challenge but always go for the easiest route. Which is kinda stupid IMO, but I've seen it enough to know it's a legitimate style of play.
Then again it's certainly not the first to do this, EE2 was there, as is Dartcraft and even TE for some people.
Then again it's certainly not the first to do this, EE2 was there, as is Dartcraft and even TE for some people.
Your whine tastes amazing; perhaps it wood be good with some cheese.
The single item reaction was nerfed because it was bad for intra-mod play. That is to say things like the rancher made it abundantly easy to gather huge excesses of a single item making the efficiency worthless. Now it is actually rewarding to work for the efficiency. Though the outcome was the same you desired, the reasoning was far different.
Everyone has a different opinion on what's fair, and what's not. And as zorn said above, The creator of MFR kinda agreed it was a bit too strong and tried toning it down. But in the end Free is always going to be a powerful thing. Solar panels are free energy from the sun, so allot of people jump on that band wagon. Nothing wrong with that, they just chose to do something that was easier to get to a certain point faster. I kinda like having stuff to build with, while working towards it. But my idea of working for it might be a bit more mamby pamby ideal.
FTB offers a wide variety of packs, a wide variety of mods in each pack, and has a wide variety of players to try and cater too. And it also offers players a chance to make packs of their own choice and level of balance. And so many people just toss this aside. I know I know it's a struggle to find servers that customise to a certain style and have a fun community of which you can interact with, but it's all about picking your poison, and choosing what your willing to put up with.
Do I want to make my own pack catered to what I think is balanced and host a server of my own? Do I want to go looking for another server that has mfr disabled because I feel it breaks the game, Or can I just possibly ignore it's existence and play the way I intended, despite it being far less efficient.
FTB offers a wide variety of packs, a wide variety of mods in each pack, and has a wide variety of players to try and cater too. And it also offers players a chance to make packs of their own choice and level of balance. And so many people just toss this aside. I know I know it's a struggle to find servers that customise to a certain style and have a fun community of which you can interact with, but it's all about picking your poison, and choosing what your willing to put up with.
Do I want to make my own pack catered to what I think is balanced and host a server of my own? Do I want to go looking for another server that has mfr disabled because I feel it breaks the game, Or can I just possibly ignore it's existence and play the way I intended, despite it being far less efficient.
I need people to stop buying Justin Bieber & Lil Wayne albums. But it won't happen. Just play your own game, at your pace.
I've found that a sort of self-imposed narrative can help with the cognitive dissonance sometimes experienced by wanting both challenge and maximum-ish efficiency. For example, I recently went to great pains to set up a rather elaborate system of multifarms to support my base of operations. MFR machines are generally more efficient - less setup, better use of space, no need for fertilizer. But I decided that multifarms both fit the aesthetic of what I was trying to achieve (a massive machinized farming operation) and also avoided what I decided that in-world, MFR farms are to be avoided on the grounds of using banned technology and genetically altering the crops in order to increase farm efficiency. Those last two parts are completely fabricated on my part, but when I ask myself why I did things the way I did, having a little story to tell makes it easier to swallow the challenge that I've issued myself by building multifarms rather than something easier and "better."
Ohey, another balance thread that's well on its way to death by flame. [sarcasm]Joy.[/sarcasm]
Play nice, people.
In the last couple days, I just finished my "goal" for my map. That is to make a GT distillation tower. Most people have the end game of fusion reactor, but I'm of the opinion that by the time you can make one, you don't need one. So, I've been working towards the distillation tower. It only requires 16 advanced casings which required iridium plates and lots of chrome. It took several real life weeks to produce enough energetic combs from my bees to make the needed ruby dust to make into chrome. But it is done now, and I am able to finally pack up my stills and use the distillation tower to get a 2:1 ratio of biofuel from biomass instead of the 10:3 with the still. Even though I have my goal accomplished, I am still expanding my base, and trying to make it better. I have a lot of rube goldberg contraptions, but they all do something that was needed.
There are many things in my base that are not the most efficient. I set them up because I want to do something I consider fun. If you ask a 100 FTBers what the best energy source is, you will get 50 different answers. Half of those will be the optimal nether lava/solar gen, the rest will be a mix of all possible energy sources, and you will end up with about a dozen that uses a very strange and often overlooked power source like Saice's Cactus to coke build. It's not always about the most efficient methods. So stop getting hung up on the most efficient methods, and instead, build something you want to build!
There are many things in my base that are not the most efficient. I set them up because I want to do something I consider fun. If you ask a 100 FTBers what the best energy source is, you will get 50 different answers. Half of those will be the optimal nether lava/solar gen, the rest will be a mix of all possible energy sources, and you will end up with about a dozen that uses a very strange and often overlooked power source like Saice's Cactus to coke build. It's not always about the most efficient methods. So stop getting hung up on the most efficient methods, and instead, build something you want to build!
They can't be that worried about efficiency if they're spending time complaining on a forum about how mods aren't magically balanced vs. every other mod ever created or that will ever be created.
The funny part is that achieving max efficiency in a bioreactor is more work than max efficiency in a Forestry ethanol setup.
Because I'm creating biofuel to create power. Forestry stills/fermenters directly cut into the bottom line while MFR Bioreactors do not.
is the MFR the only mod you know about that beats Forestry`s biofuel production or it`s a grudge against MFR in particular?
So you're saying the bio reactor nerf was a good thing, but it was for a different reason?
If you say to ignore efficiency, why would you then cite 'making the efficiency worthless' as a reason to change something? Why would we care if some other guy makes a squid power 45 boilers?
Which one produces more fuel per sapling is not the issue I'm concerned about. Plant matter to biofuel efficiency is just a matter of more farmland which I have plenty of room for. It's which one consumes more power that I'm concerned about because I've already partitioned off my base and have limited space for power generators. MFR consumes no power at all so it's by default the best option no matter how much plant matter it consumes.
As far as I'm aware, MFR and Forestry are the only methods the wiki lists for making biofuel.
All those all rely on the Forestry Fermenter. They're not a replacement for Forestry. The MFR Bioreactor on the other hand replaces both the fermenter and still.
Of the options, there's no reason to use Buildcraft at all since you actually lose energy from the process. You might as well just pipe the biomass out as-is. The GregTech option, if I understand correctly, consumes non-renewable cells. And of course you can get anything from bees but that's a given.
So yes I could be bees instead. That is indeed an option I missed. Silly me.
you decide how you play your game. if you don't like a mod, no one is forcing you to actually use it. your problem right now is that you can't decide between the most efficient way, or the more challenging way. we can't help you with that, you'll need to decide on this yourself.
and you should not forget that mods are often made with the intention to be able to be used as a stand-alone mod, and MFR is a perfect example of that. it provides mostly everything to be able to run as a stand-alone mod, and it balances itself around that. if it doesn't compare very well with other mods, you can't blame the mod for it. what you could do however is ask the mod creator to add configuration options to change certains aspects of the mod, that way you can configure the stand-alone mod to be balanced with other mods. you can't expect from a mod creator to make a mod that keeps every single other mod in mind in terms of balancing
and you should not forget that mods are often made with the intention to be able to be used as a stand-alone mod, and MFR is a perfect example of that. it provides mostly everything to be able to run as a stand-alone mod, and it balances itself around that. if it doesn't compare very well with other mods, you can't blame the mod for it. what you could do however is ask the mod creator to add configuration options to change certains aspects of the mod, that way you can configure the stand-alone mod to be balanced with other mods. you can't expect from a mod creator to make a mod that keeps every single other mod in mind in terms of balancing
distillation tower does not replace fermenter, but replaces stills at rate roughly 10:1, which makes it still a better option than traditional forestry`s biofuel production.
there might be no reason for using refinery in terms of energy gain, but option is nice nonetheless.
and you do not understand how distillation tower work, because it does not consumes cells..
I don't know why people always think this, it is simply not true. straight IC2 will consume cells, but none of the GT machines do. you always get the cells back.
The last version of GT for 1.5.2 significantly buffed the output of the distillation tower and greatly reduced the energy requirement. (most of the wikis do not reflect this.) It will convert 16 biomass cells into 8 ethanol cells (and 8 empty cells) in 20 seconds and for 6400eu. (16eu/tick) So with it, you no longer need the forestry stills. I'm not quite sure how many stills the distillation tower will directly replace, but since you can reuse the machine casings and simply add 3 additional complex build machines to get more throughput, I don't see anyone needing more than 1 distillation tower setup.
The refinery option for biomass isn't the best choice in terms of efficiency, but simply a way for people to use the same setup they have for oil->fuel production without needing to build additional machines and setup additional infrastructure.
This first sentence is a great example of what NOT to do.
You all argue for two pages, yet none of you, out of your infinite ignorance, know that fermenter/stills produces more biofuel? Don't argue about things you don't know how to use.
OP, the MFR route can't handle forestry tree bred saplings, which is by design for balance. High efficiency saplings are leaps and bounds ahead of any other biofuel production by an order of magnitude. At peak, a single multifarm can provide over 10,000mj/t worth of biofuel through a giant boiler still and boiler array.
An apt analogy:
Forestry starts at 1 and goes to 100
MFR starts at 4 and goes to 30
OP, the MFR route can't handle forestry tree bred saplings, which is by design for balance. High efficiency saplings are leaps and bounds ahead of any other biofuel production by an order of magnitude. At peak, a single multifarm can provide over 10,000mj/t worth of biofuel through a giant boiler still and boiler array.
An apt analogy:
Forestry starts at 1 and goes to 100
MFR starts at 4 and goes to 30
- Status