RFTools - How OP this can go?!?!

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diehard586

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Jul 29, 2019
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I would like to comment about this particular mod called RFTools, which function is basically the same as Mystcraft but with some diferences, and the use of power of course... I've been working a little with this mod and i got surprised of how op this mod can get, like seriously op !!!

I created myself an liquid blutonium world and set some basins to transform into block and send to the network, also i made a world with Ender Dragon !! Both worlds are pretty cheaty and a little expensive in RF but when u got the op fuel world, its everything possible...

For example : Before i started work with RFTools, i got an 5x5 reactor and an turbine that i dont remember the size but the RF generation was kinda "poor" ( 13k/tick ), so after i worked in this world i created a new big reactor, 19x19 and blutonium as fuel... And the RF generation now is 95k/tick !!!

I would like to mention too that my blutonium world has an maintein cost is 3.238RF/tick and the Ender Dragon is 10.952RF/tick, i also got an normal flat world for quarry him which is 1.000RF/tick..

So, how op this mod can go?!?! And i would like to see some of yours RFtool dimensions, like a showcase...
 

Inaeo

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Jul 29, 2019
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Any mod that allows for custom dimensions will be innately overpowered. The option to build an entire world of fuel sources allows for any power requirements to be met after your first trip in, thereby devaluing the power requirements needed for future dimensions. Both Mystcraft and RFTools have different approaches to balance this, and thus distinct pros and cons when it comes to using them (for both casual and OP-grossness builds).

In the end, the responsibility lies with the player to have some self control. Some will use it to create the perfect setting for their base (some on servers do this to avoid griefers). Others will use is to absolutely break mod progression (ala, Life Essence Oceans to completely break Blood Magic). Others will use it as a quarry world and nothing else. Nobody is right or wrong to use it as they see fit. There is no way a mod developer can force players to play by some ethical code, not would most even if given the chance.

Any would-be pack designers would have to keep this in mind, and some (if not many) decide to disable the option from RFTools. The mod offers enough other content to justify its presence even without the dimensional aspect, so it's not cut completely. Others leave the option in, but tweak recipies to gate it into late game, where you likely don't need the boost it would provide normally.

If you see something completely out of whack, talk to the developer about it. I know @McJty has altered costs on some dimlets due to player feedback (Life Essence, in particular), and most of them are decent folk, so long as you're not a complete a-hole about it (some have less tolerance than others).

So far as a showcase goes, I love to see pictures of exotic locations and builds therein.
 
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diehard586

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
76
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0
Any mod that allows for custom dimensions will be innately overpowered. The option to build an entire world of fuel sources allows for any power requirements to be met after your first trip in, thereby devaluing the power requirements needed for future dimensions. Both Mystcraft and RFTools have different approaches to balance this, and thus distinct pros and cons when it comes to using them (for both casual and OP-grossness builds).

In the end, the responsibility lies with the player to have some self control. Some will use it to create the perfect setting for their base (some on servers do this to avoid griefers). Others will use is to absolutely break mod progression (ala, Life Essence Oceans to completely break Blood Magic). Others will use it as a quarry world and nothing else. Nobody is right or wrong to use it as they see fit. There is no way a mod developer can force players to play by some ethical code, not would most even if given the chance.

Any would-be pack designers would have to keep this in mind, and some (if not many) decide to disable the option from RFTools. The mod offers enough other content to justify its presence even without the dimensional aspect, so it's not cut completely. Others leave the option in, but tweak recipies to gate it into late game, where you likely don't need the boost it would provide normally.

If you see something completely out of whack, talk to the developer about it. I know @McJty has altered costs on some dimlets due to player feedback (Life Essence, in particular), and most of them are decent folk, so long as you're not a complete a-hole about it (some have less tolerance than others).

So far as a showcase goes, I love to see pictures of exotic locations and builds therein.
I made three dimensions, one mining dimension, and the others two dimensions i made like to break the game... like a blutonium sea and an ender dragon dimension.. yeah this is extremelly overpowered even costing power to use them... i'm thinking of turn off both worlds and leave only the mining dimension.. the ender dimension i'll shut down of course, but i'm thinking about the blutonium sea xD. I really don't care about make things easy, like a massive giant reactor and a blutonium sea dimension...

I always say, if its in the game, its allowed to use...
 

Inaeo

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Jul 29, 2019
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I don't disagree at the basic level, but at some point you have to ask yourself what content you've actually depreived yourself of. If this is your tenth time through Blood Magic, and you avoided it until late game, then I don't feel you've missed out on anything by skipping the early grind by using an ocean of Life Essence. However, if the first thing you do in a world is to make an overpowered Mystcraft Age and jump 5 tiers of Tech, you're only robbing yourself.

This is why I veiw dimension building as the ultimate end game tech (unless you have Mystcraft in a vacuum, just for flavor and lore). The potential for abuse is too tempting for most to be treated with any kind of reverence. If you have everything else, making a dimension to help make life easier is both no big deal and no consequence. When you use it as a basis to obtain things out of your reach, the scales of balance shift quickly.

Again, this is a personal preference. In my current pack, I have a strong Rotarycraft base with some other mods thrown in for personal convenience (Thermal Expansion, for one). I made myself a promise that all RF generation would be done via RoC Rotational Dynamo. Sure, I could use an Enervation Dynamo and feed it from the Redstone Agricraft Crops I have growing, but that wouldn't challenge me, so I avoided it. If others were to play my pack (not published), I wouldn't expect anyone else to have that level of restraint. Dimension building is a similar experience to me. Sure I can, but if life is too easy, I have nothing left to do to push myself toward creative genius.

To each their own.
 
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diehard586

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Jul 29, 2019
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I don't disagree at the basic level, but at some point you have to ask yourself what content you've actually depreived yourself of. If this is your tenth time through Blood Magic, and you avoided it until late game, then I don't feel you've missed out on anything by skipping the early grind by using an ocean of Life Essence. However, if the first thing you do in a world is to make an overpowered Mystcraft Age and jump 5 tiers of Tech, you're only robbing yourself.

This is why I veiw dimension building as the ultimate end game tech (unless you have Mystcraft in a vacuum, just for flavor and lore). The potential for abuse is too tempting for most to be treated with any kind of reverence. If you have everything else, making a dimension to help make life easier is both no big deal and no consequence. When you use it as a basis to obtain things out of your reach, the scales of balance shift quickly.

Again, this is a personal preference. In my current pack, I have a strong Rotarycraft base with some other mods thrown in for personal convenience (Thermal Expansion, for one). I made myself a promise that all RF generation would be done via RoC Rotational Dynamo. Sure, I could use an Enervation Dynamo and feed it from the Redstone Agricraft Crops I have growing, but that wouldn't challenge me, so I avoided it. If others were to play my pack (not published), I wouldn't expect anyone else to have that level of restraint. Dimension building is a similar experience to me. Sure I can, but if life is too easy, I have nothing left to do to push myself toward creative genius.

To each their own.
I worked blood magic entirelly manual, killing myself sometimes... now i got a lp generator with a well of suffering, a ocean of life essence is kinda too much... a fuel world is too much too but, it requires RF, sometimes lots of it... I surelly agree that the balance got shift really quickly, like 0 to 1 billion... In fact, i'm new in the RFTools, i've been testing lots of dimensions, in the future, some day, i'll create a new world with rules like you did, like limited RF usage, right now i'm on test phase, creating op worlds, i don't take it seriously, but ineed is quite op.
 

Inaeo

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Jul 29, 2019
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"With great power comes great responsibility."

I definitely went through a testing phase with both Mystcraft and RFTools dimensions. For me, Mystcraft was more of an art form. Creating a stable age with all the right bits and no extras was a massive change. On the server we played on, I was the man people went to see when they needed a new playground with specific terrain gen.

RFTools worlds were a bit more brute forced, on the other hand. A small Cursed Earth farm in the End to grind dimlets was all it took to get me all the pieces while I was either afk or working on a different project (infinite free RF, in my case). Then I just started making worlds I though would look cool. Without the threat of instability, I was free to explore those worlds without worry. Somewhere I have a file of all the combinations I used and my thoughts on the results. You know... For science.
One of my favorites. Jade Cliffs biome over Life Essence ocean. Glowstone tendrils in a forever night age. Got a random add in this one of Iron Golems spawning naturally, which was awesome.

 

Someone Else 37

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I made a dragon dimension a while back and posted a bunch of screenshots here. The jaded cliffs in yours are a very nice touch, I'd say- the sinusoidal hills in mine are just a bit too regular mathematical for a dimension with lakes and sky of fire and a swarm of matter-eating dragons.
 

diehard586

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
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"With great power comes great responsibility."

I definitely went through a testing phase with both Mystcraft and RFTools dimensions. For me, Mystcraft was more of an art form. Creating a stable age with all the right bits and no extras was a massive change. On the server we played on, I was the man people went to see when they needed a new playground with specific terrain gen.

RFTools worlds were a bit more brute forced, on the other hand. A small Cursed Earth farm in the End to grind dimlets was all it took to get me all the pieces while I was either afk or working on a different project (infinite free RF, in my case). Then I just started making worlds I though would look cool. Without the threat of instability, I was free to explore those worlds without worry. Somewhere I have a file of all the combinations I used and my thoughts on the results. You know... For science.
One of my favorites. Jade Cliffs biome over Life Essence ocean. Glowstone tendrils in a forever night age. Got a random add in this one of Iron Golems spawning naturally, which was awesome.

That dimension... Whoa, like umbral
 

Inaeo

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oo that is a gorgeous world.
Unfortunately, our Infinity server shut down shortly after making that dimension and breaking Blood Magic. Not that these things were necessarily related, really, but our.players had run their course and we're itching for something new. Since then, I've not had the chance to play with RFTools in a pack, so further experimentation will have to wait.
 

Inaeo

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Jul 29, 2019
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i have an question... what happen if i set a quarry in a dimension and unpower that dimension?
If properly chunkloaded and powered, it will allow you to tear a giant hole in the ground while not paying the maintenance costs for the dimension. I know there was a discussion at one point about how to prevent this exploit, but I'm not sure if it was actually fixed (or if fixing it was a reasonable goal).
 

Someone Else 37

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Feb 10, 2013
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If properly chunkloaded and powered, it will allow you to tear a giant hole in the ground while not paying the maintenance costs for the dimension. I know there was a discussion at one point about how to prevent this exploit, but I'm not sure if it was actually fixed (or if fixing it was a reasonable goal).
It was fixed- when a dimension runs out of power, all entities and tile entities in it stop working. As the power goes down, the sky darkens, players get increasingly nasty debuffs, and finally everything freezes and all non-Creative players without a particular item die instantly. The only way to survive there is with a charged Phased Field Generator on your hotbar, which will create a bubble around you where entities (but not blocks) will start working again.

If you visit a quarry in a frozen dimension, you'll find... a frozen quarry. There ain't no such thing as a free lunch.
 

Pyure

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Aug 14, 2013
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It was fixed- when a dimension runs out of power, all entities and tile entities in it stop working. As the power goes down, the sky darkens, players get increasingly nasty debuffs, and finally everything freezes and all non-Creative players without a particular item die instantly. The only way to survive there is with a charged Phased Field Generator on your hotbar, which will create a bubble around you where entities (but not blocks) will start working again.

If you visit a quarry in a frozen dimension, you'll find... a frozen quarry. There ain't no such thing as a free lunch.
Yeah, free lunch used to be a thing. Not so much anymore.

As a slightly-connected note, I was browsing through the rftools configs a couple days ago and noticed a switch that allows you to get teleported out of a powerless dimension instead of insta-killed. I actually turned that on because I've rage-quitted (well, gotten bored of) worlds where I've "deleted" a dimension, accidentally ported to it, and then lost my stuff. Wasn't fun.
 
B

Bell

Guest
Any mod that allows for custom dimensions will be innately overpowered. The option to build an entire world of fuel sources allows for any power requirements to be met after your first trip in, thereby devaluing the power requirements needed for future dimensions. Both Mystcraft and RFTools have different approaches to balance this, and thus distinct pros and cons when it comes to using them (for both casual and OP-grossness builds).

In the end, the responsibility lies with the player to have some self control. Some will use it to create the perfect setting for their base (some on servers do this to avoid griefers). Others will use is to absolutely break mod progression (ala, Life Essence Oceans to completely break Blood Magic). Others will use it as a quarry world and nothing else. Nobody is right or wrong to use it as they see fit. There is no way a mod developer can force players to play by some ethical code, not would most even if given the chance.

Any would-be pack designers would have to keep this in mind, and some (if not many) decide to disable the option from RFTools. The mod offers enough other content to justify its presence even without the dimensional aspect, so it's not cut completely. Others leave the option in, but tweak recipies to gate it into late game, where you likely don't need the boost it would provide normally.

If you see something completely out of whack, talk to the developer about it. I know @McJty has altered costs on some dimlets due to player feedback (Life Essence, in particular), and most of them are decent folk, so long as you're not a complete a-hole about it (some have less tolerance than others).

So far as a showcase goes, I love to see pictures of exotic locations and builds therein.
Since i am playing on FTB Infinity Evolved Expert mode and the dimension builder is REALLY ridiculously annoying to get, it is pretty well balanced, also since i got the well of suffering and an altar tier 6 before i even got the chance of making the dimension builder, a life essence ocean would be kinda useless because i am using blood magic mostly to move thaumcraft nodes around with the teleposers