Something The Modding Community "Ruined"

[Henry Link]

Everyone's play style is different. For me minecraft has always been about what I can do to push the technical bounds of the game. For example when I was playing 1.25 on a vanilla server it was building a huge enderman farm in the end so I could get easy XP and enderperls. And part of that build was little grindy and it cost me several lives and tools due to falling into the void. But in the long run it was worth it. Modded minecraft has just extended this type of play style for me.

 

[SpitefulFox]

the gate conditional for engines to run only when power is requested from the network (Direwolf's recent coverage)

Made almost entirely moot by the fact that due to the "Always On!" paradigm shift in BC power, machines are always requesting power from the network. Did you notice how even when the lasers in the spotlight were inactive, there were still two machines burning up fuel for no reason? This feature seems fairly useless at best and downright disingenuous at worst. What's the point of having a system that only supplies power on demand if there's always demand? It almost feels like the new gate conditionals are designed by someone who has no idea how the rest of the mod works. Does the left hand not know what the right is doing? Or are the devs just downright mocking us by throwing us a bone that does nothing?

 

[KirinDave]

Made almost entirely moot by the fact that due to the "Always On!" paradigm shift in BC power, machines are always requesting power from the network. Did you notice how even when the lasers in the spotlight were inactive, there were still two machines burning up fuel for no reason? This feature seems fairly useless at best and downright disingenuous at worst. What's the point of having a system that only supplies power on demand if there's always demand? It almost feels like the new gate conditionals are designed by someone who has no idea how the rest of the mod works. Does the left hand not know what the right is doing? Or are the devs just downright mocking us by throwing us a bone that does nothing?

I am sure there is some reason they exist. The problem is that no one knows how buildcraft works these days. Heck, Covert has posted things in here that upon immibis and I testing, were shown to be false. So I'm not sure who does understand all of buildcrafts rules, but I'm pretty sure they don't post here often.

 

[WTFFFS]

And this right here is probably the biggest point that keeps me form really looking into doing an LP. I think most would find my play style fairly boring as is and add to the fact I do stuff in really weird non-optimal ways just means more complaints that I'm doing it wrong. I have no issue spending hours or days on a system that is only sort of optimal. Case in point my coke system or my BT to EU system. Both horrible ways to do something if you look at just the 'best' way to play. The fact that I actively avoid some of the 'best' mods or tools would drive people batty.

I'd watch that for ideas for my own builds, optimising the non-optimal is fun to me. My current 1.5.2 world all farming (other than trees and only because there isn't a Lumberjack Golem with a Flannelette shirt upgrade) is Golem powered, yeah they are great but I have MFR so I could easily quadruple my output from a smaller area but I like watching the little guys run around.

 

[CapturetheBomb]

Made almost entirely moot by the fact that due to the "Always On!" paradigm shift in BC power, machines are always requesting power from the network. Did you notice how even when the lasers in the spotlight were inactive, there were still two machines burning up fuel for no reason? This feature seems fairly useless at best and downright disingenuous at worst. What's the point of having a system that only supplies power on demand if there's always demand? It almost feels like the new gate conditionals are designed by someone who has no idea how the rest of the mod works. Does the left hand not know what the right is doing? Or are the devs just downright mocking us by throwing us a bone that does nothing?

I'm not saying it shut down all of the power generation, as you saw in the spotlight, but rather stopped most of the engines from firing, only requesting 2 to be on for the little power it requires when idling. If you lack a way to store MJs, it is a good alternative to manually throttling the power generation.

On the subject of ore multiplication, I find it to be a godsend in some cases. Machine cost is not why I want more materials, but rather for building/decoration. Without the drive to achieve power generation for aesthetic purposes, I would be content living in a little hovel built into the side of a mountain with a few small farms for a variety of food. That is how I used to play Minecraft: Just build myself a modest house of wood and stone and care for my livestock and pets.

Caving was rarely a thing to do, and only done when I wanted a new thing for decoration. I used leather armor only, as iron was too valuable to spend on anything other than my pickaxe, which again is only used for materials that required it's use.

 

[SpitefulFox]

I'm not saying it shut down all of the power generation, as you saw in the spotlight, but rather stopped most of the engines from firing, only requesting 2 to be on for the little power it requires when idling. If you lack a way to store MJs, it is a good alternative to manually throttling the power generation.

It changes it from wasting a lot of fuel to wasting a little fuel. That's still wasting fuel. If you had a setup like that in a chunkloaded base, your fuel tank would be dry in no time. If your base isn't chunkloaded, it begs the question of why you're even bothering to automate the engines instead of just using a lever to turn the engines on and off since you're going to be around while it's processing anyway.

 

[CapturetheBomb]

It changes it from wasting a lot of fuel to wasting a little fuel. That's still wasting fuel. If you had a setup like that in a chunkloaded base, your fuel tank would be dry in no time. If your base isn't chunkloaded, it begs the question of why you're even bothering to automate the engines instead of just using a lever to turn the engines on and off since you're going to be around while it's processing anyway.

If you are running the engines on something renewable, but something you can't produce enough of to break even when all your engines are running, it can help in cases you need a surge of power. If your base was chunk loaded, it may be a possibility to wirelessly transmit power through a tesseract (or other means, if any), it can save you the trip of going back and turning on all the engines, assuming the gate conditional will still operate in such cases. It is more for convenience than practicality.

It would also help if you didn't have wireless power and somehow got enough materials and chunks loaded to run a quarry from a long distance using the pipes.

 

[SpitefulFox]

If you are running the engines on something renewable, but something you can't produce enough of to break even when all your engines are running, it can help in cases you need a surge of power. If your base was chunk loaded, it may be a possibility to wirelessly transmit power through a tesseract (or other means, if any), it can save you the trip of going back and turning on all the engines, assuming the gate conditional will still operate in such cases. It is more for convenience than practicality.

Sounds too unpractical to be worth the amount of resources and time to make the gates in the first place just to avoid the annoyance of flipping a lever on and off, but those are valid uses, I guess.

It would also help if you didn't have wireless power and somehow got enough materials and chunks loaded to run a quarry from a long distance using the pipes.

How would power request gates help in this situation? The quarry is one of those machines that you actually want your engines going hog wild on. The quarry's just going to request all the power you have anyway, and then continue to request "Idle Tax" once it finishes.

 

[CapturetheBomb]

Sounds too unpractical to be worth the amount of resources and time to make the gates in the first place, but those are valid uses, I guess.

True. It really would only be viable if you only have Buildcraft and Forestry installed. I would only use it on electric engines, since I like the density of IC2 energy over fiddling with engines.

How would power request gates help in this situation? The quarry is one of those machines that you actually want your engines going hog wild on. The quarry's just going to request all the power you have anyway, and then continue to request "Idle Tax" once it finishes.

Remember, the new pipes have a limit to how much power can be sent down the line. I'm not sure if the system is smart enough to not run engines if it is choked, but you can limit how much makes it through. If you have other pressing uses for the power than resource gathering, then it would be wise to run only a fraction towards the quarry.

I am curious as to how it will work. I may just have to install it myself to try it out. I wonder if you can take a quartz pipe (64MJ/t) as your main line with a break in the middle between the quarry and the engines, then run 2 smoothstone pipe lines (16MJ/t) parallel (1 block apart) for that short distance, if it would only request the 32MJ/t or try for more? It changed a lot, as has IC2. I can only hope that it won't be completely frustrating to deal with.

 

[Zjarek_S]

It changes it from wasting a lot of fuel to wasting a little fuel. That's still wasting fuel. If you had a setup like that in a chunkloaded base, your fuel tank would be dry in no time. If your base isn't chunkloaded, it begs the question of why you're even bothering to automate the engines instead of just using a lever to turn the engines on and off since you're going to be around while it's processing anyway.

It doesn't have to be chunkloaded all the time, you can use personal anchors (my favorite, there is no reason to use server resources when I'm not playing). You can flip levers if you have 3 machines, when you have more micromanaging is too much of a unnecessary time sink in comparison to just pumping more oil. I'm using a lot of on demand systems and new changes in 1.5.2 BC/Forestry/RC with energy usage don't impact it much (they are based on energy cells).

 

[KirinDave]

True. It really would only be viable if you only have Buildcraft and Forestry installed. I would only use it on electric engines, since I like the density of IC2 energy over fiddling with engines.

So actually, you prefer to exploit the fact that the Forestry engine doesn't really understand how IC2 power scales and instead use the IC2 powergen ecosystem (which is notoriously design-wise broken) to power BC? Sounds like you're a fan!

Remember, the new pipes have a limit to how much power can be sent down the line. I'm not sure if the system is smart enough to not run engines if it is choked, but you can limit how much makes it through. If you have other pressing uses for the power than resource gathering, then it would be wise to run only a fraction towards the quarry.

Resource gathering is only a tiny fraction of what BC power is used for these days. But I guess maybe not in 1.6?


I guess what you'll have to do with workshops is use other mods (or barring that, a lever signal bridged into the pipe network) to hard shut off system. Of course, what's going to happen here if I play with this mod is I am going to fire up OpenPeripherals and do it all that way, because lasers are crazy expensive (in resources, power, and infrastructure) for what they do.

Unless you're enamored of the hard-to-use pipe plug, I guess.

 

[Sub]

And as always this forum's cliche appeared. This thread became a discussion of another subject.

 

[GPuzzle]

And as always this forum's cliche this thread became a discussion of another subject.

What, were you expecting something different? We all digress.

 

[Uristqwerty]

*This* forum's? You really haven't seen the lower sections of the Dwarf Fortress forum, then. 0 to off topic in 10 posts or less!

Also, on the subject of gates, consider the case where you disconnect a set of always-on machines when they are not in use. You can have the engines adapt automatically, without having to run wiring the entire distance. Less of a concern if you can send signals wirelessly, though.

You can also set up power usage indicator lights, for a fancier control room (consider a long row, going green->yellow->orange->red, based on how many engines need to run. At red, all engines are on, and there isn't any spare generation capacity, so running more machines would be a rather bad idea.)

 

[Saice]

I guess what you'll have to do with workshops is use other mods (or barring that, a lever signal bridged into the pipe network) to hard shut off system. Of course, what's going to happen here if I play with this mod is I am going to fire up OpenPeripherals and do it all that way, because lasers are crazy expensive (in resources, power, and infrastructure) for what they do.

I've been looking at power control options for my base to be be honest I think a silly but simple system is just using a TiC drawbridge with a BC pipe in it and a lever. Flip pipe goes out and connects network. Flip pipe gets pulled back in and stuff is no longer connected to the network. Can do this with BC Pipes, TE Conduits, and EU Transport pipes.

 

[GPuzzle]

*This* forum's? You really haven't seen the lower sections of the Dwarf Fortress forum, then. 0 to off topic in 10 posts or less!

Also, on the subject of gates, consider the case where you disconnect a set of always-on machines when they are not in use. You can have the engines adapt automatically, without having to run wiring the entire distance. Less of a concern if you can send signals wirelessly, though.

You can also set up power usage indicator lights, for a fancier control room (consider a long row, going green->yellow->orange->red, based on how many engines need to run. At red, all engines are on, and there isn't any spare generation capacity, so running more machines would be a rather bad idea.)

Any forum. Everyone digresses. That's why almost every forum needs a no topic thread. Like the one we had. *cue funeral march*
Anyway, I don't think that crafting was a thing I like doing, unless I have NEI. It's my zen activity, like strip mining. On the other hand, trying to figure out stuff at random is boring to me.

 

[CapturetheBomb]

So actually, you prefer to exploit the fact that the Forestry engine doesn't really understand how IC2 power scales and instead use the IC2 powergen ecosystem (which is notoriously design-wise broken) to power BC? Sounds like you're a fan!

Exploit? No. I like the storage of power for IC2 more than the storage given by TE as a preference. My only need for MJs would be the TE pulverizer and furnaces (induction and normal). Almost everything else would use EU, including MFR farms.

Resource gathering is only a tiny fraction of what BC power is used for these days. But I guess maybe not in 1.6?

I guess what you'll have to do with workshops is use other mods (or barring that, a lever signal bridged into the pipe network) to hard shut off system. Of course, what's going to happen here if I play with this mod is I am going to fire up OpenPeripherals and do it all that way, because lasers are crazy expensive (in resources, power, and infrastructure) for what they do.

Unless you're enamored of the hard-to-use pipe plug, I guess.

I was referring to if you needed it to run your farms from Forestry with no other mods installed. I'm not sure if there is any use for power in vanilla Buildcraft/Forestry, other than the bee machines.

 

[matpower123]

Exploit? No. I like the storage of power for IC2 more than the storage given by TE as a preference. My only need for MJs would be the TE pulverizer and furnaces (induction and normal). Almost everything else would use EU, including MFR farms.



I was referring to if you needed it to run your farms from Forestry with no other mods installed. I'm not sure if there is any use for power in vanilla Buildcraft/Forestry, other than the bee machines.

Vanilla BC includes laser,filler,quarry,Auto Laser table thing,Pump.
Unless you mean another thing,in this case,I'm sorry

 

[Avatar]

This is a really nice point. I myself would love to see crafting be more in depth than a 3x3 grid, i like the way flans planes mod has its crafting tables for planes, and mps has its own table to craft the modules into the suit, maybe forge could add a 18x18 crafting table (ok, mabye a little over the top, 9x9? (DW20 agrees!)) (<note as in the 9x9 reference)
I don't disagree with NEI, i love the thing, especially now with the shift click to put things in the crafting grid for you to be even more lazy But i would like to see the crafting system expanded upon by the modding community.

 

[matpower123]

Actually,I would like a 5x5,everything bigger is hard to memorize