[TC3] First impressions

[Jugg3rV]

Well, how shall i put it ... i know TC3 is kind of WIP or some prerelease ... something like that, far from finished.
And i think i have all research done ... so but it bluntly, from this version of TC3 i have to say i am kind of disapointed.

TC3 took a lot of ressources to get the research done, and it feels that the "hard" research costs far less ressources than the carefull version. I love how TC3 gives player the option to change materials via alchemy, and it is a bit of a cost too. So perfect in my point of view.
But in the end i wonder, why to spend so much on research to do some low transmutations, perhaps craft some wands or some boots for late game. I kind of miss the midgame stuff you can play with while researching the real imporant magicall theories.
I was that bored from TC3 i even used NEI to get me enough items to finish all research in hope to find something thats was worth researching.

And as i said, i am a hugh fan of TC2 and i know TC3 was kind of pre-released to get ppl playing and i love how the vis nodes interact with each other, but i don't see the point (yet). Or i do not have all stuff researched ... which i do not believe ...

So, what is your opinion on TC3?

 

[Omicron]

I'm not sure what you consider "worth researching", but:

- The boots are the the best thing since sliced bread.
- The portable hole equals portable fun.
- The golems are adorable, if a little clunky to use.
- I could spend all day just throwing items at my hungry chest and watch it eat them.
- Candles and Nitor are great decorative items, as do the jars (in addition to providing essences for your altar).
- Alumentum. Right mouse button. 'Nuff said.

Right mow, there are 38 unlocks to find in the Thaumonomicon, 2 of which unlock automatically (the two that lead to Unified Thaumic Field Theory). Not counting the basic info/tutorial stuff, obviously.

And, here's a tip: Don't spawn in items. Try playing the game instead. That way you won't be instantly bored.

 

[Jugg3rV]

I do not like high end and late game research for some adorable pets that carry my buckets ... i do like this as a side arm of research, or in the beginning or midgame. Same is true for decorative items.

And i was instantly bored as i realized the mod doesn't give you any usefull items, so i spawned myself the items to finish the research. Nothing is more frustrating as to farm hours for items just so get a recipe for a door, that cannot be opened by other persons than yourself ... awesome for singleplayer

 

[Omicron]

That may be because TC3 is being developed with Multiplayer in mind.

Golems are very firmly midgame, not endgame. They're the first thing you do after Unified Field Theory, which is basically "leaving the kindergarten" as far as your skills as a thaumaturge are concerned. The portable hole and arcane ear, that's endgame.

I'll restate my question: what do you consider "worth researching" or "useful items"?

 

[Jugg3rV]

I am sorry, i forgot to set my sarkasm sign @singleplayer-remark

You pose a difficult question there. TC2 "repairer" was really usefull. I miss the farms you could make with the seals.
Stuff you craft to shape a part of the landscape, those are items for lategame.

Golems are a real nice idea, no doubt. But until you get them it take a good amount of time and ressources. And you will have to find a nether fortress, which i consider lategame (everything with nether is lategame).
So basically all that follows after the first time you need netherstuff. If you want full use of the golems, you need to research them all plus their cores.

The portable hole is, from its unqiue power, lategame, but for gameplay itsself nothing more than a gimmick.

Afaik there is no use for the vis nodes yet, which is real sad.

 

[Mero]

Golems are a real nice idea, no doubt. But until you get them it take a good amount of time and ressources. And you will have to find a nether fortress, which i consider lategame (everything with nether is lategame).

Nether fortresses are end game? I am doing this way wrong then. As soon as I get 4 iron I build a nether portal for the sole purpose of getting at least 1 blaze rod, although I come back with close to a stack plus glowstone nether brick/rack, soulsand and more often than not magma cream. On hard mode with nothing but stone tools and no armor at all.

 

[Jugg3rV]

Nether fortresses are end game? I am doing this way wrong then. As soon as I get 4 iron I build a nether portal for the sole purpose of getting at least 1 blaze rod, although I come back with close to a stack plus glowstone nether brick/rack, soulsand and more often than not magma cream. On hard mode with nothing but stone tools and no armor at all.

Possible, but not the way it was intended.

 

[Mero]

Possible, but not the way it was intended.

It's a sandbox game, the only intentions that matter are the players intentions.

I have no doubt it could be made impossible to get there until end game if they wanted, such as requiring db's to make the portal instead of obsidian.

 

[Jugg3rV]

It's a sandbox game, the only intentions that matter are the players intentions.

I have no doubt it could be made impossible to get there until end game if they wanted, such as requiring db's to make the portal instead of obsidian.

So, why is it not possible to mine diamonds with hand? Or redstone with a stone pickaxe?

You are right. It is a sandbox. And the players decide, how they want to play it. But still there are differences in acquiring items, and those differences show how the vanilla mc difficulty is set up.
For example the alchemist table

 

[Mero]

Obsidian has to be mined by diamond, yes. But you form obsidian by poring water on it. Remove the ability to pick up lava with a bucked and you can no longer form gates yourself.
I'm pretty sure they don't want to make obsidian harder to get though or they wouldn't have made the massive nerf to the time it takes to mine it.
Even taking out the ability to pour gates, you can have diamonds before the first night is over and have your gate the "legit" way.
If the devs really wanted to keep us out of the nether until late game they are countless ways to make that happen

 

[FrenchKafka]

It should be noted that TC3 is nowhere near finished. Azanor has stated that he's got 25% of what he has planned implemented.

Seconding the boots, they're very very useful. Also the portable hole. I don't know why you find it to be a gimmick, but I've found that it works very well for making hidden rooms, disabling or killing enemies, saving time while mining, and searching for caves and caverns.

While the hungry chest may seem to have few uses, combining it with the Infernal furnace (which I adore on almost every single level) means that your items are safely taken care of. Golems are low mantainence and easy to work with, in my mind, because of just how simple the instructions on using them are, vs buildcraft pipes, of which I still cannot tell you which pipe does what. It's also much, much easier to make a few straw and wood golems than it is to make and power a forestry farm.

Seconding candles as well. They are great and cheap alternatives to torches which add a wonderfully arcane feel to a house, vs IC2 luminators which are absurdly inefficient to use. And Nitor is floating, perfect for when you want lighting in the air but have to mine.

The Arcane ear is a stroke of brilliance. It's basically a short-range, low bandwidth wireless redstone device which is cheap to make and easy and fun to set up.

 

[NicoAD]

What I think about TC3 is the magic version of IC2.
Which now i don't disrespect magic anymore because this mod
But magic is under is league in FTB i hope more magic mods are to come.
I seperate the focuses on Science and Magic
Magic Mods:
TC3
Twilight
Myst
-Addons included
Enderstorage


Advance Technology/Magic:
EE3 -Little hard to see but it's base on FMA Fullmetal alchemist which is science.
Xycraft-Advanced technology but also the breaking point of the magic and science.

Science:
IC2
-Addons included
BC3
-Addons included
Computercraft
-Addons included
Forestry
-Addons included
Steve's Cart
RailCraft
Thermal Expansion
Redpower
-BTW the best tech mod ever

And My final thoughts of TC3 is the a good mod for expanding the magic feeling in FTB
BUt Science kills magic
Suggestion for magic mod
Arse Magic
Runic Dust
WIP FMA mod
ALTRIACRAFT

 

[SilvasRuin]

Erm, Azanor plans to add to the current tier of research, has definite plans for a third tier of research, and has tentative plans for a fourth tier of research. (Consider for a moment the Wand of the Thaumaturge, the third tier wand, contains more power in it than a vast majority of naturally generated nodes.) Golems aren't Thaumcraft 3's "high end and late game" research, not by a long shot. Which makes me think the real complaint you would have, if you had some perspective on the final scale of Thaumcraft 3, would be how long research takes... because I'd imagine if the research cost is going to change any between tiers, it's only going to get more costly.

 

[Jugg3rV]

What I think about TC3 is the magic version of IC2.
Which now i don't disrespect magic anymore because this mod
But magic is under is league in FTB i hope more magic mods are to come.
I seperate the focuses on Science and Magic
[...]

I think, that mods like EE shouldn't be put in tech mods, too. The mods should stay focused on one aspect of progress, magic or science.
Although if designed the right way a techtree, that combines both aspects would be nice.

 

[FrenchKafka]

I think it's rather important to determine what the mods are supposed to do, what reason they have for existing, rather than trying to file them away under "Magic" or "technological." If Equivalent Exchange stopped having the philosopher's stone and instead had a Star-Trek style replicator, it'd still be the same mod but with different trappings. If IC2 changed to "arcane metalwork from special metals found in certain places" and then had things being charged from magical energy, it'd still be IC2 with different trappings. Remember Arthur C Clark's theorem: Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from Magic.

With TC3, it seems that azanor is trying to re-capture that sense of discovery which new players have when they first started Minecraft.

 

[Jugg3rV]

I think it's rather important to determine what the mods are supposed to do, what reason they have for existing, rather than trying to file them away under "Magic" or "technological." If Equivalent Exchange stopped having the philosopher's stone and instead had a Star-Trek style replicator, it'd still be the same mod but with different trappings. If IC2 changed to "arcane metalwork from special metals found in certain places" and then had things being charged from magical energy, it'd still be IC2 with different trappings. Remember Arthur C Clark's theorem: Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from Magic.

With TC3, it seems that azanor is trying to re-capture that sense of discovery which new players have when they first started Minecraft.

I agree there, thus i would love to have 2 different styles of mods even if the effect is the same, the feeling at using them is different. I hope to show a nice of branch stand alone mod in the near future, that focuses on this problem. The player will have to chose between to setups as he progressses. Crossing magical and science setups may come at the end, in such manner: "now that you have completed all research, you are able to relearn knowlage long forgotten" or something like this.