What is "Too Much Grinding?"

[1SDAN]

First of all: No, this is not a new "mob grinder machin-a-whatsit," nor is this a thread for discussing those. Instead I'm here with a burning curiosity: When does grinding, become a grind?

We all know Minecraft is a game about grinding, without automation at least. And it is this grind that pushes us to automate our things. Mining is grinding, farming is grinding, and h@&k, even eating is grinding with the right mods installed. Then there's mods like TE, Mek and IC2 where it adds ways to get around this grind by having machines grind for you.

Many mods also try to add more grinding: PHC with the eating of foods, TFC with it's mining overhaul, and even mods such as BTW that force you to grind for a minute or so before you can even get started doing anything 'productive.' And sadly, here comes the part where it's all about me:

My modpack is trying to utilize this system to it's fullest potential: Punishing death by respawning you somewhere random and forcing the first in game day to be focused primarily on food collection and finding food. Then comes night and since it's pitch dark, (still can't find a way to lock the gamma like what used to happen in BnBs) you have to hide near bee hives or a bunch of redstone torches you crafter (don't ask) to even have a good idea of what's around you. (Technically you can see, but just the silhouette of things, and this really only lets you see the horizon line)

I would like to hear from you, the FTB community, your personal tastes for grinding and all things related.

DISCLAIMER: I don't want to turn this into a thread about a modpack that isn't even being considered for released anytime soon, but my ego forbids me from saying no to talking about it outright, so I guess if you add it in addition to some comment on Grinding it'd be okay.

 

[KingTriaxx]

Ugh. You're not going to get a good answer. I like PHC and GT, and yet, they're only kind of grindy. It seems like a grind, true, but eventually you realize that it wasn't because the rewards are sufficient that you're simply getting more than you put in.

 

[1SDAN]

Ugh. You're not going to get a good answer. I like PHC and GT, and yet, they're only kind of grindy. It seems like a grind, true, but eventually you realize that it wasn't because the rewards are sufficient that you're simply getting more than you put in.

I'm quite curious: why exactly won't I get a good answer? But just to clear things up, I'm mainly talking about the manual stuffs. I am almost positive you know that, but just wanting to clear it up last-minute.

 

[KingTriaxx]

Why is because grinding is incredibly subjective. What I consider a grind, is not the same that anyone else considers a grind. The opinions are so wide and varied and fraught with disagreements that you're going to get conflicting opinions.

 

[1SDAN]

Why is because grinding is incredibly subjective. What I consider a grind, is not the same that anyone else considers a grind. The opinions are so wide and varied and fraught with disagreements that you're going to get conflicting opinions.

Ah, good point.

 

[Azzanine]

When you get to a point in play where your RL job seems more fun to do then playing the game.
What determines too much grind is purley up to each individual, but some things are grindier then others.

 

[GreenZombie]

DISCLAIMER: I don't want to turn this into a thread about a modpack that isn't even being considered for released anytime soon, but my ego forbids me from saying no to talking about it outright, so I guess if you add it in addition to some comment on Grinding it'd be okay.

The simple rule of grinding is: if you fall asleep doing it, its too damned much.

There is nothing worse than game mechanics that encourage you to do nothing. If you make night time too much of a horror. people will wall themselves in and stare at dirt for 10 minutes. Make sure the players always have something pro-active to do, (more proactive than just wedging a weight onto a mouse button) and it will be good.

 

[YX33A]

When you get to a point in play where your RL job seems more fun to do then playing the game.
What determines too much grind is purley up to each individual, but some things are grindier then others.

A fine example at this point is IC2(EX) vs GT. GT costs a realatively small amount for what you get, but time is brought in as a additional cost. It delays the reward without dipping too deep into your resources aside from patience. And far too many people lack that one. Now, look at IC2(EX). Costs more then it used to for little to no extra benefit. Does less then GT even now, and costs more then GT ever did, because now it costs a pretty penny for your old machines, and they do nothing more then before, are harder to use, have close to zero NEI support... and like GT, take more time then a normal solution would.

Then, look at RotaryCraft, ReactorCraft, and ElectriCraft. Three mods that drain mostly iron, a easy to collect and process item. But they consume you beyond this, but forcing one to THINK about what they're are doing, and even worse, I'm afraid we'll have to use... Math.

ReactorCraft and ElectriCraft don't use nearly as much iron as RotaryCraft does, and in fact, have their own resources for many tasks.(RoC has zero items one can't get via vanilla items, so any special resource they need they have to add) But they are both RoC addons, and thus use a lot of iron because RoC uses a lot of iron. Funny how that works.

Still, for some people, Forestry is Grindy. Why? Because one can't "easily" produce a infinite amount of Forestry Fertilizer. How unfortunate. I think I'll drown my tears in the 50 years worth of it I made after I mined a single vein of Apatite with a fortune 1 pick and processed some of it with ash. Too many people see it as a bad thing they can't get an infinite amount of it. Such a pity they can't see the forest for all the trees, eh?

 

[Zarkov]

For me, something becomes a grind when I no longer feel like I'm simply playing the game, but rather become conscious about sitting in front of my computer and repetitively clicking buttons.

Also, doing completely trivial tasks over and over until you get the nod from Mr. RNG gets old really fast IMHO, especially when player input is of limited consequence.

As an example I think the initial early-game mining after diamonds is OK, since you can affect the outcome considerably by doing proper branch mining. On the other hand, once I managed to get a Refined Bee, the whole concept of Minecraft bee breeding died for me. Without that goal to motivate me, all that was left was the (more or less) mindless struggle against the RNG.

 

[McJty]

Grinding is subjective. I like the occasional mining from time to time. I enjoy the thrill of finding a rare mineral or diamond and collecting it. However, I also have automatic quarries/boring machines set up so that I don't actually *need* to do that. Same for other things. I like to craft but I do setup autocrafting nevertheless. I like to get some XP manually by fighting but I have mob farms collecting XP for me.

 

[xSINZx]

Ok Quick read of OP. What is too much Grinding!

EASY! DON'T Install Mod's Vanilla Minecraft you should do.

 

[epidemia78]

Ive tried enhancing Minecraft's survival aspect with mods and it always becomes a hassle. If you are automating stuff you will end up invincible with infinite everything anyway, eventually food and health becomes trivial no matter what, but mods like hunger overhaul will continue to hassle you long into the future forcing you to hold right click every so often just to stay alive. But you are not in any danger of running out of food. Whats fun about that? Its pointless.

 

[McJty]

I think that it is pretty natural that at some point the world you have been building will no longer hold your interest. For me that's usually when I have automated it enough so that there is not much left to do except build and cleanup. Luckily I'm still at the point that I haven't actually used all mods that I have yet so there is still a lot I need to experiment with.

How I play Minecraft really depends on the mood I'm in. Sometimes I'm all up for technical challenges and then I like to build complicated contraptions to automate stuff. Sometimes I just want to explore and then I try unvisited areas, create new mystcraft worlds to explore, go to twilight forest and things like that. Sometimes I just like to build and create 'beatyful' (subjective of course) buildings.

Additionally I really love the beginning game of Minecraft. Starting a new world and marveling at the new landscape around you. Selecting a good spot for a base. Thinking about what you want to do there and how. That's for me the most fun thing about Minecraft really.

 

[GreenZombie]

Ive tried enhancing Minecraft's survival aspect with mods and it always becomes a hassle. If you are automating stuff you will end up invincible with infinite everything anyway, eventually food and health becomes trivial no matter what, but mods like hunger overhaul will continue to hassle you long into the future forcing you to hold right click every so often just to stay alive. But you are not in any danger of running out of food. Whats fun about that? Its pointless.

Minecraft as a game does not provide much in the way of an end game.

For me, Minecraft is about building with blocks. I play, in survival, rather than creative, to give my build a hint of authenticity: But I play to build, NOT to defeat the wither. I defeat the wither, only incidentally, because I want a beacon, and I want a beacon because it will go nicely in the center of my temple complex, and I want the temple complex just because its different to the castle I previously built.

So, being able to not-run-out-of-food is not pointless: Its part of the journey to being able to make a staircase out of diamond blocks, diamond blocks that were gathered one way or other from the world, and not just manufactured in creative mode.

 

[iNd3x]

If you have to do the same thing over and over again without any mid-way reward, it's a grind.
When it's a grind, it's a matter of time before people get bored -This is where people are different (some think a little grind is relaxing, other's don't)
And if there's no other option than doing nothing or just doing one boring thing, then it's a boring grind.
If people have options, another way to do things, maybe more challenging (that would be fun)
Make sure if some1 dies in your pack that they are putted straight into action again, having some boring part before the fun part is bad, and will discourage users
This is my opinion and observation, others may vary (a lot!)

 

[YX33A]

Your Messed in the Head Dude. I have nothing else to Say. Apart from That's Just All Wrong! Are you trying to defer from the fact there's a Hundred and Forty Mods looking for Info?

Oh, and before I forget, if you wish to continue this "Insightful Discussion", best we take it to a PM so the thread doesn't get cluttered with two people "talking civilly", eh?

 

[Feniks]

It is gating silly here @Jadedcat @Lawbroken @anyone can we have clean up here and some good, old-fashioned warning?

 

[YX33A]

It is gating silly here @Jadedcat @Lawbroken @anyone can we have clean up here and some good, old-fashioned warning?

A simple "report" would suffice...

 

[Pyure]

When I first tinkered with agrarian skies and realized I was having to sieve stacks of things, I rebound the action key to the spacebar and weighed it down with a heavy object or jammed a screwdriver in there so I could go get things done whilst sieving.

That's the definition of too much.

 

[YX33A]

When I first tinkered with agrarian skies and realized I was having to sieve stacks of things, I rebound the action key to the spacebar and weighed it down with a heavy object or jammed a screwdriver in there so I could go get things done whilst sieving.

That's the definition of too much.

That's the definition of "early game skyblock maps" too. Lots of waiting, and not much else. The fun well and truly must be EARNED!