Equivalent Exchange

[Tabu]

Some people liked EE the way it was. Those people have this quality known as restraint... They don't exploit something because it can be done... Those people unfortunately get screwed over because there are those who cannot help themselves then cry about it...

I seriously wish I could create a mod that would explode your monitor when ever someone mentions OP or Balance... It has become more ridiculous than any other useless meme on the internet...

 

[Wabbit]

I really don;'t think opinions or assumptions should be made on things we know little to nothing about just yet. EE, since the beginning has struggled with balance, I remember back in the EE1 days, using a machine no bigger than 3x3x3 blocks, I could turn one cobble into 9 diamonds. EE2 came, balanced things up a little but it's still way overpowered. I don't think much of EE3 from what I've heard. Wires, power sources, all of that just seems like it's perching itself on IC2 territory. While this may not be an issue per say, it makes me think of how far EE's come from it's routes. Equivalent Exchange's ultimate goal is as it says on the tin, something for another of equal value. Shifting things around in wires, power sources... I'm just not seeing that.

But hey, for all I know this could be the best step for EE to date. As I said, it's unfair to give opinion at the present time.

Some people liked EE the way it was. Those people have this quality known as restraint... They don't exploit something because it can be done... Those people unfortunately get screwed over because there are those who cannot help themselves then cry about it...

I seriously wish I could create a mod that would explode your monitor when ever someone mentions OP or Balance... It has become more ridiculous than any other useless meme on the internet...

In an ideal world I'd agree completely, but unfortunately, coming from a server admin, you have to realize people aren't fundamentally made of awesome and are in fact lazy, if you allow them to use the mod, you open yourself up to people exploiting it's inbalanced features and if you enforce the challenge by disabling EE for example, all you do is lose traffic and lose the values of restraint by not allowing them to show it. You really can't please people.

As for Tekkit being similar to FTB, I really have to say no. Gameplay wise it's MUCH more of a challenge. You're literally feeding the mechanical beast. You're constantly wondering where your next materials are coming from as opposed to just piping things out of a condenser or relying on good old Mr Sun for power. Have you seen the recipe for Ultimate Hybrid Solar Panels? Freaking Crazy! I love it! But's not as much of a jaw drop as High Voltage Solar Arrays which you could either dupe out with a glitch or just pull out the materials from a condenser.

You get your hands dirty and I adore that about FTB. I also appreciate the way it's handled. Tekkit was cold. It had no life to it and it was thrown together with only half of the permissions for the mods they provided. FTB both has permission and donates to the modders

 

[Flip]

Some people liked EE the way it was. Those people have this quality known as restraint... They don't exploit something because it can be done... Those people unfortunately get screwed over because there are those who cannot help themselves then cry about it...

I seriously wish I could create a mod that would explode your monitor when ever someone mentions OP or Balance... It has become more ridiculous than any other useless meme on the internet...

Balance and restrictions are essential to any game. If you ignore those issues, you don't have a game; you have a sandbox. Which is fine, but just because you like sandboxes, don't hate on people who expect a game.

Plus, EE did have a sense of balance. But how many people just played EE? Very few. EE's balance wasn't tuned with quarries and massfabs and other mods in mind. It's unreasonable to expect a modder, creating something in his or her sparetime, to balance their mod against an unknown number of other mods.

We all love that the Forge mods can work together very well, and we can create amazing things by using them in tandem. But just because they can work together, it doesn't mean that they must work together. I personally believe that FTB (the modpack, not the map/gamemode) would be better served by installing only Forge by default and forcing players to opt-in to the supported mods. Otherwise there's almost no distinction between mods in the pack and people expect the pack as a whole to have a sense of balance when that is an unreasonable expectation.

 

[majilikin]

In my opinion, I really don't think that EE should be in feed the beast. Feed the beast is very similar to Tekkit, but better in my opinion, because at the moment, FTB doesn't have EE. Equivalent Exchange, makes the game WAY to easy. All you need is a condenser and the game is finished. There is no challenge. You don't have to go looking for materials etc, you just condense them. It takes away the point of farming food if you can just get energy collector, get a bunch of diamonds, and just turn them into steaks. I know people will say 'Don't use it then', but I will, of course I will. It makes it easier, we all know how pissed off we can get with minecraft when we find two diamonds in a cave, and you desperately need that one more to make a pickaxe. Although it's annoying, it's a challenge! Minecraft is too easy with EE. Plus on servers if you don't want to use EE, there's nothing stopping somebody else using them.

Am I the only one who thinks this? Because all my friends disagree with me D: But do I at least have a point?

I agree with you, however, the mass amounts of resources(i.e. tin, copper, coal) makes it extremely difficult to do anything like biofuel because the cells are used up in the process. This is also true with nuclear reactors because 1 100k coolant cell cost about 1 stack of tin, witch is difficult (sometimes) to acquire that much.

 

[thejoshknight]

I have always and always will refuse to play on servers with EE disabled. I understand why it is, but it is a integral part of the game in my view. I would rather people have OP gear and materials than nothing at all.

So yeah, you are right, you do lose traffic.

 

[IndustriousPortal]

I think, if you want EE, goto tekkit. If you don't want it, goto FTB. Simple!

 

[SilvasRuin]

IndustriousPortal, that's... just no. FTB will be including EE3 once EE3 is actually released (more than just open source test builds). It will be in the pack used for the challenge map, and will assuredly be in the Magic and Universal packs as well. The only pack it's truly unlikely to wind up in, as far as what the FTB team is assembling, is the Technology pack.

 

[Bibble]

I think, if you want EE, goto tekkit. If you don't want it, goto FTB. Simple!

I'd say more that if you want EE, go with 1.2.5, if you want 1.4.X, then you need to be patient for EE.

People's arguments regarding balance and it being taken out is that it causes issues with a lot of the percieved "advantages" of other mods, allowing for a feedback loop and infinite resources. For example, the blaze rod > macerator > collector loop is quite profitable, and is a quirk between the macerator being touted as more efficient than simply crafting, and EE being equivalent to crafting. That single loop allows for a VERY rapid collection of EMC, and, therefore, resources without any significant efforts.

There are a number of other things like that, too.

 

[Zelfana]

Yeah, cross-mod exploits are something that need to be sorted before they get added. Although there are a couple in already, namely igneous extruder making cobblestone for free and recyclers accepting that and being able to run themselves with the scrap burning in a generator. A lower fuel value on scrap would fix that without making cobblestone blacklisted scrap material even though that is also possible.