Extruder easy-to-miss gotcha: virtually all metal recipes require MV power. An LV extruder is basically only good for soft materials such as rubber.
Skipping the LV extruder is common.
Skipping the LV extruder is common.
A Journal of a Determined Soul (Infitech2 Let's Journal)
- Thread starter ShneekeyTheLost
- Start date
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Journal Update: Thaumic Advances
Crafting the polarizing thingy, the manual next directs me to craft the wire making machine, which I do quite readily. This is really going to help me save on materials cost going forward, I think.
While letting some steel cook and some ore processing in the macerator, I finally had a chance to make some progress in thamaturgy. Extracting gold wire, then running it through the bending machine to produce a small spring, I was able to craft the Goggles of Revealing. Then, taking my trusty Silver-Capped Greatwood Wand, I set about the world and wandered upon it looking for more nodes to fill up my new toy. And several I did find which I had missed earlier, because the thaumometer is kinda awkward for finding them.
I found a mystical forest, bright in vivid colors, and even a few Silverwood trees. I checked to be sure there was no node contained therein, then chopped one down. I have need of silverwood to make vis filters for my projects. Returning from whence I came, I proceeded to craft up an Alembic, some pipes, and a couple of Arcane Constructs and produced my automated cauldron thing. From there, I produce a warded Jar and an obsidian-capped warded jar. On the obsidian-capped one I place a label for Herba. This lets me quasi-automate the production of steel and thaumium through arcane means, either using candleberries for ordo to make steel nuggets or using netherwart for making thaumium. It still isn't fully automated just yet, but it is at least one step closer. More importantly, this gives me ready access to Thaumium, from which I can make Tier 3 tools, and thus my ability to harvest tier 3 materials has finally been secured. It isn't the most sturdy material, in fact Wrought Iron tools are more durable, but it can go through Obsidian, so that works for me. It also seems to have a Fortune effect, although what purpose this serves when none of the ores drop anything but the ore block itself is beyond me.
Looking up drills, I see they need Stainless Steel, which I still don't know how to make. Or rather, there appear to be hundreds of ways to make stainless steel ingots or nuggets, but all of them seem to be recycling recipes that clutter my book up needlessly. I only wish I could filter them out somehow to find the actually relevant recipes. Ahh well, such is life. Also, they seem to require Lithium batteries, not the RE-Batteries which require liquid redstone. Interesting, looks like I'll be needing to find a way to source Lithium at some point in the near future, just to have it on hand when I get to that point. Not too sure what is up with all the different drill bits, though. Do the drill bits wear down over time? If so, why bother with a drill instead of a pickaxe?
My next machine is going to be a Lathe, because it's basically producing rods for roughly half the cost, which is none too shabby. I could wish there was a more efficient means of coating wire with rubber, or at least some way of producing these circuits more easily. It really is cutting into my redstone reserves. Other than that, I really need to start working on a more aesthetic base layout. Right now, the basement is all a grid of rooms, which seems dreadfully boring. I shall have to endeavor to... spice things up a bit. Also need to really start setting up a drawer wall for bulk storage.
Branch Mining around Y10-20 seems to also be in my near future to source a few resources, namely Redstone. And if I could find an actual diamond deposit, that would be lovely.
Other machines I'd like to convert over to electricity include the macerator, hamerer, and furnace... but as I currently am satisfied with the steam powered versions therein, they can wait a bit until I've gotten a bit more established. Making steam more efficiently is also something I'd like to see about doing, as my current method leaves much to be desired. I do foresee a somewhat more robust power generating system in my near future, although what precisely that will entail is still up in the air.
Branching out into other areas of technological research proved fruitless, as many of the machines I was looking into from Buildcraft seem to be disabled entirely, and a good number of ones from Forestry are also disabled entirely as well. And the recipe for the multi-block farm is just... rediculous. Absolutely ludicrous. I would need to make those things in bulk if I were to make any use of the structure, over a hundred of them by my count. So I don't really foresee that being an option any time soon.
I may well have to break down and start bee-breeding. If nothing else, getting some jungle bees up and running to make silky mesh with for the upgraded backpacks. Currently, I have a digger's backpack, which wasn't too bad to craft. I'm unsure if I want to get a miner's backpack as it typically eats ingots as well as raw ores, and I'd really prefer to not have to go hunting through bags to figure out where that iron went to that I was crafting with. A builder's backpack might not go amiss, if I'm going to be doing any rennovations. I'd also probably want to see about a tool bag or something, I seem to be compiling quite the collection of tools, and I'd like a better way of hauling them around, or at least storing them for use.
Also, built myself a Worktable finally. Of the four slots, one is a furnace and one is a crafting table. At the moment, that will suffice, I got it mostly because it doesn't spit things out when I put things in the crafting grid then get distracted, although apparently the storage upgrade requires an Assembler to produce.
Tempted to set up some automation with some conveyor belts being used to connect machines together, Macerator to Hammerer to Furnace for ore refinement. Just to play around with the mechanic and get familiar with it, because I'm going to want to be doing quite a bit of automation eventually.
I wonder if a large steam boiler might be a way to go for mass steam production. I could run my steam turbine for my current LV machines and probably run some steam engines for other purposes from it as well. Be interesting to see how well it would work. I'd also like to try and get away from Charcoal based steam production. Maybe biofuel is a way to go? We'll see, I suppose.
Crafting the polarizing thingy, the manual next directs me to craft the wire making machine, which I do quite readily. This is really going to help me save on materials cost going forward, I think.
While letting some steel cook and some ore processing in the macerator, I finally had a chance to make some progress in thamaturgy. Extracting gold wire, then running it through the bending machine to produce a small spring, I was able to craft the Goggles of Revealing. Then, taking my trusty Silver-Capped Greatwood Wand, I set about the world and wandered upon it looking for more nodes to fill up my new toy. And several I did find which I had missed earlier, because the thaumometer is kinda awkward for finding them.
I found a mystical forest, bright in vivid colors, and even a few Silverwood trees. I checked to be sure there was no node contained therein, then chopped one down. I have need of silverwood to make vis filters for my projects. Returning from whence I came, I proceeded to craft up an Alembic, some pipes, and a couple of Arcane Constructs and produced my automated cauldron thing. From there, I produce a warded Jar and an obsidian-capped warded jar. On the obsidian-capped one I place a label for Herba. This lets me quasi-automate the production of steel and thaumium through arcane means, either using candleberries for ordo to make steel nuggets or using netherwart for making thaumium. It still isn't fully automated just yet, but it is at least one step closer. More importantly, this gives me ready access to Thaumium, from which I can make Tier 3 tools, and thus my ability to harvest tier 3 materials has finally been secured. It isn't the most sturdy material, in fact Wrought Iron tools are more durable, but it can go through Obsidian, so that works for me. It also seems to have a Fortune effect, although what purpose this serves when none of the ores drop anything but the ore block itself is beyond me.
Looking up drills, I see they need Stainless Steel, which I still don't know how to make. Or rather, there appear to be hundreds of ways to make stainless steel ingots or nuggets, but all of them seem to be recycling recipes that clutter my book up needlessly. I only wish I could filter them out somehow to find the actually relevant recipes. Ahh well, such is life. Also, they seem to require Lithium batteries, not the RE-Batteries which require liquid redstone. Interesting, looks like I'll be needing to find a way to source Lithium at some point in the near future, just to have it on hand when I get to that point. Not too sure what is up with all the different drill bits, though. Do the drill bits wear down over time? If so, why bother with a drill instead of a pickaxe?
My next machine is going to be a Lathe, because it's basically producing rods for roughly half the cost, which is none too shabby. I could wish there was a more efficient means of coating wire with rubber, or at least some way of producing these circuits more easily. It really is cutting into my redstone reserves. Other than that, I really need to start working on a more aesthetic base layout. Right now, the basement is all a grid of rooms, which seems dreadfully boring. I shall have to endeavor to... spice things up a bit. Also need to really start setting up a drawer wall for bulk storage.
Branch Mining around Y10-20 seems to also be in my near future to source a few resources, namely Redstone. And if I could find an actual diamond deposit, that would be lovely.
Other machines I'd like to convert over to electricity include the macerator, hamerer, and furnace... but as I currently am satisfied with the steam powered versions therein, they can wait a bit until I've gotten a bit more established. Making steam more efficiently is also something I'd like to see about doing, as my current method leaves much to be desired. I do foresee a somewhat more robust power generating system in my near future, although what precisely that will entail is still up in the air.
Branching out into other areas of technological research proved fruitless, as many of the machines I was looking into from Buildcraft seem to be disabled entirely, and a good number of ones from Forestry are also disabled entirely as well. And the recipe for the multi-block farm is just... rediculous. Absolutely ludicrous. I would need to make those things in bulk if I were to make any use of the structure, over a hundred of them by my count. So I don't really foresee that being an option any time soon.
I may well have to break down and start bee-breeding. If nothing else, getting some jungle bees up and running to make silky mesh with for the upgraded backpacks. Currently, I have a digger's backpack, which wasn't too bad to craft. I'm unsure if I want to get a miner's backpack as it typically eats ingots as well as raw ores, and I'd really prefer to not have to go hunting through bags to figure out where that iron went to that I was crafting with. A builder's backpack might not go amiss, if I'm going to be doing any rennovations. I'd also probably want to see about a tool bag or something, I seem to be compiling quite the collection of tools, and I'd like a better way of hauling them around, or at least storing them for use.
Also, built myself a Worktable finally. Of the four slots, one is a furnace and one is a crafting table. At the moment, that will suffice, I got it mostly because it doesn't spit things out when I put things in the crafting grid then get distracted, although apparently the storage upgrade requires an Assembler to produce.
Tempted to set up some automation with some conveyor belts being used to connect machines together, Macerator to Hammerer to Furnace for ore refinement. Just to play around with the mechanic and get familiar with it, because I'm going to want to be doing quite a bit of automation eventually.
I wonder if a large steam boiler might be a way to go for mass steam production. I could run my steam turbine for my current LV machines and probably run some steam engines for other purposes from it as well. Be interesting to see how well it would work. I'd also like to try and get away from Charcoal based steam production. Maybe biofuel is a way to go? We'll see, I suppose.
Journal Update: Minimal Progress Made
Made the Lathe, now it wants me to make an extruder, despite how it won't work on anything but rubber.
Went mining down in the depths. My new strategy for branch mining is as follows: Main tunnel heading E/W which is 3x3. Branching off from this are 1x3 branches every 8 meters. These deposits seem to be around a chunk or so in diameter, so every eight meters ought to be enough to catch a deposit while quartering the amount of digging I have to do. Unfortunately, it still seems a mostly fruitless project. This, if anything, is the single most frustrating part about all this. I am basically shooting blind, other than some basic information within a text concerning depths the deposits are found in.
I did break into another cave, and whilst exploring the cave found another Limonite deposit and another Deep Hive with quantities of Redstone Ore around it. I also found a whole lot of Do Not Want, but that is to be expected when going spelunking. Wither Witches in particular, and their familiars, are extremely annoying. Fortunately, my new sword is particularly sharp, and capable of dealing with these problems.
I accidentally found a deposit of Magnesium, which I suspect will be useful to me in refining Titanium later on. And by accidentally, I mean my current method of branch mining would not have found it had I not stumbled into a small cave that it broke into. I need to establish a Y30 branch tunnel, it seems, to ensure that no deposits escape me, betwene th Y20 and Y40 tunnels. Every ten meters down might actually be a good idea, thinking about it. With a height of 3 for each branch, it leaves me with 7 layers of rock between, which means I should easily find any veins that might be present. It will mean more mining, however.
With my four blast furnaces, I can now make a stack of steel at a time, with 16 iron and a stack of charcoal per furnace. However, this is becoming a significant drain on my charcoal production, and more worrisome, on my tree farm's ability to produce wood. Currently, I am using a 2x2 dark oak for my lumber of choice, grown in a 4x4 grid with a couple spaces between, as it produces a favorable wood to sapling ratio. However, I may need to expand it if I am going to keep up, which is not going to be easy.
Peeking ahead at the next tier of machines beyond the LV ones I currently have, I find myself dismayed at the fact that they simply do not upgrade from the current tier. In other words, all the machines I will ever make will eventually become obsolete and unused. This, if anything, is the most disheartening part of this whole process.
I wonder what the ratio between Liters/s and mB/s is? I am considering doing something, but I don't know what the throughput values are for the EnderIO fluid conduits as compared to the current bronze pipes I am using.
I do have the capacity to make an EnderIO resivoir. I haven't done so yet because my water tank has been sufficient for my needs, and was already established. However, if I am wanting to move my machines into a more compact configuration, maybe doing away entirely with the iron tank as a steam buffer, it might be an option available to me. I really am wanting to get off the charcoal standard for fuel, though. A fermenter is not beyond my capabilities at this time, although kickstarting it might be interesting. Once I get it going, I can run it off of the biofuel it produces, but I will likely need to build a stirling engine to get it going. But that brings me back to automated farming, which is beyond my capabilities at this point, leaving me in a catch 22.
Bluntly, running into too many walls, too many limitations, too many things I cannot do, and without providing me any realistic alternatives.
Made the Lathe, now it wants me to make an extruder, despite how it won't work on anything but rubber.
Went mining down in the depths. My new strategy for branch mining is as follows: Main tunnel heading E/W which is 3x3. Branching off from this are 1x3 branches every 8 meters. These deposits seem to be around a chunk or so in diameter, so every eight meters ought to be enough to catch a deposit while quartering the amount of digging I have to do. Unfortunately, it still seems a mostly fruitless project. This, if anything, is the single most frustrating part about all this. I am basically shooting blind, other than some basic information within a text concerning depths the deposits are found in.
I did break into another cave, and whilst exploring the cave found another Limonite deposit and another Deep Hive with quantities of Redstone Ore around it. I also found a whole lot of Do Not Want, but that is to be expected when going spelunking. Wither Witches in particular, and their familiars, are extremely annoying. Fortunately, my new sword is particularly sharp, and capable of dealing with these problems.
I accidentally found a deposit of Magnesium, which I suspect will be useful to me in refining Titanium later on. And by accidentally, I mean my current method of branch mining would not have found it had I not stumbled into a small cave that it broke into. I need to establish a Y30 branch tunnel, it seems, to ensure that no deposits escape me, betwene th Y20 and Y40 tunnels. Every ten meters down might actually be a good idea, thinking about it. With a height of 3 for each branch, it leaves me with 7 layers of rock between, which means I should easily find any veins that might be present. It will mean more mining, however.
With my four blast furnaces, I can now make a stack of steel at a time, with 16 iron and a stack of charcoal per furnace. However, this is becoming a significant drain on my charcoal production, and more worrisome, on my tree farm's ability to produce wood. Currently, I am using a 2x2 dark oak for my lumber of choice, grown in a 4x4 grid with a couple spaces between, as it produces a favorable wood to sapling ratio. However, I may need to expand it if I am going to keep up, which is not going to be easy.
Peeking ahead at the next tier of machines beyond the LV ones I currently have, I find myself dismayed at the fact that they simply do not upgrade from the current tier. In other words, all the machines I will ever make will eventually become obsolete and unused. This, if anything, is the most disheartening part of this whole process.
I wonder what the ratio between Liters/s and mB/s is? I am considering doing something, but I don't know what the throughput values are for the EnderIO fluid conduits as compared to the current bronze pipes I am using.
I do have the capacity to make an EnderIO resivoir. I haven't done so yet because my water tank has been sufficient for my needs, and was already established. However, if I am wanting to move my machines into a more compact configuration, maybe doing away entirely with the iron tank as a steam buffer, it might be an option available to me. I really am wanting to get off the charcoal standard for fuel, though. A fermenter is not beyond my capabilities at this time, although kickstarting it might be interesting. Once I get it going, I can run it off of the biofuel it produces, but I will likely need to build a stirling engine to get it going. But that brings me back to automated farming, which is beyond my capabilities at this point, leaving me in a catch 22.
Bluntly, running into too many walls, too many limitations, too many things I cannot do, and without providing me any realistic alternatives.
I'm beginning to think, that modifying the standard 1x2 shaft for the branch mine entrance might be a good plan. Go to a 3x3, with a platform every ten levels and have ladders on alternating sides. That way you don't waste time crawling back up the ladders if you miss your floor. It'll also let you run either piping or elevator tracks to send materials back to the surface.
I find 2x2 spruce far more productive/efficient than dark oak for charcoal. They produce a lot more logs and are easier to chop down (using gt axes) than dark oak. Never had a problem with saplings either (in fact I would get so many I would use them up in a little vanilla furnace setup cooking wrought iron nuggets). A forestry crafting table with as much gravel you can bother to collect is a cheap and easy way to make GT axes in the early game.
Re obsolescence - the furthest I've got into the pack is having some HV machines required for specific recipes. I never stopped using the LV/MV versions where the recipes allowed though, mainly because lower voltage machines are more energy-efficient than their higher voltage equivalents.
For example, the LV extruder - you're going to need rubber in the long term, so use it on a specific rubber setup. No need to waste the upgraded version on that. And for certain ores, ones that I didn't intend to process further than their standard outputs, I kept my steam variants so that they could macerate->hammer->smelt or just macerate->smelt in the background whilst keeping the higher voltage for more immediate requirements.
Oh, and 1 liter = 1 mB btw.
Re obsolescence - the furthest I've got into the pack is having some HV machines required for specific recipes. I never stopped using the LV/MV versions where the recipes allowed though, mainly because lower voltage machines are more energy-efficient than their higher voltage equivalents.
For example, the LV extruder - you're going to need rubber in the long term, so use it on a specific rubber setup. No need to waste the upgraded version on that. And for certain ores, ones that I didn't intend to process further than their standard outputs, I kept my steam variants so that they could macerate->hammer->smelt or just macerate->smelt in the background whilst keeping the higher voltage for more immediate requirements.
Oh, and 1 liter = 1 mB btw.
Part of the problem I think is you're not reading some of the alternative ideas. People have suggested superior vein-finding techniques, but you've come up with your own scheme that makes little sense mathematically.
Honestly Schneekey, we went into this knowing the pack wasn't suitable to your tastes. It was fun, but its just getting a bit arduous watching you encounter the obstacles. Everything you encounter now is newest "most disheartening" or "most frustrating" thing. Its obvious you're getting bogged down in the problems and not excited by the solutions.
I'm really pleased you tried it out just for fun, but I know definitively you're never going to "love" this pack because things don't get better, they get worse. There are more areas where you'll need to consider the cost/benefit analysis of "spamming" machines, more time gates where you'll need to think of side-projects while waiting, more situations where you build an expensive machine and then find out it doesn't work for what you want.
In short, there are tons and tons of scenarios where only "unrealistic" solutions will get the job done in reasonable time.
Move on. Mission successful, you explored a GT pack, and all your worries about them were pretty true
If you really intend to keep bonking your head against this however:
* Cutting down trees with branches is insane. GT axes chop vertical stacks of logs, so invest in Spruce or Fir.
* Machines that are "obsolete" can be recycled in a number of ways. Pulverizing them, disassembling them, arc-furnacing them. In each case you'll get back most of the primary materials that went into them. Its a good compromise between "realistic" and "fun"
* The Liter thing is nonsense, no argument there. I have no idea why Greg thought it would be smart to introduce Liters when everyone actually successfully agreed that the unit was mB.
* The per-Seconds thing is actually legitimate. GT machines often operate on per-second intervals rather than per-tick, to save computation.
* Branches every 8m or 10m or even 30m make no sense. The veins are huge. You'd hit the same vein 3-4 times doing this.
* If you're looking for a specific vein that also generates in the nether, look for it there. Netherrack is much easier to mine.
* If you're not looking for a specific vein, the "core sampling" technique is best: Find a chunk that has a vein in it. Go 4 chunks east (leaving 3 chunks between) and drill down again. Repeat. (Its not fun by any means, and I'm doing away with this nonsense in IT3. But there you go.)
Honestly Schneekey, we went into this knowing the pack wasn't suitable to your tastes. It was fun, but its just getting a bit arduous watching you encounter the obstacles. Everything you encounter now is newest "most disheartening" or "most frustrating" thing. Its obvious you're getting bogged down in the problems and not excited by the solutions.
I'm really pleased you tried it out just for fun, but I know definitively you're never going to "love" this pack because things don't get better, they get worse. There are more areas where you'll need to consider the cost/benefit analysis of "spamming" machines, more time gates where you'll need to think of side-projects while waiting, more situations where you build an expensive machine and then find out it doesn't work for what you want.
In short, there are tons and tons of scenarios where only "unrealistic" solutions will get the job done in reasonable time.
Move on. Mission successful, you explored a GT pack, and all your worries about them were pretty true
If you really intend to keep bonking your head against this however:
* Cutting down trees with branches is insane. GT axes chop vertical stacks of logs, so invest in Spruce or Fir.
* Machines that are "obsolete" can be recycled in a number of ways. Pulverizing them, disassembling them, arc-furnacing them. In each case you'll get back most of the primary materials that went into them. Its a good compromise between "realistic" and "fun"
* The Liter thing is nonsense, no argument there. I have no idea why Greg thought it would be smart to introduce Liters when everyone actually successfully agreed that the unit was mB.
* The per-Seconds thing is actually legitimate. GT machines often operate on per-second intervals rather than per-tick, to save computation.
* Branches every 8m or 10m or even 30m make no sense. The veins are huge. You'd hit the same vein 3-4 times doing this.
* If you're looking for a specific vein that also generates in the nether, look for it there. Netherrack is much easier to mine.
* If you're not looking for a specific vein, the "core sampling" technique is best: Find a chunk that has a vein in it. Go 4 chunks east (leaving 3 chunks between) and drill down again. Repeat. (Its not fun by any means, and I'm doing away with this nonsense in IT3. But there you go.)
I used... fir trees I think they're called? The ones that are 2x2 and stupidly tall. I was actually able to fill the maximum size 11x11 charcoal thing straight away.
You're making an IT3? Color me intrigued.
You're making an IT3? Color me intrigued.
Celestialphoenix
Too Much Free Time
I've made it to the EV age, with a functioning distillation tower and the like- yet I had kept 90% of my LV machinery functional. (and crafted a whole load more along the way).
A fair whack of them were re-housed into other parts of the base and put to different uses. A couple [bender/wiremill/lathe] kept their original position, and the remaining were parked in a chest.
I typically look at an [automation] task, and pick the best machine (usually the cheapest) for the job.
Say... if you're wanting to auto-craft insulated cables, an LV assembler is all you need to put the rubber on. You don't need anything fancier unless you really enjoy overkill.
You certainly don't have to jump all your machines to the next tier just because its available. I've never needed an MV macerator- wen't straight to HV, and kept the LV ones for crushing ingots and recycling stuff.
Hopefully this puts your mind at ease a little.
I typically look at an [automation] task, and pick the best machine (usually the cheapest) for the job.
Say... if you're wanting to auto-craft insulated cables, an LV assembler is all you need to put the rubber on. You don't need anything fancier unless you really enjoy overkill.
You certainly don't have to jump all your machines to the next tier just because its available. I've never needed an MV macerator- wen't straight to HV, and kept the LV ones for crushing ingots and recycling stuff.
Hopefully this puts your mind at ease a little.
Also- try using Gtech flint axes for dropping trees. It'll save on the amount of metal you're using
Is the Industrial Grinder still a thing that exists? I remember loving it in Ultimate. (Once I found the diamonds with my awful luck.)
Sadly no. I believe that was a GT4 thing, and yeah it was popular. Its been replaced (poorly) by a number of single block machines that perform similar functions.
Celestialphoenix
Too Much Free Time
I think its [it was?] a planned feature in GT:CE. Arch [former dev] had an animated model for it at one point.