[Thaumcraft 4.2] How Does Flux Work?

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Fyuiy

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Jul 29, 2019
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*I mean Warp*

I have pretty much completed Thaumcraft 4.1 in 1.6.4, but recently I got into some more "modern" packs and am wondering about the new mechanic-flux. I know that flux is gained from researching forbidden magic and that can give you side affects, but when does the Flux tab unlock? How much forbidden magic do I need to do?

I would also like to know how the new node stuff works (combination, moving them, etc..).

Thaumcraft is my favorite mod and I would love to gather more knowledge about this masterpiece!

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GreenZombie

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Warp is gained from researching forbidden magic, and making forbidden things.

Flux is the byproduct of crafting, usually overflowing the crucible in TC4, but in TC5 almost every crafting option has an inefficiency in. Flux is also produced if you use machines that empty the aura of vis.

Taint is the byproduct of high levels of flux, it can also spawn when fighting a champion mob with the Infested? prefix.
 

Someone Else 37

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Indeed, there are two different "punishing" mechanics at play in TC4 in 1.7.10.

Warp, not flux, is gained from both researching forbidden knowledge and from crafting forbidden items. Flesh golems are good if you want a lot of it, as they can be melted back down into all the aspects necessary to craft a new one- you just need another flesh block. Eating zombie brains is also a popular method.

If you have warp, you will occasionally get warp headaches. The edges of your screen will darken briefly, you'll hear a heartbeat sound, something will be printed to the chatbox, and maybe something else will happen. Earlygame, it's mostly paranoia messages ("Something is behind you..." even when there's not) and the occasional free research point. With more warp, you'll get more serious effects, such as debuffs or enemies actually spawning in.

If you go for a while without gaining any more warp, the time between events will gradually increase, until it stops happening altogether. However, if you do so much as a single forbidden research, the slowdown thing will reset, so you'll get warp events pretty frequently for a while.

In addition, there are two ways to mitigate the effects of warp. Purifying bath salts will give you a buff that prevents warp events entirely. The more warp you have, the less time this lasts; but with moderate warp it'll last about twenty minutes. Sanitizing soap, on the other hand, will remove warp from you, reducing the intensity of warp events. It works better if you use it while under the effects of the bath salts.

There are three kinds of warp: Temporary, "sticky", and permanent. Temporary warp can come from crafting and eating zombie brains, will gradually decay on its own, and is removed entirely whenever you use a bar of soap. Sticky warp (just called Warp ingame) comes from crafting and researching forbidden items. It will not decay on its own and can only be removed bit by bit by the soap- using soap with the bath salts warp ward buff will have a much better chance of removing some sticky warp. Finally, permanent warp is only gained from the more taboo forbidden researches. There's no way to get rid of it.

The Eldritch tab in the thaumonomicon and the Eldritch Revelation research within both require you to have warp. I'm not entirely clear on the requirements, but I think that the tab will unlock once you've got enough permanent+sticky warp, and the revelation research when you get a warp event after researching all its prerequisites. Craft a sanity checker when you can (it's in the eldritch tab); it'll tell you how much warp you have. You'll never need your sticky warp to go very far past the lower marking.

With all that done, Flux is much simpler. Whenever an aspect in a crucible evaporates or overflows, it has a chance of creating a cloud of flux gas or a puddle of flux goo, which will eventually evaporate into flux gas as well. If you leave too much flux goo or gas sitting around for too long, it will start spawning tainted fibers and turning the local biome to Tainted Lands. You can clear it up by displacing it with a block, or with the use of the Flux Scrubber, a more late-game item. There's also a couple other things that can produce flux, such as one of the warp debuffs, but that's the gist of it.

As for nodes... if you get two of them close enough together (the radius is four or five blocks, if I remember correctly), they will start to bully each other. They'll drain and occasionally steal aspects from each other, with the net result that one gets bigger while the other is drained into nothingness. There's really no point in doing this unless you want to create a large node to energize- if you're just recharging wands, having multiple smaller nodes is much more efficient.

You can mitigate the effects of bullying by using Node Stabilizers. The basic one will prevent the node from interacting with other nodes entirely; while the advanced one will only allow it to drain other nodes, and not the other way around. They also reduce the rate at which your nodes recharge, but that can be mitigated by packing in more nodes.
 

Fyuiy

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Jul 29, 2019
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Warp is gained from researching forbidden magic, and making forbidden things.

Flux is the byproduct of crafting, usually overflowing the crucible in TC4, but in TC5 almost every crafting option has an inefficiency in. Flux is also produced if you use machines that empty the aura of vis.

Taint is the byproduct of high levels of flux, it can also spawn when fighting a champion mob with the Infested? prefix.
Sorry about that I meant Warp. I am unable to edit the title so I added something to the start.

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Fyuiy

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Jul 29, 2019
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Indeed, there are two different "punishing" mechanics at play in TC4 in 1.7.10.

Warp, not flux, is gained from both researching forbidden knowledge and from crafting forbidden items. Flesh golems are good if you want a lot of it, as they can be melted back down into all the aspects necessary to craft a new one- you just need another flesh block. Eating zombie brains is also a popular method.

If you have warp, you will occasionally get warp headaches. The edges of your screen will darken briefly, you'll hear a heartbeat sound, something will be printed to the chatbox, and maybe something else will happen. Earlygame, it's mostly paranoia messages ("Something is behind you..." even when there's not) and the occasional free research point. With more warp, you'll get more serious effects, such as debuffs or enemies actually spawning in.

If you go for a while without gaining any more warp, the time between events will gradually increase, until it stops happening altogether. However, if you do so much as a single forbidden research, the slowdown thing will reset, so you'll get warp events pretty frequently for a while.

In addition, there are two ways to mitigate the effects of warp. Purifying bath salts will give you a buff that prevents warp events entirely. The more warp you have, the less time this lasts; but with moderate warp it'll last about twenty minutes. Sanitizing soap, on the other hand, will remove warp from you, reducing the intensity of warp events. It works better if you use it while under the effects of the bath salts.

There are three kinds of warp: Temporary, "sticky", and permanent. Temporary warp can come from crafting and eating zombie brains, will gradually decay on its own, and is removed entirely whenever you use a bar of soap. Sticky warp (just called Warp ingame) comes from crafting and researching forbidden items. It will not decay on its own and can only be removed bit by bit by the soap- using soap with the bath salts warp ward buff will have a much better chance of removing some sticky warp. Finally, permanent warp is only gained from the more taboo forbidden researches. There's no way to get rid of it.

The Eldritch tab in the thaumonomicon and the Eldritch Revelation research within both require you to have warp. I'm not entirely clear on the requirements, but I think that the tab will unlock once you've got enough permanent+sticky warp, and the revelation research when you get a warp event after researching all its prerequisites. Craft a sanity checker when you can (it's in the eldritch tab); it'll tell you how much warp you have. You'll never need your sticky warp to go very far past the lower marking.

With all that done, Flux is much simpler. Whenever an aspect in a crucible evaporates or overflows, it has a chance of creating a cloud of flux gas or a puddle of flux goo, which will eventually evaporate into flux gas as well. If you leave too much flux goo or gas sitting around for too long, it will start spawning tainted fibers and turning the local biome to Tainted Lands. You can clear it up by displacing it with a block, or with the use of the Flux Scrubber, a more late-game item. There's also a couple other things that can produce flux, such as one of the warp debuffs, but that's the gist of it.

As for nodes... if you get two of them close enough together (the radius is four or five blocks, if I remember correctly), they will start to bully each other. They'll drain and occasionally steal aspects from each other, with the net result that one gets bigger while the other is drained into nothingness. There's really no point in doing this unless you want to create a large node to energize- if you're just recharging wands, having multiple smaller nodes is much more efficient.

You can mitigate the effects of bullying by using Node Stabilizers. The basic one will prevent the node from interacting with other nodes entirely; while the advanced one will only allow it to drain other nodes, and not the other way around. They also reduce the rate at which your nodes recharge, but that can be mitigated by packing in more nodes.
Wow! Thank you for explaining all of that, I knew a little bit about the different types of warp you can aquire and the side effects. I did not know about how to unlock the Eldritch tab though.

I have a few questions though:

-Based on prior knowledge, how much forbidden magic needs to be researched (any estimate will do).

-Do the rewards outweigh the risk?

What I mean:

When you get the Eldritch tab and have all of these warp effects along the way, are they mostly minor? Once you have the new tab, do you collect more warp and can get rid of it with the sanitizing salt? I assume that the permanent warp is, indeed, permanent, but is there something to negate these 'risks' that come with power.

-Are node stabilizers worth it?

When you capture these nodes in the jar and bring them back to the desired location and start the 'process' is it worth it? I assume node stabilization can be a bit expensive.





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Pyure

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Aug 14, 2013
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I'm not the authority on this.

I unlocked Eldritch last week after research around half of the forbidden stuff available in Infinity Evolved. I was at around "half" insanity at the time. In a previous modpack, I had to be in the "upper" bar of insanity before I unlocked the tab if memory serves.

There are some neat toys in Eldritch. My favorite is probably the advanced alchemical furnace that almost instantly shreds and distills items into essentia. That thing is ridiculous and borderline OP with thaumic energistics installed.

I don't bother node-stabilizing unless I'm trying to repair a node or I'm setting up a centivis node. Vis gets replenished more quickly in non-stabilized nodes. I just keep a bunch of non-stabilized nodes at my base (far enough from each other than they don't bully).
 
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Azzanine

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There are 3 malignant aspects to Thaumcraft. Flux, taint and warp.

Flux; is created from reckless use of alchemy. It is what afflicts your player. Comes in the form of purple gas or fluid.
Taint; is the result of too much flux affecting the environment. Can spawn huge purple biomes full of danger.
Warp; reserching what ought not be reserched tears your mind, body and soul asunder. It can cause random debuffs. The worst being unnatural hunger which rapidly decreases your hunger bar, you eat rotten flesh and brains to decrease it. There's also sunscorned which sets you on fire if you touch light over a certain level.

Thaumcraft is unfortunately one of those mods that of you get in to you need to focus on. Make sure you get sanitizing soap and spa reserch before delving deep in to TC4 and it's addons. Get too high of a warp level and you will be regularly accosted by Eldritch Guardians.

Also node stabilization doesn't cost anything extra other then vis, the glass for the jar and the stabilizer inducer combo.

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GreenZombie

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Wow! Thank you for explaining all of that, I knew a little bit about the different types of warp you can aquire and the side effects. I did not know about how to unlock the Eldritch tab though.

I have a few questions though:

-Based on prior knowledge, how much forbidden magic needs to be researched (any estimate will do).

-Do the rewards outweigh the risk?

What I mean:

When you get the Eldritch tab and have all of these warp effects along the way, are they mostly minor? Once you have the new tab, do you collect more warp and can get rid of it with the sanitizing salt? I assume that the permanent warp is, indeed, permanent, but is there something to negate these 'risks' that come with power.

-Are node stabilizers worth it?

When you capture these nodes in the jar and bring them back to the desired location and start the 'process' is it worth it? I assume node stabilization can be a bit expensive.

- First, note that warp effects naturally taper off if you don't to any activity that generates warp. And unless you want an army of flesh golems, theres only so much warped stuff to do before your only recourse is to eat the occasional zombie brain.

As such, once you have a non zero level of warp, you will eventually unlock the warp tab randomly on a warp event (headache, thaumarea, "there is something behind you" etc) with the Eldritch Ephiphany research being discovered.

Later, you need to have a lot of warp - temporary, sticky, or permanent - to unlock Eldritch Revelation required to visit the Outer Lands. For this, you can make a warp meter, so you simply eat zombie brains to get the meter full, and then to keep the events coming.

- Because the warp events taper off, there is ultimately no risk really. You might have to endure a couple of Eldritch Guardian attacks and then, until you eat a brain or make a flesh golem, you will be quite uninterrupted.

- In Thaumcraft 4, you are going to want to build an energized node. And you will want that energized node to have all aspects on it. So you are going to need to start by capturing nodes in jars, building a room to grow a node, and then energizing that node. The node stabilizers and advanced node stabilizers are crucial to allowing you to (a) repair any nodes that got damaged to fading, (b) protect weak nodes from being depleted while you build the node growing room, and (c) are a component of the energized node setup.

A node growth room consists of a 7x7x7 space with a, preferably bright, node in the center that is being grown, and 8 victim nodes in the corners. Because there are 8 victim nodes (ensure the center node is the largest), each one has a 1 in 8 chance of being picked to be bullied giving them time to recharge and contribute the most to the growth of the center node. When the center node has at least 25 in each of the primal aspects you can energize it for a 5cv/t node which is enough for all Thaumcraft 4 purposes. Or you can feed it more victims, and wait for it to grow past 100 in each aspect for a 10cv/t energized node, which will allow you to enchant wand focii much faster, but otherwise be quite overpowered.
 
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Azzanine

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Or if you are lucky you can find a hungry node and feed it all the crafting tables you can some sort of automation for dropping is nessesary. You will have to then taint the node to passify the hungry aspect, there may be other ways of doing it but tainting the node is the only way I have heard that works.
You feed it crafting tables because hungry nodes have a chance of absorbing aspects of the items it sucks in. As crafting tables have fabricio in them and fabricio is made up from all of the aspects you end up with a super powerful centivis node with all aspects.

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Someone Else 37

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To be clear: Stabilizing a node costs no more than a stabilizer and half the node's recharge rate, and primarily allows your wand recharging area (recharge pedestal HIGHLY recommended) more compact. If you space the nodes out in a 16x16x16 or 17x17x17 volume, if I remember correctly, you can fit 64 of them within range of a recharge pedestal without any of them bullying, which is far more than you're ever likely to need. Stabilizers let you cluster the nodes around each other in a more aesthetically appealing fashion with a much smaller footprint.

Also note that the process of jarring and transporting nodes has a chance to degrade them, from bright to normal and from normal to pale. Before you open the jar, make sure you've placed it in the right spot. Or just use another mod to move your nodes around, such as Blood Magic Teleposers.
 
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GreenZombie

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Also note that the process of jarring and transporting nodes has a chance to degrade them, from bright to normal and from normal to pale. Before you open the jar, make sure you've placed it in the right spot. Or just use another mod to move your nodes around, such as Blood Magic Teleposers.

It might be more accurate to say, jarring nodes has a chance to not degrade them. Iirc the chance to degrade is ~75% - which is why I always use a blood magic teleposer to move them in 1.7.10 packs.
 
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Fyuiy

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How's the Eldritch armor?

Is it safe to say the Eldritch stuff is some of the best things you can get in Thaumcraft 4.2?

*Thanks for all of the information everyone*

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