Too many Diamonds in Unleashed

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BeastFeeder

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Beast, while I know this isnt a competitive game, competition woks its way into every facet of entertainment in one way or another. I enjoy competition and its usually how I enjoy gaming. Some people, myself incuded, like to play with others who are similar and Compete with each other. This can be done in minecraft via hoard size, speed, scale, and whatnot of builds. It compels you to go further thn you would if you were building only for yourself, aand is rewarding because you grow your ability.

This type of playstyle isnt conducive to 'house rules' (self-imposed limitations or self-imposed mechanic changes) and requires some form of scarcity. Its like playing legos and valuing the laser peices more. That's why it bothers some people.

Edit: new forum doesn't like my mobile keyboard
But have you competed based on who has the most diamond blocks? What about who has the most barrels full of diamonds? What about emeralds? You can compete about anything. Is throwing an orange ball through a horizontal circle like they do in basketball actually a valuable skill? No. There's ALWAYS something to compete on if thats your thing.

Do we need to complain to lego that they're sending too many of the laser pieces in their kits? I dont happen to think so....but if you want to it's your prerogative.
 
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zorn

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But have you competed based on who has the most diamond blocks? What about who has the most barrels full of diamonds? What about emeralds? You can compete about anything. Is throwing an orange ball through a horizontal circle like they do in basketball actually a valuable skill? No. There's ALWAYS something to compete on if thats your thing.

Do we need to complain to lego that they're sending too many of the laser pieces in their kits? I dont happen to think so....but if you want to it's your prerogative.
It's not always stockpiling it is often about game progression. I don't like being able to build all of the items in NEI on day 2 of playing. It's why I play survival and not creative.

@Hoff I think you're making a lot if assumptions about what he meant. The early posts did not say "I just build bigger builds" it said "don't complain, build bigger builds".

You can spin it any way you want, it changes nothing. Also ... Always assume people are voicing their opinion? That is HILARIOUS because I did that when I got here bit the anal retentive crazies here beat down everyone for not adding "in my opinion" any time someone states how they like the game.

Dave clearly said people should not want more resource scarcity, he was not talking about his own play style.
 
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BeastFeeder

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Have you checked out the unhinged pack? Its description says it's designed to lengthen early game play. You may enjoy it more.
 

tedyhere

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If you notice the early comments a few pages ago were deriding people like me who wanted less diamonds. "build bigger stuff" "it doesnt matter how many resources you have, just what you do with them"

These comments are telling people who want more scarcity that they should not enjoy that. You are saying I should just void the diamonds. I am trying to tell you I dont enjoy voiding diamonds, I like to feel they are scarce. Notice that I am not telling you that diamonds should be scarce in your world, or how to play, I am saying I want them to be rare.

the only person telling others how to play the game is you (and a few others.) Do you not see this? You are telling me I should void them, I am trying to say that is not enjoyable for me. Why do you keep telling me (and others) to not want to reduce diamond ore gen rates? My ideal sandbox is set up so that the game has constraints. Like that diamonds are rare, and i have to struggle to get them. to me if i can void diamonds I might as well play creative mode, all of the thrill of gathering a rare resource is lost.
If you want diamonds to be rare than change the configs.. It is rather simple, or find a modpack that has scarcity as it's general theme...or heck make one. That is what I am saying, you can set the game up to be how you want. If others want to play like you do than a modpack would be the best bet for you and others.

If you want to reduce the diamond gen rate DO IT, don't complain that an established pack has to many diamonds or not enough Iron or whatever. The pack is made for the vast majority of people who like the gen rate and don't want to grind to find things.

Like I said it's a sandbox game you can play it however you want, that is why there are config options. Myself I play with hardly any tech and use Tinkers Construct alongside Iguana's Tweaks, highest tech I have is Steve's Carts which does all my automation.

Also yes, diamonds are not in vast quantity on my world, so all that hardened alloy I need for high end Steve's Carts items is a bear to get. If you don't like a way a pack is set up it's as simple as changing a few configs and adding/removing mods you like/don't like.

In summary, it's a sandbox game there are people on both ends of the spectrum of Not Enough Diamonds/Too Many Diamonds. So the pack is set up between both to please a majority of players.
 

PhilHibbs

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From this you seem to see it as "No don't ever lower them just void them if you don't like it" what he really means is: "If you have too many just void some so they're scarce again".
"woot, I found diamonds, I was running low and now I can build cool stuff" vs "woot, diamonds, these will replace the diamonds I threw into lave because I had so many diamonds". Do you not see a difference? One is fun, the other in an insult to my intelligence.
 

Hoff

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"woot, I found diamonds, I was running low and now I can build cool stuff" vs "woot, diamonds, these will replace the diamonds I threw into lave because I had so many diamonds". Do you not see a difference? One is fun, the other in an insult to my intelligence.
For you; maybe. I could however see myself setting up an automatic mining system that automatically voids half the diamonds it finds if I felt I was getting too many. Again no one should ever be offended by people offering suggestions based on their personal playstyle no matter what that playstyle is.
 
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PhilHibbs

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For you; maybe. I could however see myself setting up an automatic mining system that automatically voids half the diamonds it finds if I felt I was getting too many. Again no one should ever be offended by people offering suggestions based on their personal playstyle no matter what that playstyle is.
If I'm auto-mining, I'm unlikely to care about ore density, I'd probably want it as high as possible in order to cut down on the huge strip mine holes. It's only the manual miners with their Fortune picks or Silk Touch & Factorization / Rich Slag set-ups that care. And as Uka Thurman said, "my natural response might be to get offended", you can't control that. All you can do is point it out in the hope that people realise it and stop being offensive.
 

BeastFeeder

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Or maybe dw20 with ore gen at about the rates people are accustomed to?
Sure, but last time I played DW20 (6 months ago) it had "easy mode" crafting recipes that could all be created pretty early anyway. Maybe its different now.
 

Hoff

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You can spin it any way you want, it changes nothing. Also ... Always assume people are voicing their opinion? That is HILARIOUS because I did that when I got here bit the anal retentive crazies here beat down everyone for not adding "in my opinion" any time someone states how they like the game.
Which is the main reason you should just ignore what the anal retentive crazies say. Anyone who is on a discussion forum and doesn't assume every post begins, unspokenly, with in my opinion unless otherwise stated; is automatically wrong.

@Hoff I think you're making a lot if assumptions about what he meant. The early posts did not say "I just build bigger builds" it said "don't complain, build bigger builds".

Dave clearly said people should not want more resource scarcity, he was not talking about his own play style.
Let's add in that bit about assuming everything someone posts is an opinion:
In my opinion whenever you think, "I have too may X" the proper response is, "I guess I'd better build something more awesome."
It makes it much less aggressive when you think about it like that.

And yes he was not specifically talking about his playstyle but rather the way he thinks people should play. Not that he's forcing it on them just that's the way he thinks would be better for most.

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And as Uka Thurman said, "my natural response might be to get offended", you can't control that. All you can do is point it out in the hope that people realise it and stop being offensive.
The problem with that natural reaction is that it's the shittiest possible and anyone that reacts that way can control and change it. If you do not wish to change that attitude then no one else has to change how they do things regardless of how it makes you feel.

In regards to pleasing both; you can't have the default work for both sides. More people prefer the higher density so they went with that. Those that don't want it are free to change it to their taste.
 
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BeastFeeder

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If I'm auto-mining, I'm unlikely to care about ore density, I'd probably want it as high as possible in order to cut down on the huge strip mine holes. It's only the manual miners with their Fortune picks or Silk Touch & Factorization / Rich Slag set-ups that care. And as Uka Thurman said, "my natural response might be to get offended", you can't control that. All you can do is point it out in the hope that people realise it and stop being offensive.
No one is being "offensive" by offering their advice for using the surplus of resources that you can get when you choose to play a modded game. They're attempting to be kind and helpful.
 
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tedyhere

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No one is being "offensive" by offering their advice for using the surplus of resources that you can get when you choose to play a modded game. They're attempting to be kind and helpful.
I find this whole advice thing offensive....wait...that means I offend myself! :oops:
 

PhilHibbs

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The problem with that natural reaction is that it's the shittiest possible and anyone that reacts that way can control and change it. If you do not wish to change that attitude then no one else has to change how they do things regardless of how it makes you feel.
There's no interpretation of "if you think there are too many diamonds then toss them in lava" other than as an insult. I don't see that as my problem.
In regards to pleasing both; you can't have the default work for both sides. More people prefer the higher density so they went with that. Those that don't want it are free to change it to their taste.
How do you find out how the majority feel, other than to have an open expression of opinions that doesn't descent into this kind of idiotic "if you don't like it, then do something stupid" nonsense?
No one is being "offensive" by offering their advice for using the surplus of resources that you can get when you choose to play a modded game. They're attempting to be kind and helpful.
"If you have too many diamonds, then try to do things with them" isn't really helpful either. It's also kind of insulting, it's fungible with "you don't have enough imagination".
 

BeastFeeder

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There's no interpretation of "if you think there are too many diamonds then toss them in lava" other than as an insult. I don't see that as my problem.

How do you find out how the majority feel, other than to have an open expression of opinions that doesn't descent into this kind of idiotic "if you don't like it, then do something stupid" nonsense?

"If you have too many diamonds, then try to do things with them" isn't really helpful either. It's also kind of insulting, it's fungible with "you don't have enough imagination".
I don't think that the only interpretation of suggesting destroying your extra diamonds like I did is that it's insulting. If I were trying to insult you I would have said "stop mining so much for stuff you don't want you moron". It's not the devs fault you have such a limited imagination and are so easily insulted.
 
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Mero

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I'm still trying to wrap my head around people thinking that diamonds are hard to acquire large amounts of in vanilla.

I am currently playing a 1.6.4 world with just a limited number of mods, everything is vanilla generation.
I was siting on almost half a stack of diamonds before I got silk touch and anything above fortune 1. Now I still have over a dozen diamonds and over half a stack of diamond ores.

I have done very little mining, probably less than 3 hours.

I just can't really fathom how people ever have issues getting diamonds in vanilla, outside of purposely gathering them in the least efficient ways they can.
 

BeastFeeder

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I'm going to start a thread about how many extra trees there are. It makes it WAY to easy to build chests and crafting benches if you ask me. I think each biome should be limited to one tree. 2 in jungles.

And dont tell me I dont have to cut down trees either. I like cutting down trees. It's how I play. I play clearcut-lumberjack-craft...the only thing that sucks is that I wind up with so much wood its ridiculous. I only want what I can use so I expect the mods developers to reduce the tree generation rates for every one.

Wooden houses suck though so I dont build with any type of wood.
 

Hoff

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There's no interpretation of "if you think there are too many diamonds then toss them in lava" other than as an insult. I don't see that as my problem.
There is; it's advice. Though it is advice not because of the way you worded it but the way he did. It is also the best advice for someone playing on a server that they don't want to leave and have no control over the ore generation.

How do you find out how the majority feel, other than to have an open expression of opinions that doesn't descent into this kind of idiotic "if you don't like it, then do something stupid" nonsense?
Assuming the number 1 downloaded modpack of FTB is Unleashed; those that are vocal about there being too many of anything(Here, reddit, or otherwise) are few and far apart. More than that you're assuming that people are telling others that their only option is to "if you don't like it then do xxx", which they aren't. More people play on servers than not and as such require solutions that befit servers in which they have no voice.

"If you have too many diamonds, then try to do things with them" isn't really helpful either. It's also kind of insulting, it's fungible with "you don't have enough imagination".
And some people simply don't have that imagination. There are far more non-creative people(In terms of building; be it machines, buildings, or otherwise) than creative. It's simply a fact and offering advice on possible things that can be done is in no way inherently offensive.

This descent into never-ending hyperboles is getting old though.
 

KirinDave

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Why is a diamond fountain cool? Really think about it, it's a bland textured blue block, less interesting aesthetically than most other blocks in the game. Other than wanting a smooth textured light blue block, why would anyone build stuff with it?

Because it is rare. And that's it. Look at the guy with the diamond fountain. "Why did I build it? Because i can"
But this is my entire point. This idea that there is value in any object besides what can be built with it is what I hope goes away. Bits stored in a file representing a chest or fountain is meaningless.

The only value from ANYTHING built in Minecraft is the value you derive from building it. Did you have fun doing it? If not, then it was a waste of your time.

Minecraft is more than a building game like people say. It's a resource gathering game and a survival game. Creative mode is *specifically* a building game mode only. Survival is about gathering resources. So the reason people are worried about making resources easy to gather is that it then takes away the pride in building something.
So I have this LP series and it uses v1 of the oregen for RR. Lots of ores. Too much, we all agreed. Like lolmany. You can see it in recent episodes. My mining system still took me hours of care, included multiple false starts, and even now needs some tiny improvements. It is unique, distinct, and may be the first of its kind built (for what it's worth). It was built in an environment of lolresources, but most people would not agree that resources were ever the gating factor.

Why did I do it? Because quarries are boring and I demand novelty. I did it because I could.

And that's the key to realize with modded minecraft. In Vanilla, resources usually are the gating factor. In modded minecraft, it's more about your cleverness and knowledge of all the mods. You can be very strong from Day 1 if that is the game you want to play. You can have hours of amazing exploration with great rewards if that is the game you want to play.

None of that is changed by having a 33% increase to spawn diamonds and the emerald biome limitation lifted.

If it didn't matter, then why not just double or triple ore generation rates like Technic's big dig pack does? Diamonds right on the side of cliff faces, you cant mine 10 blocks forward without hitting some kind of ore or gem.
Slippery slope arguments aside, the goal is to make oregen that is dense enough for hand miners, but light enough that autominers will be rewarded. Resonant Rise also sharply layers its ores to encourage people to build custom horisontal mining solutions to maximize specific yield. We punish quarries and reward RC, SC2, thaumcraft, Ars, and ME+MFFS worm miners.

These same people say we can all play the game how we want. For some people it does matter, which is why people post screenshots of how many resources they have.
If all you are doing is collecting resources to put in a jar, then I cannot fathom your mindset. Fortunately, I do not have to. But I am not going to cater or pretend I understand your mindset. I am always struggling for resources to keep up with my build ideas. I adjust the scope of my operations to the resources at hand, from the humble portable crafting table all the way up to the ME Autocrafter.

50 diamonds per quarry... this is like Technic's Big Dig pack, and believe me it gets old really fast. I am actaully finding more diamonds mining by hand in DW20 than I did when i started playing and played Big Dig. One of the reasons we moved to ftb was to find packs that had slower game progression.
You do realize even DW20 1.4.7 had elevated diamond spawn rates...?

Diamonds can easily stay close to vanilla rates. Yes these mods require more diamonds than vanilla does, but they also offer ways to bring in resources much more quickly too.
Actually diamonds are funny to give out in bulk because they're mostly useless. Almost no mod requires them in bulk. Usually iron, copper, ender pearls and blaze rods are my limiting factors. The other day shooting my episode, people watched me use 160 iron in 24 minutes. I think I used 3 diamonds.

The funniest part of your complaint: Diamonds are actually pretty easy to get in huge bulk even in vanilla once you get access to fortune and silk touch. Given how exceptionally common those effects are in modern modded minecraft, I really do wonder what kind of game you're playing where you think they're rare.
 
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PierceSG

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Yeah, I consume much more other resources than diamonds. You do not need more than half a stack of diamonds for most of your machines (IC2 excluded, they need them for the energy stones thingamabob), I'm always short on copper, tin and iron instead.