Big Reactor Rotor question.

Discussion in 'Mod Discussion' started by Succubism, Aug 10, 2014.

  1. Loufmier

    Loufmier New Member

    what you've said is true for small reactors with low reactivity, however if we're to take a bigger reactor:
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    however with addition of recipe for cyanite this discussion is kinda pointless.
     
  2. Skyqula

    Skyqula New Member

    Ah, your using a 2x2 center. swapping to active cooling has an effect for you because radiation is above 100%. When using a single rod going up radiation never increases and therefor swapping to active cooling has no effect. Likewise, using coolants has no effect on fuel consumption either. Allowing a tall 1 rod reactor to produce a decent amount of power while generating the cyanite. So it realy becomes a question of: Do I want to rush a turbine and make cyanite with its crafting recipy. Or do I start of with a simple reactor as my initial powersource and start producing that cyanite early on.
     
  3. Loufmier

    Loufmier New Member

    well it's not only because core is 2x2 but it's also because it's 7 block tall. when i tried a 2x2x2 both reactors had same irradiation level(100%), so i assume if 1x1 is tall enough the coolant port will also have effect on it.

    with added cyanite recipe i'm sure that active cooled reactor will be more popular, because with enough steel, yellorium, and coil material one can easily skip passive-cooled reactor or cyanite gen stage.
     
  4. MigukNamja

    MigukNamja New Member

    Agreed. I'd like to see either a smaller max. size or diminishing returns on reactor sizes. The purpose would be to discourage building simply 1 gigantic reactor and calling it done.

    Rather, one should be encouraged to get better materials and/or build other multiblocks, such as the turbine. For example:

    Reactor : Optimal size is 7x7x3 external. Max. size before diminishing returns in efficiency (power output) or critical (melt-down) heat levels is around 9x9x9. Or, better yet, max. size is number of rods, rather than external size. Max. power is around 5K RF/t, and only obtainable with Blutonium components. Current yellowrite components max. would be around 1K RF/t.

    Turbine : Optimal size is 11x11x5 external. Max. size is 14x9x9 external. Current blade recipe max. power would be around 10K RF/t. 2nd tier blades with more expensive components such as blutonium would net around 20K RF/t.

    Cyanite re-processor : Up the power requirement significantly. Blutonium required for progression to tier 2.

    Yellorium default spawn rate : Make it less common (more rare). Make MFR Laser yellorium more rare, requiring the turbine to be net positive. Roughly speaking, self-sustaining should only be a late-game rather than mid-game strategy. Early and mid-game should require manual mining, quarrying, etc.,.

    Just to be clear, I love the mod, and I can't disagree with the strategy in the alpha/beta stage of making default configs and recipes easier rather than harder. It will get more playtime that way.
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2014
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  5. Skyqula

    Skyqula New Member

    No, a single rod (no matter how tall) will never go above 100% radiation because there is no other source of radiation to radiate it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2014
  6. MigukNamja

    MigukNamja New Member

    Oh, you mean like this ?

    Sorry, I don't find IC2 reactors to be interesting at all. When you have to run a Java app. outside of the game to simulate a reactor design in-game, then craft 40+ components to build it, that's more tedious / copy/paste then creative. Plus, when 99% of people use the above IC2 thread to create their reactor, that's not very creative, either.

    What you've *completely* missed is that BigReactor is a very flexible mod and when paired with MineTweaker, you can fit into different mod-packs completely differently. How BigReactors plays in AgS vs. InfiTech vs. RR vs. others is vastly different. In InfiTech, for instance, there is no cryo, nor even liquid ender, nor MFR. So, all the spreadsheets for optimal reactor and turbine designs are mostly useless. And, with the increased recipe costs, you have to get creative to eek out every last bit of power from your Yellorium.

    Sorry, but I find your tone to be a bit off-putting. You come in here acting as if you know everything about the mod when you're actually limited by your own lack of creativity.
     
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  7. Skyqula

    Skyqula New Member

    Ill take a gues: graphite instead of cryotheum and diamond blocks instead of resonant ender. Am I close? :D
     
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  8. Loufmier

    Loufmier New Member

    what about platinum/shiny metal blocks? they seem to be pretty good as coolant and coil material.
     
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  9. GreenZombie

    GreenZombie New Member

    If someone with wiki skills can find a better home for this please do. But I made a table of the coolant properties by examining the BR code:
     
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  10. MigukNamja

    MigukNamja New Member

    Yes, these sound about right.

    Sweet !!

    I don't understand what the column headers mean in terms of BR, but I'll take a stab at how they are used:

    Absorption - Between fuel rods and the reactor walls ?
    Heat Efficiency - ???
    Moderation - Between the fuel rods ?
    Thermal Conductivity - Coils ?

    If so, that would mean Tartarite is the most efficient coil material, right ? But, this also means diamond blocks are just as good as Enderium Blocks for coil material...odd.
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2014
  11. Loufmier

    Loufmier New Member

    i have no idea what others do but,i highly doubt that thermal conductivity has any relation to coils. and unless there is some conspiracy involved, it means what it says - it's ability to transfer heat, presumably from rods to casing.
     
  12. GreenZombie

    GreenZombie New Member

    Never graphite. Its worse than almost anything except water an air.[DOUBLEPOST=1408453511][/DOUBLEPOST]
    Thermal conductivity relates to the factor of the heat in a fuel rod that will be exchanged, from the adjacent face, into the reactor interior.
     
  13. MigukNamja

    MigukNamja New Member

    OK, so...which columns relates to coils...or are none of them for coils ?
     
  14. GreenZombie

    GreenZombie New Member

    None. Sadly. I havn't created a table for the coil data. I suppose I should :p But I'd really prefer to see it in a proper home. Not sure which wiki, and what format to make the page proper which is why this is stalled as my talk page.
     
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  15. MigukNamja

    MigukNamja New Member

    Ah, OK. That makes sense. Many thanks for the reactor data so far.
     
  16. Skyqula

    Skyqula New Member

    False <3 Its above pyrotheum and enderium blocks. Best part? ^^ Water = air > resonant ender :D (We are talking about between cores here) The reason Graphite is so good is it lets nearly all radiation trough to fertilize other rods while at the same time having a high chance to slow down fast radiation. :)
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2014
  17. rhn

    rhn Too Much Free Time

    As far as I understand it:

    Absorption - Chance that slow radiation is absorbed and turned into heat that can then be turned into RF/steam. You want this high between the rods and casing, but not between rods.
    Heat Efficiency - Base multiplier to the power/steam produced. You want as high as possible everywhere.
    Moderation - Chance that fast radiation is turned into slow radiation that can then be absorbed.(Fast radiation cannot be absorbed and will simply vanish out the side of the reactor). You want this between the rods and casing, not sure between the rods.
    Thermal Conductivity - Rate of which heat from the core can be transmitted to the reactor casing, and thereby produce RF/steam. Majority of power/steam is being made by heat reaching the casing(imagine the inside of the casing being lined with "piezoelectric elements"/"water heat exchanger"), better conductive materials means more heat reaches the casing = more power/steam. Therefore "cooling material" is a bad name to use as it somewhat wrongly implies that you need to get rid of excess heat, use "conductive material" instead. You want this as high as possible everywhere.
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2014
  18. GreenZombie

    GreenZombie New Member

    Absorbtion and Heat Efficienty have to do with RF (and steam?) generation by "Absorbption" - one of three methods of RF generation in a passive reactor.
    A Radiation packet is emitted in a cardinal direction, and travels 4 blocks. On each block:

    absorbed_radiation = input_radiation * (1- hardness) * absorption
    remaining_radiation = input_radiation - absorbed_radiation
    rf_generated = absorbed_radiation * heat_efficiency.
    hardness=input_hardness/moderation

    The amount of RF generated in a block is absorbtion*heat_efficiency*radiation

    high moderation is beneficial everywhere, including between rods, as fast/hard radiation does not fertilize. Actually, the only thing you _really_ want between fuel rods is another fuel rod as that means 0% of the available radiation has been absorbed and thus all of it is available for fertilization. "Sadly", if a fuel rod is too enclosed by other fuel rods, it can't shed heat, so some "holes" need to be made in the reactor core for the purpose of allowing it to ... shed heat into the reactor environment where it can generate RF via the other mechanism(s) and keep the fuel rods cool, thereby keeping hardness down.

    Heat is not modeled from block to block. High thermal conductivity is only required on coolant blocks that are directly adjacent to a fuel rod.

    --
    I have added coil part parameters to http://wiki.technicpack.net/User_talk:Farproc
    Have no idea what they mean.
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2014
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  19. MadTinkerer

    MadTinkerer New Member

    First off, no need to apologize. I fully expect it from hanging around these forums. My experience has been if you challenge anything that is popular or even mildly criticize something then there is always someone who will attack you for it. It comes with having an opinion, so I'm not fussed.

    Anyway, I would still stand by the point that the IC2 reactors are definitely much more interesting and challenging than the Big Reactors. There are far more permutations for power setup based on materials at hand as well as different fuel types and power needs. The constant looming threat of a critical meltdown as well as the complexity of automating these devices is something that I find entertaining. To me big reactors are boring because they are "too easy". I'm also not a fan of RF generation in general because of this, particularly the Thermal Expansion mod which I find mundane and boring. So that's me, I don't like e-z mode and I don't like not being presented with difficult choices.

    I suppose your point about mod packs is valid, but one could easily make the claim for any type of system or mod. IC2 reactors play vastly different if you're playing with Gregtech and some magical mods like Thaumcraft are a pain in the arse if you're playing a skyblock pack. I didn't miss that point at all, I just didn't consider it as pertinent to my opinion, because you can always find a modpack that makes a statement an exception to the rule.

    The only thing that I would say is, I'm certainly very creative, particularly when it comes to solving problems. The reason why this one particular mod isn't my cup of tea is because there is nothing to solve. You would have to actually work at badly screwing up a big reactor design, like putting sludge or milk in the reactor as coolant - even then it would actually work, just not as good.

    If that's your cup of tea, then fine, but it's not mine and my "tone" I think reflects that and nothing more. Aesthetically, I like the mod quite a bit, and it's certainly a more interesting way to generate RF than the TE machines, but then again that's damning praise at the best.
     
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  20. MigukNamja

    MigukNamja New Member

    Different strokes for different folks. Obviously not your cup and of tea and I wouldn't expect you to be convinced otherwise.

    However, it's one thing to claim *you* aren't finding ways of being creative vs. the mod limiting creativity universally. Clearly, others are finding creative ways of using the mod, such as as tinkering with different designs with different design goals and material constraints.

    Sound familiar ?
     

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