Does anybody have any info on Thermal Dynamics?
- Thread starter asb3pe
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When i first started playing 1.7 modded minecraft I was dissapointed in the lack of TE pipes as well. Now after using the Ender IO conduits and pipes I don't see myself using TE pipes ever again. TE has to make some huge changes to be on te same level as Ender IO and I don't see it happening. I could be wrong, who knows... will just ave to wait and see.
The only real change I'd like to see in TD is to stop stuffing pipes. If that means I can only use the teleporting pipes, so be it, but we've had enough (admittedly STUPID) builds where stuffed itemducts appeared to cause problems that I'm more on board with EnderIO's item conduits (and tesseracts) than I ever expected to be. Because I don't like the look of them and I really don't like all in one block piping. It's too much like cheating on design. 
That's easier said than done with pipes that don't do instant transmission. Try setting up a system using buildcraft pipes to do it (with a gate on both ends and red pipe wire connecting them). I'm suggesting using buildcraft here because it's where I first ran into the problem.
No matter how fast your pipes are, if there is anything in transit when your check occurs, you will end up with a stuffing or spewing problem. It becomes seriously nasty on long runs. Say your juicer frees up a slot for an apple and your logic sees that. An apple gets pulled from Storage Unit A and starts the (Y) second transit to the juicer. Your logic has to know that, and has to account for additional losses. It can't just be on the sending side, and it can't just be 'oh, there's space now, send something'. You have to also be aware of items in transit.
And that might be standard practice for current item transfer pipes, but 1.6 itemducts didn't do it (or did something else also), as evidenced by the number of times I'd see '64 stuffed x' 5 or 6 times on a single input
In any Minecraft item transport method, you have to have one of the following three features:
1. Instant transportation
2. Infinite backstuffing
3. Items spilling on the ground
Take your pick! You can have both 2 and 3, if you want. I guess "items traversing back and forth infinitely" is another option, but I'd say that's a sub-type of backstuffing. Also, items being destroyed when there are too many in the pipe is another option, but I don't think that it's a sufficiently popular one to be worth listing.
CMIIW, I'd be interested to hear of a method that avoids all three of these features.
1. Instant transportation
2. Infinite backstuffing
3. Items spilling on the ground
Take your pick! You can have both 2 and 3, if you want. I guess "items traversing back and forth infinitely" is another option, but I'd say that's a sub-type of backstuffing. Also, items being destroyed when there are too many in the pipe is another option, but I don't think that it's a sufficiently popular one to be worth listing.
CMIIW, I'd be interested to hear of a method that avoids all three of these features.
There probably is a #4, but I can't imagine that it's computationally efficient for anything larger than a straight pipe and small transits.
If every pipe network contained an in-transit list (source inventory, destination inventory, items/count), then the list could be vetted for items in transit to ensure that adding a new item to the pipe wouldn't overfill the remote end. That is almost assuredly outside the realm of reasonable, however, and I'm fine with instant transmission as a better real-world solution.
Actually, I did lie earlier. There's one other thing I want. I want it to be POSSIBLE but not REQUIRED to upgrade every duct to the next tier. If I want to make HyperEnergeticDuctsOfAwesome, there should be a recipe to do it directly, and there should also be a recipe to upgrade my WhoaTheseLeadstoneDuctsAreSlow up to that level, because I really hate the point in gameplay where I have to upgrade from Hardened to Redstone. Also not particularly fond of upgrading each step of the machine frames from hardened to resonant (at least I can make hardened directly)
I think that's how Logistics Pipes does it. If the destination is full for some reason then it will send the item to the default destination. If that is also full it will spill it.
Yea I also hate it when I have a bunch of useless Hardened Energy Conduits laying around. But you can pulverize them to get some of the materials back.
Fine until the player (or another item transport mod, or a vanilla hopper) fills the destination chest with cobblestone, then the items in transit have nowhere to end up ('cos he ran over to the source chest and filled that up as well). Welcome to backstuff-or-spill territory!
Personally I don't see why any piping system has to be overly intelligent, surely that's down to the player to learn how to make an efficient and intelligent design?
If a mod is doing the work, just what is the player actually doing? I see too often mods adding features that eliminate the puzzle/engineering aspect of builds.
Regarding EnderIO, it would be nice if there was a config option to stop having different conduits in the same block space, this brings back the "engineering puzzle" to builds for those of us who like that sort of thing. That's also partly why I'm frowning at the TD duct that allows both item and energy transport in the same block space. That kinda goes against the grain and the term "minecrafty".
If a mod is doing the work, just what is the player actually doing? I see too often mods adding features that eliminate the puzzle/engineering aspect of builds.
Regarding EnderIO, it would be nice if there was a config option to stop having different conduits in the same block space, this brings back the "engineering puzzle" to builds for those of us who like that sort of thing. That's also partly why I'm frowning at the TD duct that allows both item and energy transport in the same block space. That kinda goes against the grain and the term "minecrafty".
At what cost to friends and servermates? At what cost to time lost because of unforseen issues, or because it's difficult to estimate the actual rate of production? How many times does InEfficient McMistakeson get to bring the server's tickrate down to OMGICAN'TMOVE before you kick him off the server for being a jerk?
I know I'd have been blacklisted quite a few times for trying to setup automated systems where production eventually (or suddenly) grew to outpace usage by an amount that was I couldn't foresee. (The exploding charcoal menace a few years ago...whew...that one alone should have gotten me banned from minecraft permanently...)
So..yeah. I'll be happy with piping/ducting systems that help protect my friends/my server from my oversights, because, ya know, I make (lots) of mistakes.
I have my enderio piping system run on priority settings and with a trash can as destination with a -1 on priority so items that can't find a destination will go into the void.
For my BC system, the trash can is set at the end of the line with diamond / iron / clay pipes before it for sorting purposes. All overflow ends up in the trashcan.
With the amount of mods nowadays, there is zero excuses for item spillage. IMHO anyway.
P.S. I have replaced almost all of my Trashcans with Thaumcraft's Advanced Alchemical Furnace now.
For my BC system, the trash can is set at the end of the line with diamond / iron / clay pipes before it for sorting purposes. All overflow ends up in the trashcan.
With the amount of mods nowadays, there is zero excuses for item spillage. IMHO anyway.
P.S. I have replaced almost all of my Trashcans with Thaumcraft's Advanced Alchemical Furnace now.
I personally love the ducts in 1.6.4 and used them for most things. In 1.7.10 no more ducts OK time to find a new way of doing things. Then there came enderio I like the fact that I can put multiple pipes in one block. Hides things very well. That being said I hate that I can put multiple pipes in one block. Tring to trouble shoot when things go wrong and I have 4 pipes in one block its like nuclear fission when all you do all day is trim hedges. I played with mods from 1.2.5 where automation became buildcraft and industrialcraft and looping items back so lil to no spillage. On a server I was playing ender io wasn't fully updated and that's what my power gen was and moving power to machines. Thermal expansion machines would connect to the conduits and accept power. Well I could do it if I had thermal dynamics but that's too easy if it was out. I had forgot mfr has recent cables the power ones. Well I hadn't used them since 1.5.2 and with them I came up with a nice work around and had more than one goto mod to accomplish the task I wanted. I believe the multiple pipes in one block its nice but its too simple. And it really doesn't have the minecraft feel like a few others have said. Even now the only time I really use them in the same block is to travel a great distance between 2 sources. Once there split off and go to correct side for power item liquid and such. This is all my opinion and I like enderio and thermal expansion and I will not replace one with the other. I will probably keep both once thermal dynamics comes out and use them together some how. I can wait until @King Lemming and the rest of the team working on the mod decide that its done and ready for the public. I appropriate their work and hope they keep giving us great mods.
Agreed, it doesn't much to put a trashcan somewhere in any pipe system to ensure that is always a valid destination. If your resources get destroyed, then you learn what went wrong. As least you are not killing your world with dropped entities.
It's not like you can't get more resources from somewhere else, pretty much everything is renewable.
Side note: Railcraft's Void Chest also deletes items, but much slower than void pipes and trash cans- only a few per second. Doesn't help much, of course, if your quarry is overflowing with cobblestone, but certainly could keep you from losing some very valuable resources if you drop, say, a Gravisuit or a pseudo-inversion sigil in the wrong place when your "miscellaneous junk" chest is full.
I kind of want to set up a system that waits, say, a minute after an item lands in a "to be voided" chest before actually deleting it, but will delete the entire contents of the chest in short order afterward, as well as any more items that land in it within ten seconds or so. And as always, if that buffer chest somehow fills, any overflow will go straight into a trash can.
I kind of want to set up a system that waits, say, a minute after an item lands in a "to be voided" chest before actually deleting it, but will delete the entire contents of the chest in short order afterward, as well as any more items that land in it within ten seconds or so. And as always, if that buffer chest somehow fills, any overflow will go straight into a trash can.
That's what I tend to do myself, an overflow chest/buffer followed by trash can. I usually filter the chest so the common crud won't overflow into there. In an ideal setup, that chest will always be empty, but you never know what will happen....
Before XU and the compressed cobblestones, back in 1.4.7, I'll have a diamond pipe very early in the pipe line connected to a void pipe. And in the filter I will have cobblestone, dirt, gravel and maybe sand filtered to send to the void as soon as they are mined. Then the rest of the quarried blocks are sent to my base via an Ender Chest. Back at base, using RP system, items will be sent for processing before forwarded to barrels (factorization barrels). There will be a few diamond chests, before the chest that has a wooden pipe connect to a void pipe, to pick up stuffs that doesn't fit into the barrels (or overflows as the barrels are full).