Male/female pronouns

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keybounce

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Jul 29, 2019
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I make it a point to say the masculine pronoun unless notified otherwise. Many don't take offense, since the point of doing so is to not initially offend anyone.

Background: The discussion of "they" as singular, and issues with addressing unknown people came up in the RED thread. It doesn't belong there, so I'm posting here.

Using the male pronoun by default DOES offend. It is inherently problematic, because it sets up a "assumed male" effect.

Consider that a "poetess" is defined as "a female poet", and "poet" is "Someone who makes poetry". If you don't see an inherent flaw in that concept, then explain why "poetess" is not "someone who writes poetry", and "poet" is not "a male poetess".

Male by default hurts by making the females the oddball.
 

Lumaceon

Popular Member
Jul 23, 2014
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Tch, genre police drive me crazy sometimes. If I like the song, then I'll like the song, I don't need to jump through all these hoops to categorize it. Same with people. In both cases, I'll drop 'em in whatever category feels best until someone more qualified than I steps up and shows me a category that fits them better.
 

Celestialphoenix

Too Much Free Time
Nov 9, 2012
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Tartarus.. I mean at work. Same thing really.
Not everyone posts their gender on their profile. There is [was] 3 default avatars on the FTB forum {♂,♀, or ?} depending on what option you select.

If you feel the need to correct people, please don't- just use the right one and most people click and follow suit anyway.
 
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Brenn_

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Tch, genre police drive me crazy sometimes. If I like the song, then I'll like the song, I don't need to jump through all these hoops to categorize it. Same with people. In both cases, I'll drop 'em in whatever category feels best until someone more qualified than I steps up and shows me a category that fits them better.
Yup, this. ^

And in regards to the use of "they" or other (no offense intended) weird words as singular pronouns... I won't use them if I can avoid it (read: when not talking about them right in front of them).
"They" is a plural word. As someone who appreciates good grammar, I refuse to acknowledge it as a singular pronoun. (If you have some sort of multiple personality disorder, fine. Just not as a gender pronoun.)

To be completely honest, I'd be perfectly happy calling someone who dislikes "he/she" an "it." After all, "it" is a gender-neutral singular pronoun. The one issue is that people don't want to be called an "it." Of course, just using their name is also an option.

Edit: Notice my gender-neutral profile icon! (Which is like that because I never changed it, but whatever).
 

gold49

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Jul 29, 2019
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I try to use "they" when I do not know the gender of a person, partially just because I have run into less trouble using "they" than I have using default male, but also because "they" makes more sense to me when the gender is unknown. To me it would be like calling a object I do not know the name of "table", a noun for a specific object, rather than calling the unknown object "thing" or something on those lines. I do mess up sometimes and use default male, sometimes because I'm still in what I call my "writing mode" where I use the terms and language I would use in a paper rather than a conversation (for those wondering, atleast I was taught default male as "proper" in writing, no idea if that is limited to U.S. or is true in other places, but most teachers do count off) or I'm just not paying enough attention to notice.
I also think "it" is an offensive term for a human, as "it" is a term used for non-human objects and tends to imply that the speaker does not think of the person as human. Now I'm not going to correct anyone unless I know them and know they are simply saying the "wrong" term for the same reasons I normally do rather than them making a point to say it one way or another, as that is just a waste of effort in my experience to try and correct them.
 
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FyberOptic

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Jul 29, 2019
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As far as I'm aware/concerned "they" is a perfectly valid pronoun for anyone, whether you know their gender or not. It all depends on the use.

"It" on the other hand would be rather rude in just about any situation, especially if used towards a transgender individual.

Where I draw the line are xe/xem/xyr and any other terms that are part of this gender-neutral fad on college campuses. I saw some report on the news a while back of some ditzy college girl saying she feels more comfortable when people refer to her using gender-neutral pronouns, and it's one of those moments where all you can do is facepalm. The day that anyone insists I refer to them with those is the day I don't refer to them at all.
 

Pyure

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Aug 14, 2013
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"They" and "them" is annoying as hell as a neutral pronoun and i die a little every time I hear he or she say it.

But sometimes saying "he or she" just sounds lame, so: English sucks.

PS: Poet is fine as a gender-neutral term. So is any term that doesn't have a gender-explicit particle to it. Its fine to have "poetess" and such: people added it because it sounded nice.
 
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Strikingwolf

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Jul 29, 2019
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Personally I tend to use they or default he; however, I do find they as a singular pronoun strange, lets chart out english now

Singular | Plural
1st Person: I | We
2nd Person: You | You (pl.)
3rd Person: S/he/it/they? | They?

Now you have two repeats in the chart...that's just messy
 

Someone Else 37

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Feb 10, 2013
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Personally I tend to use they or default he; however, I do find they as a singular pronoun strange, lets chart out english now

Singular | Plural
1st Person: I | We
2nd Person: You | You (pl.)
3rd Person: S/he/it/they? | They?

Now you have two repeats in the chart...that's just messy
For reference, here's the same chart in Spanish:
Code:
            Singular                                            | Plural                 
1st Person: Yo                                                  | Nosotros
2nd Person: Tú                                                  | Vosotros (Spain) / Ustedes (Latin America)
3rd Person: Él (Male) / Ella (Female) / Usted (Formal, neutral) | Ellos (Male) / Ellas (Female) / Ustedes (Neutral)
No repeats used in Spain, at least, and only one in Latin America, so it's cleaner in that respect... which is not to say that Spanish doesn't have its own suite of problems, one of which being that all the verbs are conjugated differently depending on the what combination of these six pronouns cases and six or eight different tenses is used.
 

epidemia78

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Jul 29, 2019
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Political correct much? Even the most famous authors default to male pronouns, there needs to be a default otherwise we might as well just give up rational thought entirely and flap our arms around like monkeys.
 
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TomeWyrm

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Jul 29, 2019
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singular_they
https://motivatedgrammar.wordpress....ar-they-and-the-many-reasons-why-its-correct/
http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/words/he-or-she-versus-they
http://grammarist.com/usage/they/

In point of fact? That WAS the way "they", "them", "their", et cetera were used in the past, we're just reviving old usage in the face of a new problem.

You can honestly tell me "If your child needs a tutor, I can help them" is worse than "If your child needs a tutor, I can help hir"?

...

I still want to STAB people trying to invent new "hip" words for this kind of stuff. Xe/Hir/Ze/E? Need to go die in a fire. We STILL use plurals in many places as singulars, the usage just needs to ramp up. Even "the most famous authors" use they/them/their like that. Sure they use "his" or "her" more often, but generally as a differentiation tactic.
 
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